Typical Anti-Catholic claims

[WJL]

Thanks everyone for the excellent responses (especially ChurchMilitant, you always have the best responses to these types of claims )!

I sent him a thorough response with all of the most relevant statements in response to his claims that I read throughout this thread and his only reply was:

MATTHEW 24
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, BUT MY WORDS SHALL NOT PASS AWAY.
MARK 13
31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: BUT MY WORDS SHALL NOT PASS AWAY.
LUKE 21
33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: BUT MY WORDS SHALL NOT PASS AWAY.

Jesus promised us we would have his words forever…and we have them…

1 JOHN 5
12 HE THAT HATH THE SON hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

Trust in him with all your heart…I did …

 

[WJL]

He seems to think that it was the Protestants who preserved the Bible, rather than the Catholic Church. lol.

 

[Cat_Herder]

He’s throwing stones in glass houses here since I assume he’s a rather extreme evangelical. Terms also not in the Bible: “grape juice”, “crackers”, “personal Lord and savior”, “once saved, always saved”, “conversion experienced”, “revival meeting”, “The Lord laying things on my heart”, “the Sinner’s Prayer”, “believer’s baptism”, “altar call”, “rapture” and on and on.

You forgot one… “Bible.”

See also The Basics: Statues, Mother of God, Nuns, Fathers etc

Thanks everyone for the excellent responses (especially ChurchMilitant, you always have the best responses to these types of claims )!

His website is excellent and is full of many more responses.

 

[govav8er]

Thanks everyone for the excellent responses (especially ChurchMilitant, you always have the best responses to these types of claims )!

I sent him a thorough response with all of the most relevant statements in response to his claims that I read throughout this thread and his only reply was:

MATTHEW 24
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, BUT MY WORDS SHALL NOT PASS AWAY.
MARK 13
31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: BUT MY WORDS SHALL NOT PASS AWAY.
LUKE 21
33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: BUT MY WORDS SHALL NOT PASS AWAY.

Jesus promised us we would have his words forever…and we have them…

1 JOHN 5
12 HE THAT HATH THE SON hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

Trust in him with all your heart…I did …
-—————————-—
This funny since I would think he would be against repetitive prayers or statements or whatever…

Sorry couldn’t resist.

 

[WJL]

I responded to him and asked him why he couldn’t address any of the relevant statements against his claims and this was his response:

Like I said when I first responded to you, if you believed God and His book (King James Bible), I could help you, but since you do not, I can not help you…consider this scripture…

JOHN 8
47 He that is of God heareth GOD’S WORDS: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

1. A perfect God
2. Wrote a perfect book
3. And preserved it perfectly

I believe all three…most people believe number 1 and 2 but not number 3

But God promised that he would preserve his words…

Psalm 12:6 The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
7 Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt PRESERVE them from this generation for ever.

I hope and pray someday soon you will believe God and His book…
richard

 

[Incomplete]

I responded to him and asked him why he couldn’t address any of the relevant statements against his claims and this was his response:

In other words, he had no good responses for you, and is unwilling to listen to truth.

It’s not really worth saying more to him, except what I don’t recall is, was this through PM or public? If it’s public, for anybody lurking, it might be beneficial to ask this person who God gave the ability to perfectly interpret His perfect book, considering all the different interpretations.

 

[WJL]

In other words, he had no good responses for you, and is unwilling to listen to truth.

Yes, exactly.

It’s not really worth saying more to him, except what I don’t recall is, was this through PM or public? If it’s public, for anybody lurking, it might be beneficial to ask this person who God gave the ability to perfectly interpret His perfect book, considering all the different interpretations.

This is through PM. He originally sent me this message:

I like to add Christians so if you’re a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ I would be honored to add you. If you don’t know God’s Son I would be glad to tell you about him. JOHN 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I AM THE WAY, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. Sincerely… richard

If you are a Catholic, the Bible tells you to come out of that false church…
REVELATION 18
4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, COME OUT OF HER, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

 

[Incomplete]

You are not a “friend”, then, and he has no real interest in learning the truth. I would unfriend him and pray for him. He clearly has an interest in bringing people out of God’s church, and will have to deny the truth to do that. I worry about people like him. It’s too bad he’s not wiling to listen to you.

I suspect the best Christian response right now is to put him on your daily prayer list for the next several years.

 

[Farsight001]

I responded to him and asked him why he couldn’t address any of the relevant statements against his claims and this was his response:

I might respond by pointing out that if you believed what he considers to be the truth, then he would not need to help you at all. The idea that he cannot help you because you do not already believe is silly. It is precisely because you do not already believe the “truth” that you need the help. One who has truth does not need help from anyone in understanding it.

It’s also at this point I would tend toward calling him a charlatin and a pharisee and a few other choice words used by Jesus in scripture for his attempt to avoid answering and flat out call it an attempt to deceive me, but that might not be your style.

btw, if you don’t mind answering (maybe through pm if you prefer), but what is this person’s username? His writings sound very familiar and I believe I might have actually run into him before on youtube and exchanged pm’s with him there as well.

 

[stewstew03]

You are not a “friend”, then, and he has no real interest in learning the truth. I would unfriend him and pray for him. He clearly has an interest in bringing people out of God’s church, and will have to deny the truth to do that. I worry about people like him. It’s too bad he’s not wiling to listen to you.

I suspect the best Christian response right now is to put him on your daily prayer list for the next several years.

But at least ‘Richard’ is engaging in dialogue. Who knows, maybe WJL will say something that will soften Richard’s heart and lead him to at least become more accepting and therefore less “hateful” of Christians who do not worship a bible.

WJL - tell him you are, in fact, a firm believer that Jesus Christ is the ONLY way to salvation (as the Church teaches), and that you are convinced that Romans 8:38-39 is true. That is, that nothing (neither death, nor life, nor powers, nor creatures…) can separate you from the Love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Surely he would not suggest, as would be contrary to the KJVB, that the RCC (as much as he may despise it) can separate you from Christ?? Even if you were to be immersed in some Harlot-of-Babylon-Occult-like religion, if you were a genuine Christ-follower, the bible says that nothing can separate believers from Christ. Inasmuch as this is Richard’s dogma, he could not refute your position…

 

[WJL]

This is my latest response based mostly on the comments from everyone here:

In other words, you have no good responses to any of the facts that I presented to you and are unwilling to listen to truth …

Firstly, Richard, if I believed what you consider to be the “truth,” then you would not need to “help” me at all. The idea that someone cannot “help” another because they do not already believe the truth is not only silly, but unscriptural. It is precisely because the person does not already believe the truth that they would need the help. One who has truth does not need help from anyone in understanding it.

Secondly, the same passage which you quote (John 8:47) actually more aptly applies to you, due to your adherence to Protestantism, which is not of God, but, in reality is the nothing more than the machinations of a confused man named Martin Luther.

I believe and agree with ALL of the three points you made in your previous response. However, I have to ask you: by what means to you think that God preserved His words? It was the Catholic Church which you condemn while even knowing anything about it. Who do you think God gave the ability to perfectly interpret His perfect book, considering all the different interpretations?

I am already, in fact, a firm believer in God and Jesus Christ is the ONLY way to salvation (as the Church teaches), and am are convinced that the entire Bible (all 73 books). That means that I believe that Romans 8:38-39 is true. That is, that nothing (neither death, nor life, nor powers, nor creatures…) can separate me from the Love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Surely you would not suggest, as would be contrary to the KJV, that the RCC (as much as you may despise it) can separate anyone from Christ? If you are a genuine follower of Christ, the Bible says that nothing can separate believers from Christ.

Why can’t you answer any of the questions I posed to you? You are deliberately avoiding and ignoring them, Richard, and that is not Christian at all:

1 PETER 3:15

“… BE READY ALWAYS TO GIVE AN ANSWER TO EVERY MAN THAT ASKETH YOU A REASON OF THE HOPE THAT IS IN YOU …”

Throughout our discussion, I’ve been very charitable and respectful to you and actually took the time to respond to and answer each of your claims individually, yet you have not shown me the same respect. In fact, I strongly doubt that you even bothered to read any of the resources I sent to you.

You asked me where is “Catholic Church,” among other things, found in the Bible, and I answered them. I asked you: where is “King James” in the Bible? Where does it actually say “Bible” in the Bible? Where in the Bible does it say that only the KJV is the best translation? What about people of other languages? and you completely ignored them. That is very uncharitable, dishonest and unChristian.

I hope the next time that you reply that you could actually respond to these questions, or at least attempt to do so, instead of ignoring them.

As sad as it is to say, Richard, you have no real interest in learning the truth, despite how many times you quote the Bible out of context and claim to follow Christ:

MATTHEW 7:21-23

“Not every one that says unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name? and in your name have cast out demons? and in your name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity.”

It’s clear that your real interest in bringing people out of God’s Church, and you will have to deny the truth to do that. I worry about misguided people like you and for your souls, as by denying Christ’s Church, you deny Him.

 

[stewstew03]

 

[Incomplete]

But at least ‘Richard’ is engaging in dialogue. Who knows, maybe WJL will say something that will soften Richard’s heart and lead him to at least become more accepting and therefore less “hateful” of Christians who do not worship a bible.

WJL - tell him you are, in fact, a firm believer that Jesus Christ is the ONLY way to salvation (as the Church teaches), and that you are convinced that Romans 8:38-39 is true. That is, that nothing (neither death, nor life, nor powers, nor creatures…) can separate you from the Love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Surely he would not suggest, as would be contrary to the KJVB, that the RCC (as much as he may despise it) can separate you from Christ?? Even if you were to be immersed in some Harlot-of-Babylon-Occult-like religion, if you were a genuine Christ-follower, the bible says that nothing can separate believers from Christ. Inasmuch as this is Richard’s dogma, he could not refute your position…

Wow, you’ve done this before! This is such a great point.

And WJL, nice job!