Two Questions

[fakename]

(1) is it possible to know someone else’s soul better than he knows it?
For instance, for someone who understands morality or the science of happiness, does he implicitly know thereby what makes any arbitrary person happy, more than the arbitrary person does?

Theoretically, though, is it possible to know everything that goes on in a person’s mind? Can we say, study human nature, morality, philosophy of mind, etc. and cobble the results together to attain such knowledge? Or is it theoretically not possible?

(2) Do we judge people’s soul when we claim to know better than them? That is, how can we claim such knowledge unless we were certain what the other person was thinking?

and do we need to know the guilt of a person, in order to defend ourselves against them?

 

[Nelka]

No.

 

[tonyrey]

(1) is it possible to know someone else’s soul better than he knows it?
For instance, for someone who understands morality or the science of happiness, does he implicitly know thereby what makes any arbitrary person happy, more than the arbitrary person does?

It is possible to understand someone else better in some ways but not in every way!

Theoretically, though, is it possible to know everything that goes on in a person’s mind? Can we say, study human nature, morality, philosophy of mind, etc. and cobble the results together to attain such knowledge? Or is it theoretically not possible?

Not only the complexity of the task but the fact of free will makes it impossible.

(2) Do we judge people’s soul when we claim to know better than them? That is, how can we claim such knowledge unless we were certain what the other person was thinking?

Bishop Butler said probability is the guide of life!

and do we need to know the guilt of a person, in order to defend ourselves against them?

Not necessarily. If we are wise we take precautions whenever we have doubts…

 

[fakename]

user"tonyrey":

Not only the complexity of the task but the fact of free will makes it impossible.

An objection: we know the souls of others when we are in heaven so free will per se does not make mind-reading impossible.

But a better question is, what science do we lack that we cannot, in principle if not in practice, read the soul? We have a science for what makes people happy, what they prefer, and we also have science which describes the essence of the soul -aristotelian psychology?

But again, if some Catholic says “we know what you should want and not want” then is he not claiming to know what the deepest desires of non-Catholics are? That is, does he not claim to know what they indeed do want and not want, even though they themselves don’t know it?

Or is it that “I know better than you” simply a provisional “If that’s what you do mean, then I know better than it”?

 

[fakename]

Or is it that since even demons and angels can’t figure out our minds, then we shouldn’t be able to figure it out?

But if so, am I wrong that in heaven, we all know our spirits?

 

[Curious_Seed]

(1) is it possible to know someone else’s soul better than he knows it?
For instance, for someone who understands morality or the science of happiness, does he implicitly know thereby what makes any arbitrary person happy, more than the arbitrary person does?

Theoretically, though, is it possible to know everything that goes on in a person’s mind? Can we say, study human nature, morality, philosophy of mind, etc. and cobble the results together to attain such knowledge? Or is it theoretically not possible?

(2) Do we judge people’s soul when we claim to know better than them? That is, how can we claim such knowledge unless we were certain what the other person was thinking?

and do we need to know the guilt of a person, in order to defend ourselves against them?

Is it possible to know someone’s soul better than he knows it?
Don’t you think the soul of each of us is only knowable by God?

Do we judge?
All the time, unfortunately.

Your last question is not clear enough to answer.

 

[fakename]

user "Curious Seed":

Is it possible to know someone’s soul better than he knows it?
Don’t you think the soul of each of us is only knowable by God?

Do we judge?
All the time, unfortunately.

Your last question is not clear enough to answer

I think that we can know the soul of others better than they do, at least sometimes.
But back to what you said; basically that we don’t know each other’s soul. Well if that’s the case then you contradict yourself since if you tell me that my soul is unknowable to others than you know something about my soul that I didn’t know -that is you knew better.

So when we say we know better than someone else we mean to say that we know their mind better than they do.

And yet perhaps I should distinguish between two senses of the word soul.If I say “I see the man in front of me” I don’t need to know that it is mario. In the same way, if I say “I know your soul” I can mean either that I know your soul per accidens or per se and I think that we mostly know each other’s soul per accidens but sometimes I swear, we can know the deepest thoughts of others when they divulge them to us. What does this mean?

 

[Curious_Seed]

I think that we can know the soul of others better than they do, at least sometimes.
But back to what you said; basically that we don’t know each other’s soul. Well if that’s the case then you contradict yourself since if you tell me that my soul is unknowable to others than you know something about my soul that I didn’t know -that is you knew better.

So when we say we know better than someone else we mean to say that we know their mind better than they do.

And yet perhaps I should distinguish between two senses of the word soul.If I say “I see the man in front of me” I don’t need to know that it is mario. In the same way, if I say “I know your soul” I can mean either that I know your soul per accidens or per se and I think that we mostly know each other’s soul per accidens but sometimes I swear, we can know the deepest thoughts of others when they divulge them to us. What does this mean?

Well, I tell you brother, there is little likelihood of my knowing your soul because I don’t even know what you are saying.

 

[fakename]

I think that we can know the soul of others better than they do, at least sometimes.
But back to what you said; basically that we don’t know each other’s soul. Well if that’s the case then you contradict yourself since if you tell me that my soul is unknowable to others than you know something about my soul that I didn’t know -that is you knew better.

So when we say we know better than someone else we mean to say that we know their mind better than they do.

I think you get this part, but just in case, I’ve put it up again. Basically I’m just saying its a contradiction to say that you don’t know the soul because the very denial is a claim to know something about someone’s soul (namely that it is unknowable).

The rest of my post just distinguishes between the ways we say we see something. E.G. I see that man versus I see mario. It’s possible that they are the same person but we only know mario virtually by the fact that we know the man. Is that what we mean when we say we know your soul, that is, virtually because we know something about it but not all of it? Is it possible to know all of it?

 

[fakename]

user"fakename":

I think that we can know the soul of others better than they do, at least sometimes.
But back to what you said; basically that we don’t know each other’s soul. Well if that’s the case then you contradict yourself since if you tell me that my soul is unknowable to others than you know something about my soul that I didn’t know -that is you knew better.

So when we say we know better than someone else we mean to say that we know their mind better than they do.

I think you get this part, but just in case, I’ve put it up again. Basically I’m just saying its a contradiction to say that you don’t know the soul because the very denial is a claim to know something about someone’s soul (namely that it is unknowable).

The rest of my post just distinguishes between the ways we say we see something. E.G. I see that man versus I see mario. It’s possible that they are the same person but we only know mario virtually by the fact that we know the man. Is that what we mean when we say we know your soul, that is, virtually because we know something about it but not all of it? Is it possible to know all of it?

 

[Curious_Seed]

I think that we can know the soul of others better than they do, at least sometimes.
But back to what you said; basically that we don’t know each other’s soul. Well if that’s the case then you contradict yourself since if you tell me that my soul is unknowable to others than you know something about my soul that I didn’t know -that is you knew better.

Let’s approach this line by line, ok?

You think we can know the soul of others better than they do, at least sometimes.

What is it “to know?”

What do you mean by “soul?”

What is it to “know better?”

Why only “sometimes?”

 

[fakename]

user"Curious Seed":

Let’s approach this line by line, ok?

You think we can know the soul of others better than they do, at least sometimes.

What is it “to know?”

What do you mean by “soul?”

What is it to “know better?”

Why only “sometimes?”

“to know” to have true justified belief.

“soul” the mind/immaterial form of the human being.

“know better” to have true justified belief as opposed to the opinions or illusions that others entertain about their soul.

“sometimes” because even with the most certain science, like math, human errors and the vicissitudes of life can cause mistakes, though again the science is itself perfect.
Edit/Delete Message

 

[karaleigh]

Only God knows the ways of every man even the hidden parts. Between one person and another, only the person of the soul you speak of knows the hidden parts…other people do not.

It’s possible to listen to the expressed thoughts of a person, but the hidden meanings to the person’s words or thoughts can not be deciphered correctly. The person will guard their soul and not describe the hidden meanings when detailing their thoughts and actions.

Only with papal authority(Vatican knowledge of the scriptures) can we claim to know more, that is, better then another person. Because of their hidden words and meanings, we can never truly know what is best for them.

Reconciliation with The Father is the only means of proof to the why’s and what for’s to a person actions. Remembering God is Love, it’s more important to first find guilt within one’s own personality. “Judge not, and you will not be judged…”;Luke.6:37. Avoiding mischief is essential for harmony of the soul.

 

[Curious_Seed]

“to know” to have true justified belief.

“soul” the mind/immaterial form of the human being.

“know better” to have true justified belief as opposed to the opinions or illusions that others entertain about their soul.

“sometimes” because even with the most certain science, like math, human errors and the vicissitudes of life can cause mistakes, though again the science is itself perfect.
Edit/Delete Message

Before proceeding with all your definitions, please clarify " to know. "

Try to avoid terms which have multiple streams of thought attached such as, true, justified, and belief, in the definition.

Unless I have a clear understanding of your terminology, we cannot proceed meaningfully.

If it proves unavoidable to use terms of multiple implications, then please clarify those terms, in turn.

 

[fakename]

"user" Curious Seed:

Before proceeding with all your definitions, please clarify " to know. "

Try to avoid terms which have multiple streams of thought attached such as, true, justified, and belief, in the definition.

Unless I have a clear understanding of your terminology, we cannot proceed meaningfully.

If it proves unavoidable to use terms of multiple implications, then please clarify those terms, in turn.

True=existing, or having being. From the POV of our minds we have the truth when our mental propositions correspond to some existing thing.

Justified=deduced from indemonstrable first principles and truths.

Belief=feeling of certainty.