Trouble with adoration

[lynnehelen]

I posted about my problem with cynicism, I’m cross-posting here between Moral Theology and Spirituality, someone in Moral Theology just helped me to understand that this is one of the problems–taking Him for granted. For instance, I was a chorus member in the rock opera Jesus Christ Superstar after a difficult experience graduating from high school, the summer before going to college. I was confused enough already. I dated the actor who was playing Jesus, who was a bit older, and double-dated with a female friend in the cast who was dating the man, also a bit older than most of us, who was playing Judas. This was the very late 70’s. Things were going on amongst the older members of the cast that I would not want to go into here. They were actors. The man who was playing Jesus was auditioning for a role in a Hollywood film and had had a few bit parts in soaps. It was a local, non-profit suburban theatre production.

This has given me confusion throughout my life. For instance, when I became ill and went to a long-term hospital, I was very confused in my mind and an older man who thought he was a missionary (and maybe he was)–he was Spanish-speaking–said, so you’re the girlfriend of Jesus Christ. This created a whole semi-delusional complex–a fantasy I couldn’t break out of–that has plagued me ever since, causing confusion in me as a mother–less so recently.

What is the value of “Jesus Christ Superstar”? It was my first experience of the gospel and as such has value for me. But maybe I took in some other things along with it, even apart from the problem of “dating” the man who played Jesus (in a Christian production nobody would have done that I would guess, that actor would have been hands-off)–that weren’t spiritually proper or correct or True is what I’m trying to say.

Also, I wanted to ask about Mel Gibson’s “The Passion of the Christ.” Similar problem. When I pray the Sorrowful Mysteries on the Rosary, (I am just learning), my inner vision of my Lord and Saviour is blocked by the graphic images from the film, and I am especially troubled by seeing the face of the actress who played the Virgin Mary, when I try to pray to the real one, less so recently.

Again, there is a breeding of familiarity through this film, which I know was hotly debated when it came out, which, although so breathtaking, can’t but diminish the real Jesus.

I think somewhere inside the Truth and Sanctity of my Lord Jesus Christ is protected, and not corrupted, (He is incorruptible, I trust), but for these and other reasons I have very serious trouble with adoration.

The Divine Mercy Chaplet helps the most, I think the person who suggested that I focus on St. Faustina rather than St. Therese’s “little way” was on target for many reasons, although I am attending to both instead!

 

[lynnehelen]

Then there was the Willem Defoe movie in the '80’s depicting Christ having sexual fantasies about Mary Magdalen ON THE CROSS.

My trouble in high school was that my father had tried to touch me. Before that, I was necessarily extremely chaste and pure because of an injury (my brother had kneed me in the crotch when I was little.) After that I wrote a paper for a Theology class in response to an assignment to artistically render your personal idea of God. My paper started, “In God, the Lord, Our Father, I have no belief,” and was accompanied by artwork from my imagination. It’s a long story. The point is, in all honesty I still get confused sometimes if I think about it, it used to come on me and then go again when I was raising my son–fantasies about some special religious significance to being, in a sense, a virgin mother, in that I couldn’t really experience sexuality, although the father was altogether human and real of course, and what that meant about me and my son. Nothing, obviously. I am just a damaged woman with a tale of woe.

If you could help me sort this out you would be doing me a very big favor.

Obviously I have watched a lot of movies and, before that, I used to read a lot of very silly fictional literature, so I have some legitimate trouble with grounding in reality.

 

[TriciaF]

Don’t worry too much, lynnehelen.
The past is past.
God forgave you all the things you repented and asks you to forgive others.
We can only live in the present moment.
God accepts the person who you are now in the present moment.
If we analyze the past too much we get in a mess.
Today is where you are right now.

 

[runningdude]

I personally enjoyed Jesus Christ, Superstar as a piece of artwork.

I also hope you won’t worry about picturing Jesus with the face of the actor you dated, or Mary withe face of the actress the Passion of the Christ. No one alive, save those in heaven, know our Lord’s or His mother’s appearance.

Many men and women have posed as models for holy subjects for art pieces. It is OK to image their faces when picturing Jesus or Mary in prayer.

I hope you find peace.

RD

 

[Cryptic1]

Most people do not consider themselves cynical in the least, so there is possibly something in your past which makes you see the world the way you do.

While you say you have an issue with the fact that you dated an actor who portrayed Jesus and that you see in your mind’s eye the graphic image of Jesus (from the movie, the Passion) while in prayer, is it possible that the real issue is not Jesus but the issue of your father crossing the line in your father daughter relationship? When your father sinned against you (you did not sin), he started a chain of events that appears to have affected all other relationships, possibly even your self worth.

Your father’s sin is a big one in the world’s view and it’s possible that deep down you know that too. There needs to be a lot of open dialogue and forgivness in order for you to be free from, for instance, these visualizations of Jesus and Mary in your head. Sin can destroy, but forgivness and God’s kind of love can heal.

I don’t know if you’ve forgiven your father for his sin against you and if you haven’t, then you might consider doing so now. Jesus commanded us to forgive others, because in doing so, we would be set free from the chains of condemnation and guilt.

God bless you on your journey. There is light at the end and His name is Jesus.

 

[lynnehelen]

When your father sinned against you (you did not sin), he started a chain of events that appears to have affected all other relationships, possibly even your self worth.

Your father’s sin is a big one in the world’s view and it’s possible that deep down you know that too. There needs to be a lot of open dialogue and forgivness in order for you to be free from, for instance, these visualizations of Jesus and Mary in your head. Sin can destroy, but forgivness and God’s kind of love can heal.

I don’t know if you’ve forgiven your father for his sin against you and if you haven’t, then you might consider doing so now. Jesus commanded us to forgive others, because in doing so, we would be set free from the chains of condemnation and guilt.

God bless you on your journey. There is light at the end and His name is Jesus.

Thank you, that’s what I needed to hear, that “I DID NOT SIN” in the matter between my father and I. He won’t acknowledge that he sinned, and he has power over my mind. When I found out about the clinical interpretation of his mother’s beatng him with a fire poker as a child–physical effects–I was able to truly forgive and see past him to …everything but this is new, I hope I can get past his blocking efforts, he is so old now, and doesn’t want to have to change how he has viewed me, my mother, himself, etc.

All my psychologist could say was that “it does something to you.” I felt filthy and corrupted. Just like any other sexually abused girl. I’m getting it, even as I type. Thank you.

God Bless you.
Jesus, Jesus, Jesus

 

[lynnehelen]

He has persisted in his sin against me ALL THESE YEARS, denying that it was what it was–a simple case of sexual abuse. Although I was 17, I was a child in my mind. It only helps me be more ready to forgive him to understand this–as I said, his mother beat him with a metal fire poker when he was a child. I found out this could even have given him seizures–but he had to function anyway, and my mother didn’t help.

Thank you for clearing that up about JCSuperstar–I thought it was beautiful too, just clouded because of the background issues. The guy who played Jesus was awesome–they all were–it was a really spectacular production for a little local metropolitan theatre effort.

Like I said–you can’t imagine how much this helps.

Bless all of you.

 

[louisak]

When I pray the Sorrowful Mysteries on the Rosary, (I am just learning), my inner vision of my Lord and Saviour is blocked by the graphic images from the film, and I am especially troubled by seeing the face of the actress who played the Virgin Mary, when I try to pray to the real one, less so recently.

I agree with the others who have said there is nothing to be concerned about here. The church poses images of Christ and the saints for us to contemplate. In icons, in statues, even the pictures on holy cards, we are shown artists’ renditions of the faces of these holy ones. The image of an actor in a film is a bit different, in the emotional impact it has on us, but the underlying principle is the same - it is an artistic depiction. Unlike the Muslims, we are not forbidden to depict the holy people in visual media.

I am so saddened to learn about what your father did to you. I am praying for you too.