TV: Lost - Season 5

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Havard said:
As to the flashbacks in which Jacob meets with Kate, Sawyer, Jack, Sayid, Hurley and Sun/jin, I’m not sure if I believe that was really Jacob in every instance, or if it was actually the devious Esau. In Sawyer’s flashback, we see Jacob facilitate Sawyer’s vengeful nature by offering him a pen to write the infamous letter. And in Sayid’s flashback, we see him appear to Sayid at the very moment that Charles Widmore’s assasins killed Nadya (which suggests he knew the precise details of how the assasination would take place), yet he did nothing to warn Sayid.
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I don’t think we know enough about the circumstances of Nadia’s death to assume at this point that Ben’s flimsy “proof” of a Widmore assassination is solid evidence.

Was Nadia murdered? Was it an accident and just coincidental that one of Widmore’s men was in the neighborhood when it happened (Ben’s photo does not place the man at the scene of the accident, just nearby) . Did Jacob (or his counterpart) actually cause Nadia’s death or save Sayid from being killed?

I also don’t think we have enough evidence at this time to assume that Jacob is good. A good reference point for LOST is BABYLON 5. There, a seemingly angelic race proves to be anything but. And B5 is a clear influence on LOST (even though the tenor of the shows is completely different).

As for what I think: It is highly likely that Nadia was murdered by Widmore’s people. Your theory that “Esau” could have assumed Jacob’s form is reasonable. And Jacob may very well be good.

So I’m not dismissing your theory at all. Just pointing out some areas where I think there’s not enough evidence at this point to make assumptions - though we can certainly hypothesize!
 
AnotherChance said:
I am on the side that something is going to change in this round of the time loop. The opening conversation on the beach between Jacob and his enemy foreshadows this. I think there is an element (variable) that is different this time. Could Juliet or Hurley be new to the loop?
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I think it’s possible, given the opening conversation, that we could be in the final loop.
 
dranzal said:
Personally, and I’ll elaborate in another post, I think the bomb doesn’t go off and the final flash we see is our Losties flashing to the present.

This would coincide with dying Jacob saying, “They’re coming.”
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Ding ding ding. I think we have a winner! (Or at least, your speculation is in line with my speculation!). 🙂
 
Appleby said:
Thank you for that patronizing examination of what I said, and the conclusion that in fact I meant something else.

I guess that means there is no need for me to have any original thoughts anymore. If anyone wants to know what I think, they can ask you. :mad:
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I’m sorry, Appleby. I didn’t mean to be patronizing, but I admit that my tone was condescending. I simply meant to suggest that it was inaccurate and premature to state that the materialization of a plotline now explicitly related to time travel somehow proved that they were making it up as they went along, in light of how well it fit thematically.
dranzal said:
It is my understanding that they knew their overall story “arc” from the very beginning, but had to invent filler stuff when ABC wouldn’t give them an end date. They knew they didn’t intend for it to last for an indefinite amount of time, but couldn’t really plan without knowing the end date.
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Good point; I think you’re right.
 
dranzal said:
It is my understanding that they knew their overall story “arc” from the very beginning, but had to invent filler stuff when ABC wouldn’t give them an end date. They knew they didn’t intend for it to last for an indefinite amount of time, but couldn’t really plan without knowing the end date.
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That is also my understanding. They were trying to stretch things out in later S2 and early S3 because ABC wanted to stretch the show out.

After watching the S5 finale, it is almost impossible to believe that they didn’t know where they were going from the start. So much of what we know now is foreshadowed in the very first episodes of the show. It’s like they’re “hiding in plain sight.”
 
Fone_Bone_2001 said:
While it was true that during Season Two they didn’t know where they were going with it because ABC executives hadn’t given them an end date, they did receive one during the third season (the whole 2008-2010 mini-seasons timetable) and therefore have been planning ahead since that time, no matter what you say.

…

In the first draft for “Solitary” in the first season, there was a line of dialogue in which Sayid asked Rousseau what she and her team had been researching in this area. She apparently had responded “Time,” but ABC wanted LOST’s producers to remove anything that smacked of science fiction this early in the series.

Then there was the way Desmond’s consciousness seemed to travel back through time for a short period of time when the sky lit up (just like it did after the wheel turn) after he turned the hatch key at the end of season two.

Then in season four, after flying to the freighter for the first time, Desmond’s consciousness began to experience dangerous temporal shifts. This was the episode when he would erratically travel between 2004 and 1996 unwillingly.

THEN and ONLY then, in this fully foreshadowed context, was full-fledged time travel introduced in the beginning of season five.

Furthermore, time travel fits in extremely well with the recurring theme on LOST of fatalism vs. freedom. The whole “Can you change the future if you wanted?” question is a good opportunity to explore that issue further.

Because of the fact, then, that time travel on LOST was foreshadowed constantly and also is thematically a perfect fit, I can conclude only that you are wrong.
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I completely agree with you.

“LINDELOF: There were certain things we knew from the very beginning. Independent of ever knowing when the end was going to be, we knew what it was going to be, and we wanted to start setting it up as early as season 1, or else people would think that we were making it up as we were going along. So the skeletons are the living — or, I guess, slowly decomposing — proof of that. When all is said and done, people are going to point to the skeletons and say, ‘‘That is proof that from the very beginning, they always knew that they were going to do this.’’”

ew.com/ew/article/0,20010504,00.html
 
Well, there you have it, right from the horse’s mouth.

I, personally, really enjoyed the season finale. I look forward to the final season and hope that it is as epic as I think it has the potential to be.
 
zerocrossing said:
I was baffled, but never really annoyed, by Locke seeming to come back from the dead. I assumed that the island raised him (just as Jesus raised Lazarus), not that he raised himself. So I never saw it as a parallel to Christ. Also, Carlton Cuse is a practicing Catholic, so I trusted that while we may not have seen where the plot was going, it would not ultimately have turned Christ into a mere man.

As it turns out, the plot shows that it was Locke (not Jesus) who was creating his own hype - egged on by the “Esau” character, who later assumed Locke’s identity.
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I knew that Cuse was Catholic, but I didn’t know he was a practicing Catholic. The finale gave me a lot more hope that the producers know what they are doing. Season Five was my favorite season so far and got me a lot more interested in the show that I was previously. But it certainly kept pulling us in a thousand different directions! It looks like they are starting to pull things together now with the Jacob/anti-Jacob dichotomy.
 
zerocrossing said:
That is also my understanding. They were trying to stretch things out in later S2 and early S3 because ABC wanted to stretch the show out.

After watching the S5 finale, it is almost impossible to believe that they didn’t know where they were going from the start. So much of what we know now is foreshadowed in the very first episodes of the show. It’s like they’re “hiding in plain sight.”
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You’re right! What you said made me think of the beginning of season one, when Locke taught Walt to play backgammon. Locke held up two pieces - a black one and a white one - and told Walt, “Two players. Two sides. One is light. One is dark.”

That line has baffled LOST viewers since the beginning, but perhaps its fullest meaning is beginning to materialize.
 
Fone_Bone_2001 said:
You’re right! What you said made me think of the beginning of season one, when Locke taught Walt to play backgammon. Locke held up two pieces - a black one and a white one - and told Walt, “Two players. Two sides. One is light. One is dark.”

That line has baffled LOST viewers since the beginning, but perhaps its fullest meaning is beginning to materialize.
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Yeah. The backgammon quote is now pretty clearly a reference to the dark/light dichotomy we are now seeing unfold. Also, “Adam & Eve” had the dark and light pebbles. Very early we get hints of where things are going.

Darlton are saying that they think the best stories are yet to be told - in s6. If that’s the case, then was all of this prelude to where they really want to go with this?

I’m looking forward to s6. But in the meantime, I’m rewatching s1-5.
 
Does anybody believe for a minute that Ben might be Christian? The writers seemed to be dropping us a hint in “316” when he was with Jack in the church, telling him the story of St. Thomas.

You never know, since Ben likes to manipulate people by telling them what they want to hear, but as far as I know Jack isn’t religious, so what could Ben hope to gain by making him think he is?
 
I agree with the Dark vs. Light analysis’ going on here.

I will however disagree with the notion of Ben being Christian, er, a TRUE Christian. A TRUE Christian would not (on many, many accounts):
  • lie
  • deceive
  • kill
  • manipulate
  • allow for murder
  • test people (it is up to the Lord to do that)
  • carry grudges
And as true Christians, we strive to be holy and avoid the above list (and more), but are humans and we get up, dust ourselves off, ask forgiveness and seek the Grace of God to do better next time.

Ben didn’t exhibit this.

Could Ben change? Sure, anything is possible with the Lord!
Will he change? Unlikely.

Although, I am in agreement with the lot of you, that S6 is probably going to be the best since S1.
 
levi78 said:
I agree with the Dark vs. Light analysis’ going on here.

I will however disagree with the notion of Ben being Christian, er, a TRUE Christian. A TRUE Christian would not (on many, many accounts):
  • lie
  • deceive
  • kill
  • manipulate
  • allow for murder
  • test people (it is up to the Lord to do that)
  • carry grudges
And as true Christians, we strive to be holy and avoid the above list (and more), but are humans and we get up, dust ourselves off, ask forgiveness and seek the Grace of God to do better next time.

Ben didn’t exhibit this.

Could Ben change? Sure, anything is possible with the Lord!
Will he change? Unlikely.

Although, I am in agreement with the lot of you, that S6 is probably going to be the best since S1.
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Well, I think that Ben truly believes he is good. Not exactly Christian, but good. I think the important thing is how he sees himself. He let Jacob (or who he thought was Jacob, I’m still not sure if he or anyone else on the Island ever actually met Jacob) lead him on what he thought was the right path.
 
Kit15 said:
I have never heard of this site before…what is it? Is it another viral site game thing while we wait for season 6?
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The people who are following it are still unsure if it’s a game or if it’s just advertising for LOST. It’s basically a site that promotes the LOST Underground Art Project where fans can buy art. There are clues that are going to be given for the next 6 months until Season 6 starts about the upcoming paintings. It’s a good way to pass the time.

You can go to the website to look at the art that is up so far.
www.damoncarltonandapolarbear.com

Or you can go to www.lostargs.com to catch up on what has happened regarding this project so far.

🙂
 
Interesting, I didn’t know that site existed. I wonder if they will publicize it more.

Personally, I am hoping that the final season delivers a great ending, and does not stray from answering all the questions that we still have. They said that season 5 would provide answers, but it only provided a few, and it opened up much more with the time traveling element. I’m sure though that either way it will be just as entertaining as all the previous seasons.
 
meet1ngex said:
Interesting, I didn’t know that site existed. I wonder if they will publicize it more.

Personally, I am hoping that the final season delivers a great ending, and does not stray from answering all the questions that we still have. They said that season 5 would provide answers, but it only provided a few, and it opened up much more with the time traveling element. I’m sure though that either way it will be just as entertaining as all the previous seasons.
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I’ve already mentally prepared myself for the fact that there will be unanswered questions after the final episode airs. That’s just the nature of these sorts of things. But I am confident they will answer all the major questions.
 
meet1ngex said:
Interesting, I didn’t know that site existed. I wonder if they will publicize it more.
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The project kicked off at ComicCon this past summer, so all of the fans that were there were introduced to it and it has branched out from there. There are some pretty cool LOST events that have been happening, two so far. The first one was a special appearance from Sterling Beaumon who played Young Ben, and one happened just this morning in Boston where fans were given more clues to the LOST art & a limited (only given if you went there) LOST skateboard.

If anyone is a hardcore fan who collects or likes to own LOST items, I would encourage you to go to the website and see if you are interested in the various LOST posters (Hurley and Locke ones have been revealed so far; 16 total posters by the time Season 6 begins) or if any events are happening near you.

They are limited editions and probably the last chance to be involved in a LOST project 🙂
 
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