Ukraine Proseletising

[MichaelinMD]

Well, I guess the 2% of Non-Catholics Brazilians were the reason that Evangelicals had to proselytize Brazil.

Well…yes, I reckon. That, and the fact that’s been pointed out already that “… many protestants see the Apostolic faiths as heresy; in fact, they often refer to Catholics as pagans.” (See Aramis’ post above) If Catholics and Orthodox are not Christian then they need to be proselytized and converted, right?

 

[Peter_J]

The work of those who spread the Gospel in ANY country that doesn’t already have it is a very admirable thing. But to go to a Christian country and try to “convert” them sounds like a mission from the the DRD (Department of Redundancy Department).

Amen brother! “Pastoral activity in the Catholic Church, Latin as well as Eastern, no longer aims at having the faithful of one Church pass over to the other”

 

[josie_L]

Well…yes, I reckon. That, and the fact that’s been pointed out already that “… many protestants see the Apostolic faiths as heresy; in fact, they often refer to Catholics as pagans.” (See Aramis’ post above) If Catholics and Orthodox are not Christian then they need to be proselytized and converted, right?

And that was the point of my post, i.e., they think we’re “heretics”, ergo, they are not there just to evangelize the 5% or 2% of non-Christians/Catholics that subsist in the Phillippines and/or Brazil.

P.S. I’m well aware that the number of Catholics in Latin America are plummeting partly/mainly because of Christian missionaries in those parts. That’s why I referenced Brazil (Guatemala is even worse).

 

[MichaelinMD]

And that was the point of my post, i.e., they think we’re “heretics”, ergo, they are not there just to evangelize the 5% or 2% of non-Christians/Catholics that subsist in the Phillippines and/or Brazil.

P.S. I’m well aware that the number of Catholics in Latin America are plummeting partly/mainly because of Christian missionaries in those parts. That’s why I referenced Brazil (Guatemala is even worse).

Pesky, them prots, ain’ they? Seriously, though, I take your point and won’t quibble about it. Fact of the matter is, if Catholics and Orthodox were better catechized and stronger in their own faith protestant proselytizing would be far less of a threat, don’t you think? So, rather than blaming the protestants or complaining about their efforts, Catholics and Orthodox, from the top on down, would be far better served by strengthening our own faith and our own communities. I’ve heard rumblings about a “New Evangelization”, but it sounds awfully protestant to me . With what appears to be an increasing (or is it just ongoing?) “protestantization” of the Catholic Church in many places, we should be pointing fingers at ourselves, not our protestant brothers and sisters.

 

[josie_L]

Pesky, them prots, ain’ they? Seriously, though, I take your point and won’t quibble about it. Fact of the matter is, if Catholics and Orthodox were better catechized and stronger in their own faith protestant proselytizing would be far less of a threat, don’t you think? So, rather than blaming the protestants or complaining about their efforts, Catholics and Orthodox, from the top on down, would be far better served by strengthening our own faith and our own communities. I’ve heard rumblings about a “New Evangelization”, but it sounds awfully protestant to me . With what appears to be an increasing (or is it just ongoing?) “protestantization” of the Catholic Church in many places, we should be pointing fingers at ourselves, not our protestant brothers and sisters.

Yes, I agree that’s why I said “partly/mainly” because they wouldn’t have had so much sway (although they sometimes use material prosperity as a means to convert the populace) if Catholics weren’t lukewarm or were properly catechized.

 

[TK421]

They’re evangelicals. They’re doing what evangelicals do. America has a healthy population of them, and America has money. That means mission trips.

It’s a double-edged sword because atheistic communism left a heavy scar on the Eastern bloc. A depressing, vacant, apatheist attitude still infects the air, and this is the sort of thing that can fire people up. The historical churches might lose some parishioners but they’ll have more fire in their blood then they once did.

 

[coptsoldier]

Freedom of religion. I say bring it on. the One Holy Catholic Church is the true faith, and as Such I dont fear no counterfiet, regardless of how attractive or wealthy. Greater catechism classes will solve this.

 

[Vico]

Freedom of religion. I say bring it on. the One Holy Catholic Church is the true faith, and as Such I dont fear no counterfiet, regardless of how attractive or wealthy. Greater catechism classes will solve this.

This is what happened in Romania. The Eastern Orthodox there were beseiged by political changes and the Protestants made many conversions of them. From that conflict came the Romanian Greek Catholic Church.As the Ottomans lost their hold in Central Europe, the Hapsburg emperor of Austria hastened to fill the void, assuming control of Transylvania in 1688. Though nominally affirming the principality’s confessional balance, Emperor Leopold I encouraged the Jesuits, the vanguard of the Catholic Reformation, to reopen their schools (which had been shuttered by the Protestants), thereby reinvigorating Roman Catholicism. Eager to keep in check the successes of the Jesuits, the Protestants boosted their work among the Romanian Orthodox serfs.

Union and schism. Alarmed by the activities of the Protestant churches and encouraged by the Jesuits, Transylvania’s Romanian Orthodox leaders convoked a synod in 1697. There they agreed in principle to unite with the Church of Rome, provided the diet and the emperor recognized the principality’s Romanians as an “accepted” nation with legal rights.

At a liturgy in October 1698, Metropolitan Atanasie Anghel accepted the Act of Union, having been assured of his people’s emancipation and the extension to his clergy of the same rights and privileges granted to the Roman Catholic clergy.

In September 1700, delegates representing some 2,000 priests and lay leaders throughout Transylvania formally ratified the union.

From ONE Magazine – profiles The Romanian Church United With Rome, by Michael J.L. La Civita

cnewa.org/default.aspx?ID=3221&pagetypeID=4&sitecode=HQ&pageno=1

 

[skeyes]

Being a “MK”, I have a little insight into Baptist missionaries in Honduras. My parents served in Honduras as missionaries for 30 years. I was there for the first 11 or 12 years. The focus of the ministry was certainly not to practicing Catholics but to people who were Catholic in name only. Most had never even been Baptized.

I know that my parents loved God. They also loved to present the Lord to people who were not practicing. They presented God to people in a positive manner. I never in all my years of seeing my parents work for God heard them say anything negative about anyone’s traditional faith.

Having said this, i can imagine that some people who were Catholics in Honduras, may have had a problem with people who were not Catholic having such a positive affect on the country.

I can answer more questions, should anyone have a question, but I just wanted to say that many positive things have been done by Baptist in countries that were traditionally Catholic. It is our fault that we never catechised our people or built schools or many of the other things that Baptist have done in many countries all over the world.

As far as Iraq is concerned, a Baptist missionary couple who had served alongside my parents in Honduras, was asked to go to Iraq during the early part of the war there. They were both killed while in Iraq.

In His service,

Stan

 

[atanyal]

Baptist have been in Ukraine for a while now.

The Anabaptist’s arrived in Ukraine in the 16th Century.

The first baptism took place in 1864. They have 20,000 young people enrolled in Baptist Universities.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptists_in_Ukraine

 

[Scitor]

I do believe I said THE VAST MAJORITY went to countries that were already Christian. I did in no way intend to include ALL.

The work of those who spread the Gospel in ANY country that doesn’t already have it is a very admirable thing. But to go to a Christian country and try to “convert” them sounds like a mission from the the DRD (Department of Redundancy Department).

There’s a high profile missionary, (whose son is a high profile prefessional football player who can’t seem to get a job in the NFL), that has invested YEARS of his life in the Philippines trying to convert the native people. According to a quick web-search of mine; 80% of the people are Catholic, and another 15% are Protestant. Who is he trying to convert? The remaining 5%?

rfournier…i can tell that you are either very ignorant of the facts or intentionally spewing statements because you think that by writing them it gives them some sort of credibility.

First, Protestant missionary work in any country is focused on those who have not heard the gospel. And whether you believe it or not, there are many people in countries such as Brazil, Colombia, and other heavily Catholic countries that have not heard the gospel. And yes, this may include many people born Catholic but have no association with the Catholic Church. Our missionary work in no way targets other Christian religions in hopes of converting them. With that said, just by the nature of our missionary work, we have had many Catholics come to us with questions about our faith.

Second, as far as Protestant missionaries in hostile countries such as Iraq, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Indonesia, etc., you are once again very misinformed. We have very high conviction in our faith and more than willing to put our money where our mouth is…ARE YOU! Please tell me, how many Catholic missionaries are in Iraq/Pakistan/Afghanistan. Do you know?

Third, as far as the NFL player you are referring to, it sounds like bc he is Protestant you are happy he is no longer in the NFL. I wonder if you would have said the same thing if he was Catholic. And yes…the focus is on the unpreached 5%.

It amazes me how Catholics are offended by Protestant missionary work. Instead of trying to make it a competition why not pray that both Catholics and Protestants reach as many non-reached people as possible.

Quick question…say there was a group of people who have never heard the gospel of Jesus Christ. And the only option for them to hear the gospel was to hear it from a Protestant missionary. Would you prefer they hear the gospel from the Protestant or not hear the gospel bc it was not being introduced to them by a Catholic?

 

[Scitor]

Well, I guess the 2% of Non-Catholics Brazilians were the reason that Evangelicals had to proselytize Brazil.

Sorry…but you are incorrect on your stats Josie: Roman Catholic (nominal) 73.6%, Protestant 15.4%, Spiritualist 1.3%, Bantu/Voodoo 0.3%, other 1.8%, unspecified 0.2%, none 7.4% (2000 census).

And from spending some time in Brazil, I will tell you that many of the 73.6% who call themselves Catholic, well, if I were Catholic, I would be embarrassed.

 

[Scitor]

Pesky, them prots, ain’ they? Seriously, though, I take your point and won’t quibble about it. Fact of the matter is, if Catholics and Orthodox were better catechized and stronger in their own faith protestant proselytizing would be far less of a threat, don’t you think? So, rather than blaming the protestants or complaining about their efforts, Catholics and Orthodox, from the top on down, would be far better served by strengthening our own faith and our own communities. I’ve heard rumblings about a “New Evangelization”, but it sounds awfully protestant to me . With what appears to be an increasing (or is it just ongoing?) “protestantization” of the Catholic Church in many places, we should be pointing fingers at ourselves, not our protestant brothers and sisters.

Well said and very true.

 

[MichaelinMD]

us).

And from spending some time in Brazil, I will tell you that many of the 73.6% who call themselves Catholic, well, if I were Catholic, I would be embarrassed.

I could say that about plenty of “Catholics”, lay and otherwise, right here in the good ol’ U.S. of A., much to my chagrin. And in all honesty, have probably been one of “them” myself, more than once.

 

[twf]

I think we should send thousands of Priests and Bishops to Alabama to bring the Baptists to Christ.

Yes a reader in my parish started out as a “church of Christ” missioner to Romania.

Yes, I think I should get together a group of well financed and energetic Catholic youths and plan a mission trip to the heart of Mississippi to introduce those poor lost Baptist souls to the Eucharistic Christ .

 

[Scitor]

Yes, I think I should get together a group of well financed and energetic Catholic youths and plan a mission trip to the heart of Mississippi to introduce those poor lost Baptist souls to the Eucharistic Christ .

twf…the result would likely be the opposite of what you expect. Please, bring as many Catholics to the Bible Belt. You may be surprised when many of those Catholic missionaries end up staying, putting off a reliance of works, and putting on a faith by grace.

 

[Peter_J]

twf…the result would likely be the opposite of what you expect. Please, bring as many Catholics to the Bible Belt. You may be surprised when many of those Catholic missionaries end up staying, putting off a reliance of works, and putting on a faith by grace.

Scitor, wrt this post I would just say, , nobody likes a copycat:

Yes a reader in my parish started out as a “church of Christ” missioner to Romania.

 

[Miserissima]

twf…the result would likely be the opposite of what you expect. Please, bring as many Catholics to the Bible Belt. You may be surprised when many of those Catholic missionaries end up staying, putting off a reliance of works, and putting on a faith by grace.

This would deserve its own thread…but aren’t there enough already?

 

[Scitor]

Scitor, wrt this post I would just say, , nobody likes a copycat:

Peter J…I have no clue what “wrt” means, nor do I have any clue what you mean by “nobody likes a copycat.”

Actually, I have no clue what point you are trying to make with your post. I am a simple guy. You need to be more clear for me to understand.

 

[andrewstx]

Peter J…I have no clue what “wrt” means, nor do I have any clue what you mean by “nobody likes a copycat.”

Actually, I have no clue what point you are trying to make with your post. I am a simple guy. You need to be more clear for me to understand.

It means With Regards To.