U.S. and Nazi Germany

[bmaloy]

I don’t agree that congress can do nothing to change the law. A simple reading of the constitution clears that up. A certain political wing has enjoyed pandering to social hot button issues to get their vote out. If those issues were actually addressed they would loose those issues. Abortion, Mariage, Border Security.
All of these could be addressed and moved forward by a civil discourse but that would not serve to get the base rallied. I actually heard a person say that the WAR needs to be put on the back burner while these IMPORTANT issues are addressed. Even if we disagree there are points of common ground that can be used to move things forward. Sour grapes doesn’t help anything. IE if I cant outlaw abortion right now then I wont work with you to minimize the yearly death toll. It’s time to cool the speech and find common ground. No one LIKEs abortion. We all agree it is a tragedy (even liberals).

 

[corvidae]

It could only possibly be interpreted as racial discrimination if we accept that unborm babies are a separate race. A bit of a surprise to tell someone that when you think about it. I’d love to see the look on parents faces when you tell them that their unborn son or daughter is a different race from them! (I suspect the maternity unit would erupt into a war zone!)

Abortion could only be considered racially discriminative if it were only offered to one specific race of people based on the colour of their skin or ethnic background. (And you really shouldn’t need me to tell you that).

Umm, isn’t that what they are typically told. They are told that fetus is different from you or I, it isn’treally human, etc.

What I mean is this,
People were told that blacks were not really human, and so they could be kept as slaves.
People were told that Jews were not really human, and so they could be exterminated.
People are told that Fetuses are not really human, and so they may be aborted.

No, it is not strictly racism, but it is an -ism and uses the same tools.

A lone Raven

 

[puzzleannie]

This is probably asking for a smack in the mouth, but you won’t stop abortion by banning it or making it illegal. All that will happen then is you’ll return to the “backstreet abortionist” and women and along with the unborn will die in droves. An ironic position for any pro-life campaigner.
?

you know, you are probably right, we haven’t stopped murder by making it illegal, or drug smuggling, or robbery, or rape. let’s legalize all of it and tax it. Your argument makes as much sense as the other mindless comment often associated with this perverted logic: you can’t legislate morality.

 

[JimG]

Until society sees abortion as undesirable nothing realistic is going to change.

You are probably right about that. Perhaps we should listen to our nine year olds.

Nat Hentoff, my favorite pro-life atheist, recounted this incident in a recent article in Jewish World Review, about a friend whose physician husband performs abortions:

At the dinner table one recent evening, their 9-year-old son — having heard a word whose meaning he didn’t know — asked, “What is an abortion?” His mother, choosing her words carefully, described the procedure in simple terms.
“But,” said her son, “that means killing the baby.” The mother then explained that there are certain months during which an abortion cannot be performed, with very few exceptions. The 9-year-old shook his head. “But,” he said, “it doesn’t matter what month. It still means killing the babies.”

Source: Nat Hentoff, Jewish World Review, June 12, 2006: See here for complete article.

 

[OriginalJS]

I am struck by how these same arguments are constantly repeated decade after decade. The ultimate question is who is to be lawfully protected, the mother or the fetus. The extremist prochoice people say the mother; the extremist prolife people say the fetus. Both sides categorically reject the position of the other.

Most people I know view abortion as regrettable but as a private matter that is nobody’s business but the involved parties. I have never heard anyone say they liked abortion.

If my neighbor’s wife gets pregnant and decides to have an abortion, I don’t want to know about it, because it is none of my business. I don’t want to see laws enacted that would have her arrested, charged with murder - which is what the prolife people say abortion is - and sent to prison.

By the same token, if the neighbors already have more children than they seem to be able to support, it is none of my business if the wife gets pregnant again. I don’t want to see laws enacted, as I hear they are in China, limiting the number of children one can have and forcing abortions.

Let’s keep as much of our freedom as we can.

 

[JimG]

Abortion is always illegal at some point. Currently that point is complete birth, but there is a move to push the line further forward, perhaps to birth plus 60 days. At what point does it cease to be a private matter?

 

[2shelbys]

Sorry, I have to leave the discussion. I am in the mortgage business and our phones are ringing off the hook with calls from people in a panic wanting to refinance before the Market tanks and rates soar as a result of the Democrats winning Congress. The Dems track record on the economy does support their concerns but the rush of panic is not just surprising, it is amazing. It looks like we will be very busy for quite some time. Best wishes to all for a Merry Christmas & Happy New Year.

 

[JimG]

Sorry, I have to leave the discussion. I am in the mortgage business and our phones are ringing off the hook with calls from people in a panic wanting to refinance before the Market tanks and rates soar as a result of the Democrats winning Congress. The Dems track record on the economy does support their concerns but the rush of panic is not just surprising, it is amazing. It looks like we will be very busy for quite some time. Best wishes to all for a Merry Christmas & Happy New Year.

Ah, the joy of mortgage banking! Happy refi processing!

 

[wabrams]

Sorry, I have to leave the discussion. I am in the mortgage business and our phones are ringing off the hook with calls from people in a panic wanting to refinance before the Market tanks and rates soar as a result of the Democrats winning Congress. The Dems track record on the economy does support their concerns but the rush of panic is not just surprising, it is amazing. It looks like we will be very busy for quite some time. Best wishes to all for a Merry Christmas & Happy New Year.

So glad I got out of that busines back during the summer.

 

[theTaxCollector]

I am struck by how these same arguments are constantly repeated decade after decade. The ultimate question is who is to be lawfully protected, the mother or the fetus. The extremist prochoice people say the mother; the extremist prolife people say the fetus. Both sides categorically reject the position of the other.

Most people I know view abortion as regrettable but as a private matter that is nobody’s business but the involved parties. I have never heard anyone say they liked abortion.

If my neighbor’s wife gets pregnant and decides to have an abortion, I don’t want to know about it, because it is none of my business. I don’t want to see laws enacted that would have her arrested, charged with murder - which is what the prolife people say abortion is - and sent to prison.

By the same token, if the neighbors already have more children than they seem to be able to support, it is none of my business if the wife gets pregnant again. I don’t want to see laws enacted, as I hear they are in China, limiting the number of children one can have and forcing abortions.

Let’s keep as much of our freedom as we can.

If your neighbor beats or molests his children, is this your business? How about his wife? What about if he beats your other neighbor’s wife? Are you an ostrich?

 

[tamccrackine]

This is probably asking for a smack in the mouth, but you won’t stop abortion by banning it or making it illegal. All that will happen then is you’ll return to the “backstreet abortionist” and women and along with the unborn will die in droves. An ironic position for any pro-life campaigner.

Prove that this was a problem in the first place and it can be proven that this wasn’t the case at all in the first place. Most women went to actual docs to get these “backalley” abortions when abortion was illegal.

This argument is nothing more than a pro-abortionists attempt to invoke fear into someone and trying to humanize the actual act of abortion when it’s nothing more than murder.

Most of us know that we can’t stop abortion by banning it, just like providing condoms to kids didn’t stop teen pregnancies and STD’s. But at least with banning abortion, maybe we can put this country into a holding pattern to have people come to their senses as to what is right and what is wrong. And get people to realize that the family is the first foundation of society and when we’re ruining families through abortions and divorce, we ruin society.

 

[estesbob]

Prove that this was a problem in the first place and it can be proven that this wasn’t the case at all in the first place. Most women went to actual docs to get these “backalley” abortions when abortion was illegal.

Correct. This is one of those enduring myths. In the years prior to Roe over 90% of abortion were performed by licensed Doctors is sterile enviroments. In the last year before Roe was handed down maternal deaths from illegal abortions was about 400.

The truth is that the vast majortiy of deaths due to abortions was from infections. With the development of ani-biotics in the mid 1940’s deaths from abortions became rare. The primary cause of maternal deaths today come from hemoraging-usually because the abortionists sent her home too soon or the abortion mill failed to adequately inform her of the risks of taking RU-482.

 

[estesbob]

It isn’t? :bigyikes: It’s racial discrimination because it denies the child the right to live.

Abortion is just one component of racist philosophy known as eugencis-the elimination of the “inferior” races. Abortion in the US is promoted and performed among minorities at a much higher rate than it is among whites. As a result 25% of black children conceived every year are aborted.

It is even more egregious with the population control organizations. Their efforts are almost soley directed toward limiting the number of black, brown and yellow babies born

If all that aint racist i dont know what is!

 

[st_lucy]

I am struck by how these same arguments are constantly repeated decade after decade. The ultimate question is who is to be lawfully protected, the mother or the fetus. The extremist prochoice people say the mother; the extremist prolife people say the fetus. Both sides categorically reject the position of the other.

Most people I know view abortion as regrettable but as a private matter that is nobody’s business but the involved parties. I have never heard anyone say they liked abortion.

If my neighbor’s wife gets pregnant and decides to have an abortion, I don’t want to know about it, because it is none of my business. I don’t want to see laws enacted that would have her arrested, charged with murder - which is what the prolife people say abortion is - and sent to prison.

By the same token, if the neighbors already have more children than they seem to be able to support, it is none of my business if the wife gets pregnant again. I don’t want to see laws enacted, as I hear they are in China, limiting the number of children one can have and forcing abortions.

Let’s keep as much of our freedom as we can.

That funny that is exactly the same reaction the world had during the Rwanda massacre. It is always YOUR business when your next door neighbor is killing his or her children. If you do nothing than who is going to do something when your next on the list?

The killing of babies doesn’t just stop with the womb but it spreads to the elderly the severely sick to the unwanted. Lets hope that someone doesn’t turn a blind eye on you (if you ever land up in this situation) all for sake of FREEDOM!

 

[ncgolf]

Lets hope that someone doesn’t turn a blind eye on you (if you ever land up in this situation) all for sake of FREEDOM!

One of the problems we have is we really do not understand what freedom is.

I asked the question of some eighth graders what is freedom? They responded with “Do whatever you want”, “No one tells me what to do” … you get the idea. So I gave it to them. I told them that all eighth graders would get to go the local amusement park the next day and there would be no rules. You could not be arrested or get in any sort of trouble. We worked through it and determined how much fun it would be. Finally someone raised their hand and said “Can someone push me out of line?”. Sure I said why not … that person is free to do whatever they want. This went on until enough kids said “This really is not going to be much fun … we will spend all our time worrying about our safety”. We want some rules they said. … I told them what they were asking for was quite a change. I told them that rules, laws or commandments can make us more free not less. They were more free to enjoy their time at the park with rules and law. The looked at me wondering how they ended up wanting rules.

Same here … we totally do not understand what freedom is. So many have bought into the tying freedom to license to do whatever we want … it may be good in theory but does not work in practice. We cannot handle it.

 

[apricot_yogurt]

Originally Posted by bones_IV
It isn’t? It’s racial discrimination because it denies the child the right to live

Of course abortion is racial discrimination,as it discriminates against certain members of the human race