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elwill
Guest
what about new thread for discussing his dicoveries , i will be happy to discuss what he have
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Alcrusader
Guest
Man It’s even worse…AlCrusader,
In bringing up the dhimmi, I was talking about the historical treatment of Christians & Jews by muslims.Basically less than 2nd class, institutional discrimination, not really even citizens in their own land, liable to be mistreated or killed with no reason or warning. Some place, sometimes, they were treated ok but most places & most times they were not. I am quite sure you are familiar. I see you are in Lebanon. You KNOW what is going on & you are trying to warn us. I appreciate it & that is why I said you are my new favorite poster. Lebanon has a special place in my heart & what has/is happening there is heartbreaking. Your country took in the Palestinians who couldnt allow those dhimmi’s to have dominion over them(not a slur) and tried to help them and they have since tried to destroy the multicultural, multireligious freedom in your country. They were guests! That is part of the ideology I was speaking of earlier to Kathleen. I see the NYC mosque for what it is as well.
It’s like Christians and Jews are in the 5th position… they are considered in some occasions Enemies of Allah, and in other occasions normal people(still in 5th position) but not to be considered as friends only in case of wars (when you need more people) or if you can take advantage of their ( $$ ) friendship .
The sharia Law is the worst than anything you can think of if you are not Muslim. ( even for Muslim it’s like hell) It’s like your living in the middle ages even before, with slaves, and taxes, and extra taxes if you are Christian or Jews which is called Jezia…and many more.
Speaking about Lebanon, well we paid the price of been good to others… after we were like 90% Christians, the others started work from behind so that they kick us from our land and change the demography of this country with the help of many surrounding countries…
And then they wanted our country to be part of the Islamic countries in their war against Israel, although we are not an Islamic country!! And since then the problems started…
Then the Palestinians came, so we opened our land and homes for them and considered them as our brothers! We helped them and hosted them and gave them everything they needed… And what did we took from doing all that? A stab in that back!
Those who considered them to be “our brothers” joined ally with the Lebanese Muslims and declared war against us to kick us from our country and make Lebanon the New Country for Palestinians with 100% Christians free.
I don’t know if it’s a curse or something else, but whenever you find them you find problems around them… It’s maybe the problem in the Qu’ran since he force them to not accept to be commanded by Christians or any-other religion Since Islam Should be Always Above all others, because it’s the religion of Allah…
Many Countries had influence on our politics, some were good others were bad, But if “the other side” (the Muslims of our country) didn’t accepted to declare war against us in the first place the war could never ever happen…
So yes, I regret that We let Palestinians entering our country, our intentions were good we wanted to help them, but their intentions where to destroy us in the name of their Allah…
And look at us now, We have “Hizb-Allah”, “Fateh Al Islam”, “Hamas”," Fateh"," Jound El Sham", “Hizb Al tawhid”…
Lebanon is full of Islamic terrorist groups and Al Qaeda supporters groups…we are Even been putted more than once on the Black List!!
So more Christians are immigrating from Lebanon and all the east in general because simply it’s not too fun to live there, with continuous life threats, continuous jihad wars, and the feeling of hate from the other side…
So don’t make the same mistakes as us… If we can only go back to the past…
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Pitcharan
Guest
Many believe that that the father and mother of islamic terrorism are USA and UK. I even heard that the so-called Chechen rebels were recruited from the streets of London and pushed into Russia…
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Sam_777
Guest
Yes, it’s too long and ambiguous.
According to the hadith, it seems so.
Yes according to hadith, but the question is who saw Allah’s shin in this earthy life to recognize it in the judgement day!!! if we go by that concept then the only logical answer would be that Jesus will show the hole in his leg so Christians will recognize Him.
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Sam_777
Guest
This one upon entering:
Sunan Abu-Dawud, Book 1, Number 0006:
"The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) said: These privies are frequented by the jinns and devils. So when anyone amongst you goes there, he should say: “I seek refuge in Allah from male and female devils.”
كَانَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ إِذَا دَخَلَ الْخَلَاءَ قَالَ عَنْ حَمَّادٍ قَالَ اللَّهُمَّ إِنِّي أَعُوذُ بِكَ وَقَالَ عَنْ عَبْدِ الْوَارِثِ قَالَ أَعُوذُ بِاللَّهِ مِنْ الْخُبُثِ وَالْخَبَائِثِ
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And this one on exit:
Sunan Abu-Dawud, Book 1, Number 0030:
"When the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) came out of the privy, he used to say: “Grant me Thy forgiveness.”
أَنَّ النَّبِيَّ صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ كَانَ إِذَا خَرَجَ مِنْ الْغَائِطِ قَالَ غُفْرَانَكَ
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No, left foot while entering and right foot while exiting.
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Sam_777
Guest
The same Arabic word currently used by many Arabic Bibles around the world, however, the root of the Arabic word الله has two explanations, one that it came from another word اله which means “god or lord”, and the other explanation that it’s as is.
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Sam_777
Guest
There is no proof of that concept in Islam at all, let those claiming it cite their references.
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autdrew
Guest
:yyeess:that is exactly what I have read about, going all the way back to 700’s. You are a real, living example of all that has happened & continues to happen & will continue to happen. Lebanon is a larger than life example of what happens when people try to help & then get stabbed in the back. Yet Europe & America refuse to learn from the past & seemed determined to repeat it. Thank you for being a strong witness & do not stop talking about it! It is too important.:knight1:
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simple_soul
Guest
*Dear Alcrusader,
I have heard this story many times and my heart truly does break from the anguish I hear every time I hear it.
What I want to ask you is what were the mistakes you made?*
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simple_soul
Guest
*What you said here really struck me. But I believe that Jesus Christ is an even larger example of what happens when some one tries to help us and then He gets betrayed by His own apostle, suffered mutilation of the body and was then crucified for it. Yet He still prayed “Father forgive them for they know not what they do!” *:yyeess:that is exactly what I have read about, going all the way back to 700’s. You are a real, living example of all that has happened & continues to happen & will continue to happen. Lebanon is a larger than life example of what happens when people try to help & then get stabbed in the back. Yet Europe & America refuse to learn from the past & seemed determined to repeat it. Thank you for being a strong witness & do not stop talking about it! It is too important.:knight1:
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bosnian_muslim
Guest
you make it sound as if all the lebanese think like you,but lebanon is mostly muslim and all the muslims love their brothers and sisters from Palestine…and they dont regret anything
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autdrew
Guest
Jesus is an example for all of us to try to follow, though imperfectly, that is true.
In the temporal world, all actions have reactions. There have been many people who take the help that others gave out of genuine Christian charity, and used it against them. There are those people who know that some people truly want to help & think only the good of those they are helping, and insert themselves within that group & exploit the system.
I have known people like this all of my life & I can recognize the opportunists when I see them. Unfortunately, in this day & age, pointing them out & warning of the danger is held as a higher sin than what the plotters are actually doing. Until it is too late, of course.
To us the example we have been talking about here, some muslims in westernized countries, we can see an example in our reaction to 9/11. We were attacked & 3,000 of our citizens were murdered in an unprovoked attack on our soil. Almost immediately there were warnings of those racist Americans are going to run out and kill muslims, round them up & kill them etc. People started saying stuff like what did we do to THEM that made them do this to us? It MUST be our fault. Everything that was said was being couched in PC language that was amazingly deferential to muslim sensibilities. Even the original name for the attack on the taliban was changed because it was considered an insult to islam because it contained a word that muslims felt only God could give (I think it was justice, forgive me, its been almost 10 yrs).
Since then, all we have heard, despite all evidence to the contrary, is religion of peace, religion of peace. But dont draw a cartoon of the profit, people will die, dont include him in a satire show in which you lampoon other religious figures or you will have to hire security because you will get death threats, I can go on. People have become so deferential that they are trying to give the muslims treatment they refuse to give other religious adherents.There was a woman who filed for a restraining order from her husband (muslim) and the judge refused to grant it because he said that what the husband had done to her was allowable under his religion so he couldnt make him a criminal for it! (I dont have the link at the moment, Im sorry) She had to appeal to a higher court. Our security services are now getting sensitivity training provided (until recently) by CAIR so they wont offend muslims! What other group in American history, being investigated for ANY crime, has been allowed to give sensitivity training to officers so that they wont be offended but yet still find offense in EVERYTHING that is done?
Now there is an ongoing debate about this imam wanting to build a mosque & community center at ground zero. It would be obvious to any feeling person that this is an unnecessary provocation. With all the tiptoeing to try not to hurt muslim sensibilities, why do some refuse to see that this goes both ways? It is not about religious freedom because no one is claiming they dont have a right to worship or build, it is a matter of respect for the host country & our sensibilities! 3000 people were murdered there, by those claiming to be killing in the name of this religion of peace, thousands have died all around the world since then because of it, and they INSIST on this location. Dressing it up as building bridges of understanding doesnt work when they have been told over & over how hurtful it is, how divisive it is, even offered another location by the Governor of the state & yet they say NO, we have to have THIS site. And we have to back down because we are tolerant, we are merciful, we are Christian, WWJD? We may not be dhimmi yet, but some of us are sure acting like it!
In the temporal world, all actions have reactions. There have been many people who take the help that others gave out of genuine Christian charity, and used it against them. There are those people who know that some people truly want to help & think only the good of those they are helping, and insert themselves within that group & exploit the system.
I have known people like this all of my life & I can recognize the opportunists when I see them. Unfortunately, in this day & age, pointing them out & warning of the danger is held as a higher sin than what the plotters are actually doing. Until it is too late, of course.
To us the example we have been talking about here, some muslims in westernized countries, we can see an example in our reaction to 9/11. We were attacked & 3,000 of our citizens were murdered in an unprovoked attack on our soil. Almost immediately there were warnings of those racist Americans are going to run out and kill muslims, round them up & kill them etc. People started saying stuff like what did we do to THEM that made them do this to us? It MUST be our fault. Everything that was said was being couched in PC language that was amazingly deferential to muslim sensibilities. Even the original name for the attack on the taliban was changed because it was considered an insult to islam because it contained a word that muslims felt only God could give (I think it was justice, forgive me, its been almost 10 yrs).
Since then, all we have heard, despite all evidence to the contrary, is religion of peace, religion of peace. But dont draw a cartoon of the profit, people will die, dont include him in a satire show in which you lampoon other religious figures or you will have to hire security because you will get death threats, I can go on. People have become so deferential that they are trying to give the muslims treatment they refuse to give other religious adherents.There was a woman who filed for a restraining order from her husband (muslim) and the judge refused to grant it because he said that what the husband had done to her was allowable under his religion so he couldnt make him a criminal for it! (I dont have the link at the moment, Im sorry) She had to appeal to a higher court. Our security services are now getting sensitivity training provided (until recently) by CAIR so they wont offend muslims! What other group in American history, being investigated for ANY crime, has been allowed to give sensitivity training to officers so that they wont be offended but yet still find offense in EVERYTHING that is done?
Now there is an ongoing debate about this imam wanting to build a mosque & community center at ground zero. It would be obvious to any feeling person that this is an unnecessary provocation. With all the tiptoeing to try not to hurt muslim sensibilities, why do some refuse to see that this goes both ways? It is not about religious freedom because no one is claiming they dont have a right to worship or build, it is a matter of respect for the host country & our sensibilities! 3000 people were murdered there, by those claiming to be killing in the name of this religion of peace, thousands have died all around the world since then because of it, and they INSIST on this location. Dressing it up as building bridges of understanding doesnt work when they have been told over & over how hurtful it is, how divisive it is, even offered another location by the Governor of the state & yet they say NO, we have to have THIS site. And we have to back down because we are tolerant, we are merciful, we are Christian, WWJD? We may not be dhimmi yet, but some of us are sure acting like it!
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autdrew
Guest
Lebanon WAS mostly Christian with a muslim minority. That is what we are talking about. Lebanon WAS a mostly free, westernized, modern country, with tolerance & respect for everyone, much like the west. They were sucked into the conflict when they took in the Palestinians & the PLO set up shop on their territory & started attacking Israel. Then the attacks on Christians started until the civil war caused untold deaths & misery. By the time the Christians recognized what was happening to THEIR country, they were being murdered.Im certain the muslims dont see anything wrong or regretful about it but Im quite certain the Christians might have another, entirely different side of the story!
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simple_soul
Guest
*Dear Autdrew,
In responding to this I realize that we are straying from trying to understand Islamic Views and now we seem to be trying to understand Christian/Catholic Views.
I just have one comment and one question.
1st, I do not believe following the example and teachings of Jesus Christ or His Church means one is backing down about anything. Now having said this I will be the first to admit that I am still learning about what Jesus Christ through His Church does teach about this.
2nd, are you saying that in order to keep from being referred to and thought of as dhimmi we should not be following Jesus Christ’s example or what the Church teaches us about religious freedom? *
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bosnian_muslim
Guest
there are many palestinian christians and they all support the palestinian case…Israel is the enemy of both christians and muslims
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wwolverine
Guest
Israel is the common enemy for all, as most news says, but what I fail to understand is where was israel? OT, NT and Quran, all mention Israel in their rrespective books, So where did this place exist before 1947? Was it Germany & Europe as some muslims say that they should go back there? than those places never existed in OT time nor NT time, nor I believe Mohammed’s time.
So where was this Israel?
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elwill
Guest
In 587 BCE, Babylonian Nebuchadnezzar’s army captured Jerusalem, destroyed the Temple, and exiled the Jews to Babylon (modern day Iraq).
The year 587 BCE marks a turning point in the history of the region. From this year onwards, the region was ruled or controlled by a succession of superpower empires of the time in the following order: Babylonian, Persian, Greek Hellenistic, Roman and Byzantine Empires, Islamic and Christian crusaders, Ottoman Empire, and the British Empire.
science.co.il/israel-history.asp
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scipio337
Guest
Most notably, the rulers for the past 1300 years (with a brief 150 year so of Crusader rule) have been one Caliphate or another. I’ve always wondered why no independent Palestinian Arab state existed in that time. The suggestion is that Palestinian Arabs aren’t bothered being ruled by a foriegn power, provided they’re Muslim.
I for one can never wrap my head around the “Israel is the enemy of both christians and muslims” weltanschauung most Muslims have.
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KathleenGee
Guest
Bosnian Muslim, the Christ you particularly believe in is an anti-Christ.
Jesus Christ was a Jew. He now is seated in heaven. He always stressed the kingdom within.
Christianity is going to be perceived as a failure by the forces of evil – be it the force of power that always lies to fulfill its land lust and domination over other people…some times I see the dark side of Islam as that described in the bible as the False Prophet…every generation has its false prophets and anti-Christs.
Lebanon is a Christian country. Anyone can go online and see a cultural map of the country and see just how many areas are Christian and have been that way for almost 2000 years.
What is causing the trouble is coming from Iran. Hezbollah and Hamas. More and more Palestinians fear them for their brutality that the military says is more formidable than Bin Laden’s Al Qaeda.
It is Iran that is causing the continuing trouble in Iraq and surrounding countries at the time.
Bin L adin is wanting the Middle East to be free of Westerners so he can see Islam as it was when it broke off its Golden Era of reason and philosophy, to be of the fundamentalist version to feed his own lusts.
When we make idols of having sex and women, killing for God…we are really worshipping ourselves…the Golden Calf…was really symbolic of the lusts and passions of the Jews…and for this Moses picked up the tablets of the 10 Commandments and threw them to the ground destroying them. The Law was already broken before the people even entered the Promised Land…
And it was the Living Stone of Jesus Christ Who brought us the New Covenant overlaying the Sinai Covenant.
Jesus Christ was a Jew. He now is seated in heaven. He always stressed the kingdom within.
Christianity is going to be perceived as a failure by the forces of evil – be it the force of power that always lies to fulfill its land lust and domination over other people…some times I see the dark side of Islam as that described in the bible as the False Prophet…every generation has its false prophets and anti-Christs.
Lebanon is a Christian country. Anyone can go online and see a cultural map of the country and see just how many areas are Christian and have been that way for almost 2000 years.
What is causing the trouble is coming from Iran. Hezbollah and Hamas. More and more Palestinians fear them for their brutality that the military says is more formidable than Bin Laden’s Al Qaeda.
It is Iran that is causing the continuing trouble in Iraq and surrounding countries at the time.
Bin L adin is wanting the Middle East to be free of Westerners so he can see Islam as it was when it broke off its Golden Era of reason and philosophy, to be of the fundamentalist version to feed his own lusts.
When we make idols of having sex and women, killing for God…we are really worshipping ourselves…the Golden Calf…was really symbolic of the lusts and passions of the Jews…and for this Moses picked up the tablets of the 10 Commandments and threw them to the ground destroying them. The Law was already broken before the people even entered the Promised Land…
And it was the Living Stone of Jesus Christ Who brought us the New Covenant overlaying the Sinai Covenant.
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KathleenGee
Guest
Famdigy speaks of the Umayyids…these were the ones who took over Jerusalem.
The nephew of Mohammed protested the habits of the Umayyids because they created myths to gain entitlements to lands…liars.
The devout Muslims mistakenly believed that the Rock approximate the Temple Mount was the one Abraham used to sacrifice his son. It was not. The Rock was a rock.
The historical text of the Bible says Abraham went into the wilderness to fulfill God’s wish he sacrifice his only son. Then an angel thwarted his obedience and Abraham became the father of all future generations…Historians consider Nablu or Sidon as areas he probably went to as Jerusalem was already in construction and not considered a wilderness.
The nephew even called the Umayyids those ‘damned’…because they intended to build a mosque over this sacred site indicating a devout and sincere sensitivity to past historical sites even though he was mistaken to the actual identity of the rock.
And I am reading elsewhere that after the defeat of the Ottoman Empire by the British and Russians, the Caliphate was placed in Saudi Arabia thus changing the course of events for Islam. And beyond that, it is all confusing to me…including understanding the Koran and different versions.
Famdigy, when he touches on the Umayyids, people need to acknowledge that these are the ones that expounded on Mohammed’s dream in 620 AD…that did not intend to make claims to Muslim Jerusalem…at that time the dominant structure in Jerusalem was St. Mary Major of Justinian that ran was huge, had a corridor connecting north and south jerusalem and to say that Mohammed went to heaven on a horse next to the Catholic Church was ridiculous…but that is what we have now…of who dominates who…fratricide…
The nephew of Mohammed protested the habits of the Umayyids because they created myths to gain entitlements to lands…liars.
The devout Muslims mistakenly believed that the Rock approximate the Temple Mount was the one Abraham used to sacrifice his son. It was not. The Rock was a rock.
The historical text of the Bible says Abraham went into the wilderness to fulfill God’s wish he sacrifice his only son. Then an angel thwarted his obedience and Abraham became the father of all future generations…Historians consider Nablu or Sidon as areas he probably went to as Jerusalem was already in construction and not considered a wilderness.
The nephew even called the Umayyids those ‘damned’…because they intended to build a mosque over this sacred site indicating a devout and sincere sensitivity to past historical sites even though he was mistaken to the actual identity of the rock.
And I am reading elsewhere that after the defeat of the Ottoman Empire by the British and Russians, the Caliphate was placed in Saudi Arabia thus changing the course of events for Islam. And beyond that, it is all confusing to me…including understanding the Koran and different versions.
Famdigy, when he touches on the Umayyids, people need to acknowledge that these are the ones that expounded on Mohammed’s dream in 620 AD…that did not intend to make claims to Muslim Jerusalem…at that time the dominant structure in Jerusalem was St. Mary Major of Justinian that ran was huge, had a corridor connecting north and south jerusalem and to say that Mohammed went to heaven on a horse next to the Catholic Church was ridiculous…but that is what we have now…of who dominates who…fratricide…
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