Two Wedding Ceremonies?

[lovedance4ever]

I know that marrying someone outside of the church means that the marriage is not valid. But if that is done (in a Hindu ceremony), can a Catholic marriage follow it to make it valid? I hope I make sense. What I mean is…can a ceremony be conducted simply to follow custom, but then the valid marriage then follow it?

If not, then is it possible to incorporate small Hindu customs into the wedding? Like the flowers around the neck (say, after the wedding is conducted) and the bindi placed on the forehead?

 

[EasterJoy]

No, that is not done (see bolded section)

Can. 1127 §1. The prescripts of ⇒ can. 1108 are to be observed for the form to be used in a mixed marriage.

Nevertheless, if a Catholic party contracts marriage with a non-Catholic party of an Eastern rite, the canonical form of the celebration must be observed for liceity only; for validity, however, the presence of a sacred minister is required and the other requirements of law are to be observed.

§2. If grave difficulties hinder the observance of canonical form, the local ordinary of the Catholic party has the right of dispensing from the form in individual cases, after having consulted the ordinary of the place in which the marriage is celebrated and with some public form of celebration for validity. It is for the conference of bishops to establish norms by which the aforementioned dispensation is to be granted in a uniform manner.

§3. It is forbidden to have another religious celebration of the same marriage to give or renew matrimonial consent before or after the canonical celebration according to the norm of §1. Likewise, there is not to be a religious celebration in which the Catholic who is assisting and a non-Catholic minister together, using their own rites, ask for the consent of the parties.

 

[lovedance4ever]

No, that is not done (see bolded section)

Can. 1127 §1. The prescripts of ⇒ can. 1108 are to be observed for the form to be used in a mixed marriage.

Nevertheless, if a Catholic party contracts marriage with a non-Catholic party of an Eastern rite, the canonical form of the celebration must be observed for liceity only; for validity, however, the presence of a sacred minister is required and the other requirements of law are to be observed.

§2. If grave difficulties hinder the observance of canonical form, the local ordinary of the Catholic party has the right of dispensing from the form in individual cases, after having consulted the ordinary of the place in which the marriage is celebrated and with some public form of celebration for validity. It is for the conference of bishops to establish norms by which the aforementioned dispensation is to be granted in a uniform manner.

§3. It is forbidden to have another religious celebration of the same marriage to give or renew matrimonial consent before or after the canonical celebration according to the norm of §1. Likewise, there is not to be a religious celebration in which the Catholic who is assisting and a non-Catholic minister together, using their own rites, ask for the consent of the parties.

Would it be possible to incorporate some of his customs into our wedding? For instance, they place flowers around the neck of the bride and groom, and then the bindi on the forehead. Would that be okay? Simply for marriage custom…I wouldn’t be worshiping, obviously, if we were married in the Church.

 

[1ke]

You could incorporate such customs into the reception. Not the Catholic ceremony itself.

 

[lovedance4ever]

Thank you for your response! That’s what I thought, but I wanted to ask to make sure. For the reception, I would be expected to wear traditional Indian clothing, etc. But I think I am being overly scrupulous lol. I just do not want to do anything wrong. We would be married in the Church, but he wants some of his customs incorporated too. So this is good to know. Thanks

 

[phil19034]

I know that marrying someone outside of the church means that the marriage is not valid. But if that is done (in a Hindu ceremony), can a Catholic marriage follow it to make it valid? I hope I make sense. What I mean is…can a ceremony be conducted simply to follow custom, but then the valid marriage then follow it?

If not, then is it possible to incorporate small Hindu customs into the wedding? Like the flowers around the neck (say, after the wedding is conducted) and the bindi placed on the forehead?

Talk your priest. The Catholic may be able to receive dispensation to marry a non-baptized. The Bishop would need to approve it.

I know the Church will do this for Catholics and Jews who want to marry. The couple is then married by the Rabbi (with dispensation, a priest then may attend if the other religion allows it).

But all of this is dependent on receiving dispensation BEFORE getting married.

Marrying a non-Baptised person will not be sacurmental marriage, but will be considered licit (i.e. you could still receive Communion).

If you have any questions, please feel free to PM me, as I’ve been dealing with this stuff for a while now.

God Bless.

 

[phil19034]

Thank you for your response! That’s what I thought, but I wanted to ask to make sure. For the reception, I would be expected to wear traditional Indian clothing, etc. But I think I am being overly scrupulous lol. I just do not want to do anything wrong. We would be married in the Church, but he wants some of his customs incorporated too. So this is good to know. Thanks

Is he converting (or might possibly convert)? If not, the marriage will not be sacramental anyway. If you receive dispensation, you could simply marry him in a Hindu service (provided that the Bishop first approves of the dispensation).

Either way… discuss with your priest.

 

[pensmama87]

Talk your priest. The Catholic may be able to receive dispensation to marry a non-baptized. The Bishop would need to approve it.

I know the Church will do this for Catholics and Jews who want to marry. The couple is then married by the Rabbi (with dispensation, a priest then may attend if the other religion allows it).

But all of this is dependent on receiving dispensation BEFORE getting married.

Marrying a non-Baptised person will not be sacurmental marriage, but will be considered licit (i.e. you could still receive Communion).

If you have any questions, please feel free to PM me, as I’ve been dealing with this stuff for a while now.

God Bless.

Sorry to hijack the thread, but do you know how this might apply to Muslims and Catholics who wish to marry?

I am not sure what the rules are on the Muslim side, but if I’m interpreting this correctly it means that my husband’s cousin, who is engaged to a Muslim man, will not be marrying validly in the eyes of the Church, as they are currently planning two ceremonies. I am not sure why they wouldn’t just opt for the Muslim ceremony only, if a dispensation could be granted (I know that it’s not automatic). We were told it would just be the bride and groom and the bride’s father there, but I don’t know if that’s customary or what.

I’ve been nervous about this whole situation ever since they announced their engagement, but now I’m really worried.

 

[phil19034]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but do you know how this might apply to Muslims and Catholics who wish to marry?

I am not sure what the rules are on the Muslim side, but if I’m interpreting this correctly it means that my husband’s cousin, who is engaged to a Muslim man, will not be marrying validly in the eyes of the Church, as they are currently planning two ceremonies. I am not sure why they wouldn’t just opt for the Muslim ceremony only, if a dispensation could be granted (I know that it’s not automatic). We were told it would just be the bride and groom and the bride’s father there, but I don’t know if that’s customary or what.

I’ve been nervous about this whole situation ever since they announced their engagement, but now I’m really worried.

I believe the dispensation is for any non-Baptised person. Regardless of religion or no religion.

If they have two weddings, the 2nd must be the Catholic one, which would be a convalidation of the marriage.

Either way, MUST SPEAK WITH PRIEST AND GET DISPENSATION FROM BISHOP

 

[pensmama87]

I believe the dispensation is for any non-Baptised person. Regardless of religion or no religion.

If they have two weddings, the 2nd must be the Catholic one, which would be a convalidation of the marriage.

How does that square with the canon law quoted by EasterJoy:

§3. It is forbidden to have another religious celebration of the same marriage to give or renew matrimonial consent before or after the canonical celebration according to the norm of §1. Likewise, there is not to be a religious celebration in which the Catholic who is assisting and a non-Catholic minister together, using their own rites, ask for the consent of the parties.

 

[phil19034]

How does that square with the canon law quoted by EasterJoy:

§3. It is forbidden to have another religious celebration of the same marriage to give or renew matrimonial consent before or after the canonical celebration according to the norm of §1. Likewise, there is not to be a religious celebration in which the Catholic who is assisting and a non-Catholic minister together, using their own rites, ask for the consent of the parties.

You can only do it with a despensation from the canonical form, which can only be provided by the Bishop via your priest (and it has to be done the way the Bishop indicates).

The Bishop will require a “good reason”

Also, I just re-read EasterJoy’s post. Those laws are refering to “mixed-marriages.” A “mixed marriage” is a mariage between two Baptised Christians, but only one is Catholic. The marriage must take place the “Catholic Way” to insure a Sacurmental marriage.

Marriage between a Catholic and a non-Baptised person is NOT a mixed-marriage. It is a non-Sacurmental wedding, called a “Disparity of Cult.” This requires the Dispensation from the Disparity of Cult from the Bishop. Because it is non-sacurmental, it’s different than marrying a Baptised Protestant or Orthodox Christian.

Hope this helps.

But again, speak with a priest

 

[pensmama87]

You can only do it with a despensation from the canonical form, which can only be provided by the Bishop via your priest (and it has to be done the way the Bishop indicates).

The Bishop will require a “good reason”

Also, I just re-read EasterJoy’s post. Those laws are refering to “mixed-marriages.” A “mixed marriage” is a mariage between two Baptised Christians, but only one is Catholic. The marriage must take place the “Catholic Way” to insure a Sacurmental marriage.

Marriage between a Catholic and a non-Baptised person is NOT a mixed-marriage. It is a non-Sacurmental wedding, called a “Disparity of Cult.” This requires the Dispensation from the Disparity of Cult from the Bishop. Because it is non-sacurmental, it’s different than marrying a Baptised Protestant or Orthodox Christian.

Hope this helps.

But again, speak with a priest

I may. I am trying to figure out what role, if any, my son should play in his godmother’s wedding, and if we have to say no, we can explain why fully and as graciously as possible. That doesn’t guarantee no family drama, but knowing what I’m talking about should help.

 

[severus68]

Would it be possible to incorporate some of his customs into our wedding? For instance, they place flowers around the neck of the bride and groom, and then the bindi on the forehead. Would that be okay? Simply for marriage custom…I wouldn’t be worshiping, obviously, if we were married in the Church.

I don’t see why not. Those are about culture. Check out Catholic weddings in India on the internet.

 

[severus68]

No, that is not done (see bolded section)

Can. 1127 §1. The prescripts of ⇒ can. 1108 are to be observed for the form to be used in a mixed marriage.

Nevertheless, if a Catholic party contracts marriage with a non-Catholic party of an Eastern rite, the canonical form of the celebration must be observed for liceity only; for validity, however, the presence of a sacred minister is required and the other requirements of law are to be observed.

§2. If grave difficulties hinder the observance of canonical form, the local ordinary of the Catholic party has the right of dispensing from the form in individual cases, after having consulted the ordinary of the place in which the marriage is celebrated and with some public form of celebration for validity. It is for the conference of bishops to establish norms by which the aforementioned dispensation is to be granted in a uniform manner.

§3. It is forbidden to have another religious celebration of the same marriage to give or renew matrimonial consent before or after the canonical celebration according to the norm of §1. Likewise, there is not to be a religious celebration in which the Catholic who is assisting and a non-Catholic minister together, using their own rites, ask for the consent of the parties.

The above refers to mixed marriages which are marriages between Catholics and non-Catholic Christians.

 

[EasterJoy]

You can only do it with a despensation from the canonical form, which can only be provided by the Bishop via your priest (and it has to be done the way the Bishop indicates).

The Bishop will require a “good reason”

Also, I just re-read EasterJoy’s post. Those laws are refering to “mixed-marriages.” A “mixed marriage” is a mariage between two Baptised Christians, but only one is Catholic. The marriage must take place the “Catholic Way” to insure a Sacurmental marriage.

Marriage between a Catholic and a non-Baptised person is NOT a mixed-marriage. It is a non-Sacurmental wedding, called a “Disparity of Cult.” This requires the Dispensation from the Disparity of Cult from the Bishop. Because it is non-sacurmental, it’s different than marrying a Baptised Protestant or Orthodox Christian.

Hope this helps.

But again, speak with a priest

Can. 1129 The prescripts of cann. ⇒ 1127 and ⇒ 1128 must be applied also to marriages which the impediment of disparity of cult mentioned in ⇒ can. 1086, §1 impedes.

The people who can give definitive answers post over at Liturgy and Sacraments…

 

[severus68]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but do you know how this might apply to Muslims and Catholics who wish to marry?

I am not sure what the rules are on the Muslim side, but if I’m interpreting this correctly it means that my husband’s cousin, who is engaged to a Muslim man, will not be marrying validly in the eyes of the Church, as they are currently planning two ceremonies. I am not sure why they wouldn’t just opt for the Muslim ceremony only, if a dispensation could be granted (I know that it’s not automatic). We were told it would just be the bride and groom and the bride’s father there, but I don’t know if that’s customary or what.

I’ve been nervous about this whole situation ever since they announced their engagement, but now I’m really worried.

Marrying a Muslim is very different. Many Hindus are open to other religions.

A Muslim man can marry a Christian woman or a Jewess. However, the Muslim man is required to bring up his children Muslim. Her fiance may not be disclosing the fact that they will also be having a Catholic ceremony and does her priest know about the Islamic ceremony. Many issues.

 

[severus68]

You can only do it with a despensation from the canonical form, which can only be provided by the Bishop via your priest (and it has to be done the way the Bishop indicates).

The Bishop will require a “good reason”

Also, I just re-read EasterJoy’s post. Those laws are refering to “mixed-marriages.” A “mixed marriage” is a mariage between two Baptised Christians, but only one is Catholic. The marriage must take place the “Catholic Way” to insure a Sacurmental marriage.

Marriage between a Catholic and a non-Baptised person is NOT a mixed-marriage. It is a non-Sacurmental wedding, called a “Disparity of Cult.” This requires the Dispensation from the Disparity of Cult from the Bishop. Because it is non-sacurmental, it’s different than marrying a Baptised Protestant or Orthodox Christian.

Hope this helps.

But again, speak with a priest

Yes.

 

[1ke]

You can only do it with a despensation from the canonical form, which can only be provided by the Bishop via your priest (and it has to be done the way the Bishop indicates).

The Bishop will require a “good reason”

Also, I just re-read EasterJoy’s post. Those laws are refering to “mixed-marriages.” A “mixed marriage” is a mariage between two Baptised Christians, but only one is Catholic. The marriage must take place the “Catholic Way” to insure a Sacurmental marriage.

Marriage between a Catholic and a non-Baptised person is NOT a mixed-marriage. It is a non-Sacurmental wedding, called a “Disparity of Cult.” This requires the Dispensation from the Disparity of Cult from the Bishop. Because it is non-sacurmental, it’s different than marrying a Baptised Protestant or Orthodox Christian.

Hope this helps.

But again, speak with a priest

Canon 1129 applies Canon 1127 to marriages of disparity of cult.

 

[1ke]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but do you know how this might apply to Muslims and Catholics who wish to marry?

I am not sure what the rules are on the Muslim side, but if I’m interpreting this correctly it means that my husband’s cousin, who is engaged to a Muslim man, will not be marrying validly in the eyes of the Church, as they are currently planning two ceremonies. I am not sure why they wouldn’t just opt for the Muslim ceremony only, if a dispensation could be granted (I know that it’s not automatic). We were told it would just be the bride and groom and the bride’s father there, but I don’t know if that’s customary or what.

I’ve been nervous about this whole situation ever since they announced their engagement, but now I’m really worried.

A Muslim/Catholic marriage is ill advised. A Mulsim man is required to raise his children in the Muslim faith, but a Catholic is required to raise their children in the Catholic faith. This is a recipe for disaster. In many countries, bishops do not give dispensation from disparity of cult for Catholics wanting to marry Muslims, particularly Catholic women marrying Muslim men.

 

[EasterJoy]

A Muslim/Catholic marriage is ill advised. A Mulsim man is required to raise his children in the Muslim faith, but a Catholic is required to raise their children in the Catholic faith. This is a recipe for disaster. In many countries, bishops do not give dispensation from disparity of cult for Catholics wanting to marry Muslims, particularly Catholic women marrying Muslim men.

Likewise, Muslims are wary of Muslim women marrying Muslim men, because Islam requires the husband to allow a Christian wife to practice her religion herself, while they do not believe that Christians are so bound. Whether or not that is true, someone who practices either faith seriously will face many trials if they try to raise a family with someone who believes their religion is false in any degree.

How do you pass on your religion when the two of you each thing the other practices a religion that is at least partly false? Neither religion is naïve about how difficult this situation is, and both fully realize how much less likely it is that the children will be taught religion without a relativistic taint.