Truth Unimportant?

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aridite

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What do you say to someone who says they don’t care about truth? An acqaintance says he is not interested in trying to figure out which is the True Church, that he knows Jesus by reading his Bible and praying alone, and he is happy (and sure of his salvation). If he feels like he needs more than his Bible, he goes to a friend’s non-denominational church and gets emotionally recharged. But, the question of which denomination is right or truest, he says, is unimportant.

He just blinks hollowly when I say that the Catholic Church is the one Jesus founded and it has the whole, complete Gospel as handed onto the Apostles.

I’m not sure if he thinks none have the complete truth (since if that were the case, it would have eclipsed the others, attracting the most sincere believers) or that we just can never know whether any of them are true. He seems to be saying both.

Any help? Has anyone encountered this before?
 
I think his beleifs simpley differ form your own. This si common.

I beleive he is simpley of the mind that the ri is an " Invisible chruhc of all beleivers" and htat spaciific denomenaitons do not martter. This is a common hought outside of centrist Chtuhes. In this way slavation si explaiend withouthteneed for Chruch memmbership in a spacific one, thus not invalidatign other CHruches. So long as you have faiht in Jesus ( And the vast majority are Sola Fide) and have been born again you are svaed. The HCurhc is fellwoship and learning of the word. It snot however rleevant which oen yoyu attend since he is you rpersonal Lord and Saviour.

Its not so muchthat he rejects the idea of truth, btu that he beleives the turht isnt foudnin ad enomenaiton, but in Gods word. Oncd you understand this approach, you will be able to comuncate better with him your grievences.
 
Give him Scott Hahn’s books in succession and watch his conversion take place.
 
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aridite:
But, the question of which denomination is right or truest, he says, is unimportant.
Suppose this man were to decide to become an airplane pilot. There are two aviation schools in town - one that teaches proper flight technique, and one that just makes up stuff as they go along. At the end of this instruction, this man will find himself behind the controls of an airplane. Depending on his choice of instruction, he will either soar among the clouds or burn at the end of the runway.

Of course, he’s gonna choose the school that teaches the truth about flying! So if he would make such a resonable decision to safeguard his mortal life (which will end eventually, no matter what), why would he not do the same to safeguard his immortal life, which will *never *end?

Truth matters in little things (like flying an airplane). It matters in big things (like the state of our immortal souls).

It’s better to soar than burn.
 
off-topic: Zarove can you please run your posts through a spell-checker before posting? I find it to be a chore trying to decipher your posts. I don’t know if your English isn’t the best, but you seem to have a dozen typos per sentence. I’m sorry if I’m offending you by saying this, but it is really, really difficult to read your posts!

on-topic: David I think that was a great analogy, well done!
 
1: I am dyselxic. I can barley use spell checkers and distrust them in general.they have caused ocnfusion all n their own.

2: His analogy is flawed. What of neither shcool “Makes it up as they go along.”? Indeed, no school woould be licensed to teach if it did htis, least of all Piloting airocraft that carry hundreds of persons.

Protestant theology ( which means here basicllay anythign not cahtolic, another sticking poitn I have to deal with in a narrow veiw) is not made up as it goes along.
Code:
 Their are brilliant theologians workign on intepretaiton and analysis of the Bible tisslf, and the Bible itsself as a centalising force. it stabilises the whole lot.


In general protestants aceept the same basic things as Cahtolcis, and even where Protestantism diverges form Cahtolisism, it does not typiclaly do so to an extent where it is unrecognisable as a form of Christendom.
They do not jut cook up rleigious beleifs on a whim.
 
I think what he is trying to say by the example is truth, or not truth. Obviously Protestants don’t make it up as they go, but he’s just trying to say that the other school is wrong in the anology.
 
I’d ask him if it’s true that the truth is unimportant.

When he answers yes, tell him that’s one truth he believes is important. Therefore, truth is important.
 
Aridite
I have encountered the same problem in my sister-in-law, who left the Catholic Church after she got married. I get the feeling the truth is too hard for her. It’s not “fun” like her new church is, plus now she gets to do what *she * wants, like use birth control. I tried emailing her articles, but that didn’t fly.
Now, I just plant seeds when I can, and pray for her.

Mosher
I like the thought of sending books, but get the feeling they will just gather dust, She’s not much of a reader. Any suggestions how to force her? 😃

Lukelion
 
I’m pretty sure he would not read anything I gave him. I’m just trying to get him to critically evaluate his position. He seems to think that he doesn’t really have a position, just the lowest common denominator.

I thought about doing the self-referential thing: Isn’t “truth is unimportant” true? But I think he would try to sidestep it, and in the end only admit that this is the only truth.

I have been trying to point out that he implicitly claims to know the truth about other more important matters, for instance, that reading the Bible is important. He says that this isn’t so much the Truth (THE WAY of following Christ), as true-enough – he seems to say that one can follow Jesus in a variety of ways, and that He is doing the heavy lifting, not us. He kind of talks about this as an assurance of salvation (once saved always saved) but then again, he thinks he can damage or destroy his relationship with God through neglect or deliberate sin, so his devotional/prayer life would seem to be necessary *.

He says the flight-school analogy is not apt since he is not flying the plane, God is, he’s just along for the ride. I think he is talking about being saved by faith alone. I told him he missed the point – a better analogy might be that he has to know the truth about where different planes (denominations) are going to know which one (or whether any) will get him where he wants to go (heaven). He says various denominations (within a certain range) will due, and his way works for him.

It is kind of frustrating dealing with someone who seems to lack convictions, but he’s a nice guy, and he seems to enjoy talking about Truth and the Church. Can I (should I) try to get him (or others) to see arguments about the Catholic Church as the “fulness of truth” as more than an academic exercise?*
 
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aridite:
What do you say to someone who says they don’t care about truth? An acqaintance says he is not interested in trying to figure out which is the True Church, that he knows Jesus by reading his Bible and praying alone, and he is happy (and sure of his salvation). If he feels like he needs more than his Bible, he goes to a friend’s non-denominational church and gets emotionally recharged. But, the question of which denomination is right or truest, he says, is unimportant.
Ask him what his favorite parts about his faith are. Be ready to say, “that’s interesting, I never looked at it that way” as code for, “that’s wrong.” That is the stealth way to gather information for apologetics attack without telegraphing your move too much in advance. Remember He will come as a thief in the night. Use stealth reasoning. Paul blended in, to win those who let down their guard around them. Do not do this if you are weak in faith or easily offended. Use it as an exercise to love unconditionally.
He just blinks hollowly when I say that the Catholic Church is the one Jesus founded and it has the whole, complete Gospel as handed onto the Apostles.
That’s OK. You’ve planted the seeds, even though you might not have seen them sprout it’s up to the Holy Spirit from now on. You can try to water and feed him, if not spiritually then physically by taking him to his favorite restaurant or cooking his favorite dish. Worldly problems beget worldly solutions; the way to his heart is through his stomach.
I’m not sure if he thinks none have the complete truth (since if that were the case, it would have eclipsed the others, attracting the most sincere believers) or that we just can never know whether any of them are true. He seems to be saying both.
Some think truth is found in all things, and that unless one comprehends all mysteries in the Universe, one cannot claim to have the whole truth. The Church has the Truth insofar as she keeps the Literal, written Word of God alive through her vigilance. Also she gives the sacraments.

There are other aspects of God than the literal, written word. There is also the allegorical and mystical (unitive) properties of the Word of God, whether in Scriptural form or the Eucharist, that are beyond understanding. It’s OK for us not to understand, nor to pretend to agree with something we can never grasp. We can subject our wills to it, but it is only our faith that smoething is true if we can’t see it or calculate it out. That’[s what faith is about. Faith is not always good, befcause everybody puts their faith in something. The issue is whether it is something that will last, like the Truth held by the Church founded on the Rock.

Any help? Has anyone encountered this before?
Yes.

Don’t worry about it. Plant seeds, mostly nonverbal. Befriend him. Give him ways he can hurt you to prove you trust him, like a dog rolling on its back to be submissive to a stronger dog. Do not be afraid he will teach you wrong, because everything he says you will receive as “venting” if you don’t think it’s right. You can simply discard it without having to rub his nose in it.

Alan
 
Kay Cee:
I’d ask him if it’s true that the truth is unimportant.

When he answers yes, tell him that’s one truth he believes is important. Therefore, truth is important.
Good idea. As a variation you could ask why he thinks what he has is enough. Then ask him how he knows those are good reasons (or that they are true).

If, for example, he thinks the Christian life is just about him and Jesus, and after looking at his reasons, you might be able to discuss the Communion of Saints from Scripture.

David
 
If he likes movies, you could try to entice him with some of the great Hollywood portrayals of devoted people/saints. Sometimes you look at a saint and know that what they understand and love, you want too. I liked the Song of Bernadette (it’s about Lourdes) and a Man for All Seasons (Thomas Moore). That’s kind of old, so try something more modern if you like.

I think the saints are often more persuasive to certain personality types than “some dumb argument about truth.”
 
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