Understanding each other for Christ's sake...

[2nd_Adam]

I think Catholic Christians and Protestant Christians have great difficulties understanding each other, in what we believe as Christians. We need to make an effort to hear each other as fellow Christians. I believe you will find that we have much more in common then you realize. This is a thread to help each other learn about what each other actually believes in regards to the Christian Faith. Our doctrinal distinctives are very important, but it should not divide us in a hostile way. We are called to love one another, in spite of our doctrinal distinctives. What belief do we need clarity on? The motive here is to help us see each other as fellow Christians… so we can grow in our affection and love for God.

 

[Love_is_Patient]

I think Catholic Christians and Protestant Christians have great difficulties understanding each other, in what we believe as Christians. We need to make an effort to hear each other as fellow Christians. I believe you will find that we have much more in common then you realize. This is a thread to help each other learn about what each other actually believes in regards to the Christian Faith. Our doctrinal distinctives are very important, but it should not divide us in a hostile way. We are called to love one another, in spite of our doctrinal distinctives. What belief do we need clarity on? The motive here is to help us see each other as fellow Christians… so we can grow in our affection and love for God.

The end of hostility is the beginning of respect.

I’m afraid I haven’t yet seen you respect the Catholic faith. I hope that in time you come to do so.

Love is Patient

 

[redeemedatcross]

Thank you 2nd Adam for posting this. It’s so nice to see the Pope admitting that justification through faith alone is sufficient. I particularly love the ways that he defines “true” faith at the end of his speech or letter whatever it was! If our faith is the same for Catholics and Non-Catholics alike - then obviously we are both justified through Jesus Christ alone. If we are both justified - then we will with the help of the Holy Spirit be sanctified. If we will both be sanctified then what do we really need to argue about? Nothing! Peace to all of my fellow universal believers!

 

[2nd_Adam]

The end of hostility is the beginning of respect.

I’m afraid I haven’t yet seen you respect the Catholic faith. I hope that in time you come to do so.

Love is Patient

I’m sorry that is your perception. Maybe if you spend some time on a Protestant Forum site, you might see my postings in a different light?

 

[2nd_Adam]

Thank you 2nd Adam for posting this. It’s so nice to see the Pope admitting that justification through faith alone is sufficient. I particularly love the ways that he defines “true” faith at the end of his speech or letter whatever it was! If our faith is the same for Catholics and Non-Catholics alike - then obviously we are both justified through Jesus Christ alone. If we are both justified - then we will with the help of the Holy Spirit be sanctified. If we will both be sanctified then what do we really need to argue about? Nothing! Peace to all of my fellow universal believers!

Thanks for your posting! It is only by the Spirit of God that Christians grown in the grace and knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ together with those other Christians from another Christian community. I believe if Protestants spent more time studying church history, and Catholics spent additional time in the Scriptures, Christian unity would grow.

 

[PAboy57]

I have many friends outside the catholic faith. It has never caused a problem because we have respect for each other. We all can debate who is right, etc but in the end He will decide. If everyone actually practiced what their religion tells them, society would be pretty nice.

For myself I am partial to the frequency catholics may receive some of the sacraments. God knows I need all the help I can get.

Hopefully we all will get home someday.

 

[Smart30]

My personal opinion is that Protestant is the only true way to go, the only proper way to open the Bible and let God speak through His Word.

Unfortunately, my mom is not all that religious and my grandma is a Catholic. I was baptized Catholic but have never been a Catholic, I have always chosen to be a Protestant.

My mom also falls under the category of being a Protestant.

I’ve tried all my life to accept Catholics as one in the same with Protestants, but that simply is not the case. And no offense to any Roman Catholics here, but I absolutely hate the idea and the person of the Pope, calling a mortal man “Holy father” is heresy to me. He is not a representative of God on Earth.

I honestly do not think the battle between both will ever end.

 

[2nd_Adam]

I have many friends outside the catholic faith. It has never caused a problem because we have respect for each other. We all can debate who is right, etc but in the end He will decide. If everyone actually practiced what their religion tells them, society would be pretty nice.

For myself I am partial to the frequency catholics may receive some of the sacraments. God knows I need all the help I can get.

Hopefully we all will get home someday.

Let’s make this thread our unity thread, discussing our unity as compared to our differences. I need all the help that I can get too!

 

[2nd_Adam]

My personal opinion is that Protestant is the only true way to go, the only proper way to open the Bible and let God speak through His Word.

Unfortunately, my mom is not all that religious and my grandma is a Catholic. I was baptized Catholic but have never been a Catholic, I have always chosen to be a Protestant.

My mom also falls under the category of being a Protestant.

I’ve tried all my life to accept Catholics as one in the same with Protestants, but that simply is not the case. And no offense to any Roman Catholics here, but I absolutely hate the idea and the person of the Pope, calling a mortal man “Holy father” is heresy to me. He is not a representative of God on Earth.

I honestly do not think the battle between both will ever end.

Let’s take away the words of Catholic and Protestant. What makes us a Christian?

 

[Smart30]

Let’s take away the words of Catholic and Protestant. What makes us a Christian?

Catholic/Protestant are not just words, they define how and why you worship God and in what way. They also determine whether you have a higher authority on earth or in Heaven. Whether you take God’s Word to heart or let some other man/men determine what has been said.

What makes up a Christian:
Accepting God’s Word as infallible, every single letter is from God and is inspired.
God has presented Himself in one way ever since creating us in the garden of Eden
God has ordained all parts of society ranging from Law to Morality.
The Father has sent His only Son to die on Calvary’s Cross for our sins, so that we can be regenerated and born-again, free of our sin and dead on Earth.
Accepting Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior who died for your sins and is the Mediator between the human and the Father.
Lastly, though not a tenant of the Christian faith, we are to make disciples of all nations. (ie, preach/evangelize)

That is short and brief, but the most important parts of the faith. Going to Church, reading the Bible, worshiping God/giving glory to God are all important, but they are not demanded. We are to have the Holy Spirit live in us and enrich our earthly lives so that we grow in spiritual intelligence.

 

[nsper7]

Catholic/Protestant are not just words, they define how and why you worship God and in what way. They also determine whether you have a higher authority on earth or in Heaven. Whether you take God’s Word to heart or let some other man/men determine what has been said.

That’s a knock on the Catholic Church right there and you wonder why we get pissed off.

 

[Love_is_Patient]

I’m sorry that is your perception. Maybe if you spend some time on a Protestant Forum site, you might see my postings in a different light?

I’m afraid it’s not just my perception, though.

Also, I’m puzzled at your suggestion that I visit a Protestant forum. What do you mean by that?

Love is Patient

 

[spoiltvictorian]

This all sounds nice, but here’s the deal.

Understanding each other for Christ’s sake…

I believe you will find that we have much more in common then you realize.

Some great effort has been made to help you understand that some churches/denominations have less in common than you realize. As long as you make things like joint declarations, lower-c catholic, etc., the foundations of your dialog here you’re not going to find true mutual understanding. That’s because you’re assuming common ground where it doesn’t really exist, at least, not in the sense you’re claiming it exists.

So…

This is a thread to help each other learn about what each other actually believes in regards to the Christian Faith.

What belief do we need clarity on?

The motive here is to help us see each other as fellow Christians… so we can grow in our affection and love for God.

I think you need clarity on the extent of the real and serious differences between various Christian denominations, especially between the Catholic Church and the Reformed churches. And you need to understand that our love for Christ doesn’t depend on seeing people as Christians if they aren’t. I’m not saying your opponents aren’t Christians or that you’re not a Christian, just that seeing others as Christians isn’t how we grow in love for Christ. You may be thinking of seeing others as neighbors or treating people like we would treat Christ. Those Christians are to do to all men, not just Christians.

Here’s the catch: since your theology is causing you to make these errors about ecumenicalism, I don’t expect you to agree with this post. Not really sure what to do about that.

 

[redeemedatcross]

To everyone posting on this forum:

2nd Adam did not start this thread to discuss doctrinal differences.
I believe he started it so that we could come together and discuss the joys of being justified through faith-the way that everyone here has been. We should celebrate the fact that we ALL believe that Christ died so that we may have eternal life. Isn’t that the bottom line? No matter how we came to that conclusion or what building we choose to praise Him for that exact reason is not a matter of life or death. It is only by faith in Him that we are saved and that is why we are united in Jesus Christ. PERIOD!

 

[whm]

Catholic/Protestant are not just words, they define how and why you worship God and in what way. They also determine whether you have a higher authority on earth or in Heaven. Whether you take God’s Word to heart or let some other man/men determine what has been said.

What makes up a Christian:
Accepting God’s Word as infallible, every single letter is from God and is inspired.
God has presented Himself in one way ever since creating us in the garden of Eden
God has ordained all parts of society ranging from Law to Morality.
The Father has sent His only Son to die on Calvary’s Cross for our sins, so that we can be regenerated and born-again, free of our sin and dead on Earth.
Accepting Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior who died for your sins and is the Mediator between the human and the Father.
Lastly, though not a tenant of the Christian faith, we are to make disciples of all nations. (ie, preach/evangelize)

That is short and brief, but the most important parts of the faith. Going to Church, reading the Bible, worshiping God/giving glory to God are all important, but they are not demanded. We are to have the Holy Spirit live in us and enrich our earthly lives so that we grow in spiritual intelligence.

I think what Adam2 is asking is that we take a second, step back and not “loose the forest for the trees”

There are many many things that unite us that are good. Should we bicker among ourselves while the atheists take over our school, government and culture?

Lets start with your 5th statement “The Father has sent His only Son to die on Calvary’s Cross for our sins” This is something we can all agree and appreciate.

Morality - This is interesting to me, the churches with the strictest morality (a good thing!) seem to attack each other the most.

Evangelize - These forums (really all internet forums) are often full of smugness, bickering, gotchas, straw-man arguments and debating tactics, that come across as sour and don’t convince the other side because it does not come across a christian. Why would somebody be attracted to a belief if the person representing said belief is like that?

Peace

 

[2nd_Adam]

Catholic/Protestant are not just words, they define how and why you worship God and in what way. They also determine whether you have a higher authority on earth or in Heaven. Whether you take God’s Word to heart or let some other man/men determine what has been said.

What makes up a Christian:
Accepting God’s Word as infallible, every single letter is from God and is inspired.
God has presented Himself in one way ever since creating us in the garden of Eden
God has ordained all parts of society ranging from Law to Morality.
The Father has sent His only Son to die on Calvary’s Cross for our sins, so that we can be regenerated and born-again, free of our sin and dead on Earth.
Accepting Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior who died for your sins and is the Mediator between the human and the Father.
Lastly, though not a tenant of the Christian faith, we are to make disciples of all nations. (ie, preach/evangelize)

That is short and brief, but the most important parts of the faith. Going to Church, reading the Bible, worshiping God/giving glory to God are all important, but they are not demanded. We are to have the Holy Spirit live in us and enrich our earthly lives so that we grow in spiritual intelligence.

Like the Apostle Paul, we all know in part. God commands us to grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ through HIs ordained means. Salvation is certainly a process. In Ephesians 4, we are given teachers and pastors to grow us up into Christ who is the head. We are to mature in Christ, but we are saved as babes in Christ. We are not saved by perfect theology and perfect doctrine. Both Catholics and Protestants are sinners in process, being changed into the image of Christ. I am a Christian first, Evangelical second, and a Reformed Christian third. All that matters is being united to Christ, or a new creation. Here is a challenge to you as my Protestant brother in Christ. Where in Scripture does it say that “we must accept Jesus as Lord and Savior”? I think the real question is how a Holy God is able to accept us the sinner who is in rebellion against Him? Christ and Him crucified is the centrality of Christianity and the unifying truth.

 

[2nd_Adam]

This all sounds nice, but here’s the deal.

Some great effort has been made to help you understand that some churches/denominations have less in common than you realize. As long as you make things like joint declarations, lower-c catholic, etc., the foundations of your dialog here you’re not going to find true mutual understanding. That’s because you’re assuming common ground where it doesn’t really exist, at least, not in the sense you’re claiming it exists.

So…

I think you need clarity on the extent of the real and serious differences between various Christian denominations, especially between the Catholic Church and the Reformed churches. And you need to understand that our love for Christ doesn’t depend on seeing people as Christians if they aren’t. I’m not saying your opponents aren’t Christians or that you’re not a Christian, just that seeing others as Christians isn’t how we grow in love for Christ. You may be thinking of seeing others as neighbors or treating people like we would treat Christ. Those Christians are to do to all men, not just Christians.

Here’s the catch: since your theology is causing you to make these errors about ecumenicalism, I don’t expect you to agree with this post. Not really sure what to do about that.

Let’s please start with the two ECT agreements and build on those documents. Let me know what you think about that work.

seekgod.ca/ect3.htm

seekgod.ca/ect2.htm

The ECT Statement taken from Christianity Today, December 8, 1997, pp. 35-77

EVANGELICALS AND CATHOLICS TOGETHER: THE GIFT OF SALVATION

For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God sent the Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him. (John 3:16-17)

We give thanks to God that in recent years many Evangelicals and Catholics, ourselves among them, have been able to express a common faith in Christ and so to acknowledge one another as brothers and sisters in Christ. We confess together one God, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit; we confess Jesus Christ the Incarnate Son of God; we affirm the binding authority of Holy Scripture, God’s inspired Word; and we acknowledge the Apostles’ and Nicene creeds as faithful witnesses to that Word.

The effectiveness of our witness for Christ depends upon the work of the Holy Spirit, who calls and empowers us to confess together the meaning of the salvation promised and accomplished in Christ Jesus our Lord. Through prayer and study of Holy Scripture, and aided by the Church’s reflection on the sacred text from earliest times, we have found that, notwithstanding some persistent and serious differences, we can together bear witness to the gift of salvation in Jesus Christ. To this saving gift we now testify, speaking not for, but from and to, our several communities… (read both links above)

 

[rev_kevin]

I think Catholic Christians and Protestant Christians have great difficulties understanding each other, in what we believe as Christians. We need to make an effort to hear each other as fellow Christians. I believe you will find that we have much more in common then you realize. This is a thread to help each other learn about what each other actually believes in regards to the Christian Faith. Our doctrinal distinctives are very important, but it should not divide us in a hostile way. We are called to love one another, in spite of our doctrinal distinctives. What belief do we need clarity on? The motive here is to help us see each other as fellow Christians… so we can grow in our affection and love for God.

I agree. If we just would have a open mind and listen to eachother instead of bickering and arguing with who’s religion is right we may learn that we all have a lot in common. Seems that neither wants to listen to the other, which is a shame. This bickering and arguing is unnecessary and childish to say the least. Now I have done my share of this but its only because of being attacked first. See we are all adults and need to act like it. I think if we would just listen instead of having closed ears and minds we would be able to get somewhere in our communiction and understand eachother.

 

[Love_is_Patient]

I agree. If we just would have a open mind and listen to eachother instead of bickering and arguing with who’s religion is right we may learn that we all have a lot in common. Seems that neither wants to listen to the other, which is a shame. This bickering and arguing is unnecessary and childish to say the least. Now I have done my share of this but its only because of being attacked first. See we are all adults and need to act like it. I think if we would just listen instead of having closed ears and minds we would be able to get somewhere in our communiction and understand eachother.

Ok. I’ll take you up on that offer.

5 things I admire about non-denom Protestants:

1. Emphasis on youth ministry
2. Evangelical outreach
3. Emphasis on Bible study
4. Strong church community
5. Support for families and morality

Can I answer any questions you have about Catholics?

Love is Patient

 

[guanophore]

That’s a knock on the Catholic Church right there and you wonder why we get pissed off.

Yes, I found these comments offensive as well. However, to the credit of the OP, even though he does share them, they are not his comments.