UN delight over election

[Digitonomy]

The following article isn’t really newsworthy to most people. However, we so often hear a few claim that the UN never accomplishes anything. I thought I might as well give them an opportunity to belittle the Iraqi election.

Celebration Seeps Through Diplomatic Reaction at U.N.
By WARREN HOGE
New York Times
Published: January 30, 2005

UNITED NATIONS, Jan. 30 - For Carina Perelli, the head of the United Nations’ electoral assistance division, the confirmation of her belief that the turnout of voters in Iraq would exceed skeptics’ predictions came at 3 a.m. today as she monitored reports in her office from staff members in Baghdad…

In the hours immediately afterward, she said, two other reinforcing developments emerged. “One was reports from our guys that when there was any sort of armed incident in line, the people would scatter but when the security people had stabilized the situation, they, instead of going home, would return to the line,” she said…

She said she could make no official pronouncements on the United Nations’ reaction to its effort in Iraq, which had come under criticism for being inadequately staffed, other than to say that she was cheered by the outcome and proud of her workers in Iraq…

 

[Lance]

digitonomy:

The following article isn’t really newsworthy to most people. However, we so often hear a few claim that the UN never accomplishes anything. I thought I might as well give them an opportunity to belittle the Iraqi election.

The elections in Iraq were not a UN accomplishment but US accomplishment. If it had been left up to the UN Sadam and his evil sons would still be ruling Iraq. I am glad the UN helped monotor the voting but they had absolutly nothing to do with the fact that the Iraqi’s are having a free election.

 

[Fitz]

Lance:

The elections in Iraq were not a UN accomplishment but US accomplishment. If it had been left up to the UN Sadam and his evil sons would still be ruling Iraq. I am glad the UN helped monotor the voting but they had absolutly nothing to do with the fact that the Iraqi’s are having a free election.

I agree, they came late to the effort. It was ridiculous to even mention them.

 

[Digitonomy]

Lance:

The elections in Iraq were not a UN accomplishment but US accomplishment.

The elections happened, and were successful, because al-Sistani endorsed them. Who did he refuse to meet with? Representatives of occupying forces. Who did he agree to meet with? UN representatives. Who then hashed out the current election plan which was so successful.

The UN killed the US plan of having caucuses throughout the country because it really wasn’t workable. They then convinced Sistani that his plan for immediate elections was unfeasible. They then trained the personnel on the Independent Electoral Commission of Iraq on all the particulars needed to conduct the election in their country.

The success of this election is due in large part to the UN. If you prefer to see them as a tool used by the US, fine. I agree. What baffles me is that some want to give that tool away entirely, to the French, Chinese, etc.

 

[gilliam]

Things would have gone a lot smoother in Iraq yesterday if the UN actually had a quantity of people on the ground instead of watching the election from their own countries.

 

[Lance]

What part of the ‘Iraqi elections were a direct result of US action and if the UN had had their way Sadam would still be controlling Iraq’ is it that you, digitonomy, do not understand?

 

[HagiaSophia]

digitonomy:

What baffles me is that some want to give that tool away entirely, to the French, Chinese, etc.

I don’t just want to give it away - like grease in my sink, I’d like to dissolve it. Failing that, move it out of here - a Third World country is where it belongs with a smaller personal budget, less administration,m and limited to emergency food relief - although from reading blogs of those there working with the UN officials, they seem to be more of a hindrance even in that regard rather than a help.

 

[Digitonomy]

gilliam:

Things would have gone a lot smoother in Iraq yesterday if the UN actually had a quantity of people on the ground instead of watching the election from their own countries.

That’s probably true. Hopefully by the next election security will be improved enough to allow that.

 

[Digitonomy]

HagiaSophia:

I don’t just want to give it away - like grease in my sink, I’d like to dissolve it.

And this is what I don’t understand. In most cases we are able to block the UN when we oppose their notions, and in most cases we are able to get them to go along with our decisions. So we are able to indirectly get the endorsement of our enemies, and block many of their machinations.

On the other hand, we can withdraw and allow other countries to become more dominant at the UN. Kind of like a giant EU, but with Russia and China thrown in, and their decisions having the implicit endorsement of our other allies, like Canada, Australia, Mexico. What’s the logic in that?

 

[HagiaSophia]

digitonomy:

And this is what I don’t understand. In most cases we are able to block the UN when we oppose their notions, and in most cases we are able to get them to go along with our decisions. So we are able to indirectly get the endorsement of our enemies, and block many of their machinations.

On the other hand, we can withdraw and allow other countries to become more dominant at the UN. Kind of like a giant EU, but with Russia and China thrown in, and their decisions having the implicit endorsement of our other allies, like Canada, Australia, Mexico. What’s the logic in that?

The logic is that it does not serve the best interests of the US in its relations with other nations or as a sovereign state. It propagates all kinds of other issues, it has become a hydra head spreading its tentatcles everywhere. If other nations want to meet and call it the UN let them host it, their lousey reps and get us out of it. They are corrupt, venal, and a 5th column to anyone who prizes freedom, national sovereignity and justice. The sooner it goes away the better. It’s broken and IMO can’t be fixed. Get rid of it.

 

[gilliam]

digitonomy:

That’s probably true. Hopefully by the next election security will be improved enough to allow that.

Ha! They had it this time. If they had the guts to try.

I guess that is easy for me to say, sitting here in the States. Yea, maybe next time. But for now, they are in no position to make any comments one way or the other.

 

[Digitonomy]

gilliam:

I guess that is easy for me to say, sitting here in the States. Yea, maybe next time. But for now, they are in no position to make any comments one way or the other.

I think that having organized the process, rejected unrealistic demands of major players, cajoled parties into accepting the process, and trained the workers, they are certainly justified in being pleased with the outcome so far.

 

[Matt25]

HagiaSophia:

The logic is that it does not serve the best interests of the US in its relations with other nations or as a sovereign state. It propagates all kinds of other issues, it has become a hydra head spreading its tentatcles everywhere. If other nations want to meet and call it the UN let them host it, their lousey reps and get us out of it. They are corrupt, venal, and a 5th column to anyone who prizes freedom, national sovereignity and justice. The sooner it goes away the better. It’s broken and IMO can’t be fixed. Get rid of it.

cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=34993

Vatican envoy urges reforms to strengthen UN

  New York, Feb. 01 (CWNews.com) - The Vatican's permanent representative at the UN has called for reforms that would give that organization greater authority and ability to defend world peace.

In an address to the UN General Assembly on January 31, Archbishop Celestino Migliore recommended “the streamlining and adaptation” of the UN, saying that reforms are essential if the international body is to fulfill its mission. The archbishop said that the Holy See would support effective reform, since the Vatican has high hopes for the UN’s role as a guarantor of world peace.

Among the possible reforms suggested in Archbishop Migliore’s speech were strengthening the secretariat, updating the UN electoral system, and settling the criteria for membership on the Security Council.

The Vatican envoy also called for more discussion within the UN on the use of military force in self-defense. He said that “legitimate defense must place particular focus on people and their safety.” The archbishop explained that while the Church recognizes the right of every government to undertake military action in its own defense, any such defensive action must be designed to protect civilians. This is also true, he said, of “humanitarian intervention” undertaken on behalf of other third parties.

 

[Matt25]

smh.com.au/news/After-Saddam/Attempted-fraud-delays-Iraqi-election-result/2005/02/10/1107890348678.html

Attempted fraud delays Iraqi election result

February 11, 2005




 A public recount of hundreds of disputed ballot boxes will delay the final results for Iraq's elections, leaving the shape of the first democratically chosen government in doubt for at least a few more days.

On Wednesday election officials displayed a large stack of ballots and ballot boxes that had been ruled invalid. Boxes appeared to have been hastily stuffed with forged ballots, and heaps of ballots in sacks and cartons revealed an apparent attempt to falsify votes on a large scale. 3

Farid Ayar, a member of Iraq’s election commission, said gunmen had taken some of the boxes from polling booths and returned them full of ballots.

He would not say what parties had received forged votes. But all the materials on display came from Nineveh province, in the north, where Kurds, Arabs, Christians, Turkomans and other groups are in a bitter struggle for power. He said the recount would focus on about 300 other ballot boxes, but would not say where they had come from or what the problems were.

Although the commission has repeatedly sought to downplay the seriousness of the problems on election day, the disputes have received heavy coverage in the Arab news media.

The lack of security that led to some of the election problems continues to be an issue. Yesterday a car bomb exploded at a crowded intersection in central Baghdad, killing at least three people and wounding four. Police said the target was not clear.

freep.com/news/nw/iraq10e_20050210.htm

BY TOM LASSETER
FREE PRESS FOREIGN CORRESPONDENT

BAGHDAD, Iraq – Iraqi election officials delayed Wednesday announcing official results by several days to allow a recount of about 150,000 votes and sort through thousands more that won’t be counted because of irregularities.

Also, postelection violence mounted Wednesday, reinforcing fears that the Jan. 30 elections, in which millions of voters risked their lives to cast ballots, hadn’t impeded the insurgency.

Iraqi electoral officials had said earlier in the week that the final vote count would be announced by today. Election commission spokesman Farid Ayar said Wednesday that officials didn’t know when the recount would be completed.

According to partial results released earlier this week, the Shi’ite Muslim cleric-led United Iraqi Alliance was ahead, with more than 2.3 million votes. A coalition of Kurdish parties was second, with more than 1.1 million votes. Interim Prime Minister Ayad Allawi’s slate was third, at 620,459 votes.

It’s impossible to gauge the potential impact of uncounted votes or ballots slated for recount because voting officials haven’t said how many Iraqis voted and haven’t released totals from Baghdad, Basra or Mosul, the country’s largest cities.

At issue in the recount are 300 boxes, of about 500 ballots each, which Iraqi electoral commission member Adel al-Lami said were flagged for problems. The boxes, he said, were in many cases accompanied by tally sheets that didn’t add up to the numbers of votes inside. In other instances, he said, the boxes were from provinces where voter turnout was low, but the boxes were stuffed full of ballots.

The recount may suggest that monitoring procedures for the counting process are working, although the voting was marred by charges of irregularities.