Unhappy Catholic Lawyers

[Yeoman]

Still trying to head in the direction I hope will lead out, sometimes starting to loose heart, but otherwise just trying to do my work and be numb to it. Not the best way to live, day by day, but the best I think I can do, with the goal in mind in making this a short term situation.

But, frankly, fearful it may not be. Trying not to think that.

I have come to the conclusion that if I have to ride this out until retirement, which I very much hope not to do, I will not be able to balance any worth in the career with having done that. That kind of thinking I try not to focus on very much.

Bless you for thinking of us.

 

[Petaro]

I can’t speak as a lawyer, only as one who feels victimized by four different lawyers.

You all say you are unhappy as lawyers, and I was wondering if this is because in your profession you must do things that are not always ethical towards your clients.

I ask this only because this has been my families experience with lawyers. Money is their major concern, not their client. Sometimes as we are older we see that we have done things in the past that were not what Christ would have approved of.

I am not trying to be uncharitable, only stating honest truth about what some lawyers have done to our family over the years. So I have no trust in them, nor in some other professions that at one time made oaths to help their patients. My family has been victims and have not received real justice through the court system, nor social services.

I know this sounds really negative, but it seems as if society has been turned upside down these past years and as a younger woman said to me, I just want to have “fun”, as that is what everyone does.

I do understand that certain professional are limited in how far they can actually go to help a client, but I don’t know if that includes lawyers or if, at least the ones we have dealt with are just greedy and care nothing about whether a child has been harmed or a family destroyed, as long as it is worth the financial advantages they receive.

Sorry, I guess I have just gotten to the end of my rope with several so called professionals who claim to help.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

You are right, there are many unethical lawyers whose only maxim is that “Justice is what happens when the money runs out.” However there are very many Catholic lawyers who act ethically towards their clients who are the second responsibility aside from their responsibility to the Court. This can cause great stress and emotional angst.
The law does not provide justice. In the Common law tradition the rules of evidence work against the truth in many cases. Barristers know this and it is a weary road to find the balance between their functioning within a flawed system and their duty before their God.
The virtual legalization of abortion is the greatest scandal to me as a barrister most of my life.
But I spent my time in industrial law fighting the communist Unions in Australia. Always carrying a knife and a rebar in the boot of my car was exciting when young, however I was so pleased when I had to retire from ill-health in my fifties. I can say I always acted ethically and with in my moral quadrants so I am confident in my professional life, to go before my Lord. However I understand completely the ennui and weltschmerz experienced by lawyers in any jurisdiction. There is a cognitive dissonance that we, as lawyers, live with as agents of such a system bound inexorably in the basest of human disharmony.
I look to the likes of St. Thomas More and try to put my God first in all things.

 

[Yeoman]

Any other unhappy Catholic lawyers out there?

So did you make it out of the law?

I have to confess that I’m finding it exceedingly difficult to do so. Indeed, recently I’ve been close to despair with the realization that I might never make it out, and that having been a lawyer will define my life. It’s really hard for me to accordingly not view it as a life wasted. I try not to, but it’s tough.

 

[mommyof4]

So did you make it out of the law?

I have to confess that I’m finding it exceedingly difficult to do so. Indeed, recently I’ve been close to despair with the realization that I might never make it out, and that having been a lawyer will define my life. It’s really hard for me to accordingly not view it as a life wasted. I try not to, but it’s tough.

Hang in there! It is possible to get out (before retirement) and move on to a more fulfilling career. I have known several lawyers (including my husband) who have made successful career changes. It is not impossible!

 

[Yeoman]

Hang in there! It is possible to get out (before retirement) and move on to a more fulfilling career. I have known several lawyers (including my husband) who have made successful career changes. It is not impossible!

Thanks.

I pretty much had my plans on this completely fall apart in the last couple of months and now what I was hoping for is dead as a doornail.

It certainly is a cautionary tale. When I was young, I didn’t have a clear sense of where I was going, and suppressed the couple of concepts I wished I’d taken up. I’ve been paying for that ever since and now I it seems fairly certain I’ll pay for that my entire life. Some sort of lesson in that.

 

[LionsDen66]

So did you make it out of the law?

I have to confess that I’m finding it exceedingly difficult to do so. Indeed, recently I’ve been close to despair with the realization that I might never make it out, and that having been a lawyer will define my life. It’s really hard for me to accordingly not view it as a life wasted. I try not to, but it’s tough.

My friend, I am sorry to hear about your despair. Regardless of what happens tomorrow and beyond, your life has not been wasted. You were created for God and in His image. If you have helped one soul on the journey to salvation, whether by your witness or your encouragement or counsel, then you’ve helped another gain eternal joy. How could that possibly be a waste? I can empathize with your feelings as I’ve been there myself. Just remember that it is at our weakest that our Heavenly Father is strongest. Do not allow the devil to discourage you. That’s one of his most potent weapons. Tell satan, as Christ did, to ‘get behind you.’ Invoke the name of Jesus in your quietness, and He will reveal His presence to you. Do not despair, my friend. When you and I (with hope) are having a Heavenly beer together at St. Peter’s Pub talking about our days as ‘trial lawyers’, we’ll both realize just how temporary, fleeting and really inconsequential it all was – except that which effected the Kingdom. Whether it was holding the hand of a victim (as I did as a prosecutor), or fighting for the freedom for a young juvenile delinquent, we were acting in persona Christi. We’ll see that in the whole vastness of eternity, these 40 years or so of our “professional life” were just a little clownfish in the ocean of eternity. You can still do Kingdom-oriented work today, tomorrow and till the Lord takes you home.

I have not made it out of the law either. I struggled all last year and was exploring different businesses/franchises, etc. when I finally came to realize that my law degree was an asset that I could still use for His glory and my earthly sustenance. In the last couple of months I have settled into the area of estate planning and elder law, with an emphasis on helping families protect assets from long-term care/nursing home costs. I joined a national organization which trains, supports and provides systems/processes for lawyers in transition (Iike me and probably you) or for baby lawyers justing entering the fray. I joined with an existing firm (two lawyers and 5 support staff) with a fee sharing arrangement which has eliminated my overhead and provides back office support, etc. My job is to go out and shake trees and get business. I will be doing workshops and meeting with financial planners, other attorneys, insurance agents – anyone who is in a position to advise a family about estate planning/asset protection. It’s a very relationship-oriented marketing approach, and I am praying that God blesses my decision. That said, I’ve made no money yet and my wife is displaying such Godly patience with me.

I would be happy to talk with you ‘offline’ if you want about this idea – we are, after all, brothers in Christ and fellow travelers in this thing called life. Email me privately (I think that’s an option) and I can share my contact information with you. I’d be honored to help you 'figure it out." God bless you, my friend. Don’t despair. He has a plan for you. Just wait on Him.

 

[Yeoman]

I would be happy to talk with you ‘offline’ if you want about this idea – we are, after all, brothers in Christ and fellow travelers in this thing called life. Email me privately (I think that’s an option) and I can share my contact information with you. I’d be honored to help you 'figure it out." God bless you, my friend. Don’t despair. He has a plan for you. Just wait on Him.

Thank you for that offer. I’ve very much considered it, but I don’t think that the path in the law you’ve taken would be for me. As silly as it sounds, I just don’t “feel it”.

As much as I hate the thought of it, right now the best I can come up with is to ride this out for one more decade and take retirement at age 62. Everyone tells us not to do that, of course, but that’s about as much hope as I can muster towards salvaging any of this, and even at that, I’ll have to concede that remaining in the law has been a massive personal failure. I have to hope that the example of it at least says something about sacrificing for a person’s family to my kids, while also being a negative example of what not to do in planning for a career (and with teenagers I increasingly worry about that). I know I’ve helped a few people along the way, but I think I’ll have to be long retired for that to be something that means very much to me on a personal level at all or that I’ll really be willing to acknowledge.

 

[Yeoman]

Having one of those really stressful times, of which there’s an increasing number lately, related to this career and woke up extremely early focused on a terrible career decision I made when I first was licensed, which would have taken me out of the law. The road not taken, in other words. Actually found myself praying I’d taken it, asking for a peculiar sort of miracle. Unless I go out of the door this morning and find everything different, the petition would rather obviously not have been granted as asked. Sometimes, of course, the answer is no.

No point other than that if one of those young people wonder by here thinking of going into law or doing something much less profitable, and much iffier, this old lawyer regrets very much not having taken that other approach. A day in which I’m not flooded with problems, people burdening me with all their troubles, and other lawyers, far too many of whom are real jerks, is something that I devoutly wish for.

 

[mommyof4]

Having one of those really stressful times, of which there’s an increasing number lately, related to this career and woke up extremely early focused on a terrible career decision I made when I first was licensed, which would have taken me out of the law. The road not taken, in other words. Actually found myself praying I’d taken it, asking for a peculiar sort of miracle. Unless I go out of the door this morning and find everything different, the petition would rather obviously not have been granted as asked. Sometimes, of course, the answer is no.

No point other than that if one of those young people wonder by here thinking of going into law or doing something much less profitable, and much iffier, this old lawyer regrets very much not having taken that other approach. A day in which I’m not flooded with problems, people burdening me with all their troubles, and other lawyers, far too many of whom are real jerks, is something that I devoutly wish for.

I am honestly so sorry for your work difficulties. Lots of prayers for you today!

 

[Yeoman]

I am honestly so sorry for your work difficulties. Lots of prayers for you today!

The prayers are appreciated.

 

[jilly4ski]

The prayers are appreciated.

Continued prayers. I don’t know what size of town you live in, but have you considered temp/contract work? I do temp document review projects. I recently got placed in the state’s department of transportation doing government data practices request. The pay isn’t awesome, and work is boring as all get out, but the people are nice and there is no stress.

 

[Mummsie]

Yeoman,

I’ve found this entire thread very interesting. I’ve learned a lot about the life of a lawyer. Thank you for opening up and sharing so much. My heart goes out to you.

The only advice I can give you is simple. Stop looking Back. There’s nothing to be gained from reliving those decision points. Nothing. It only adds to your misery. And it prevents you from seeing any of the magnificent joys our Lord has placed in your life. You can’t drive a car by looking in the rear view mirror. You can’t move forward with your head turned backward. God has given you today. What you do with it is up to you. We’ve all made decisions in the past that were dreadful; but, we need to learn from them, let them go, and move on. The question today is “What does the Lord want you to do with the gifts he’s given you?”

You have my prayers. God Bless you.

 

[Sheeniac]

Not a lawyer, but was accepted to Law School many moons ago. A dreadful condition prevented me from attending, and sent my career in a different path.

Upthread, you said that you didn’t see the difference between burnout and hating your job as a lawyer. Now I’m not a therapist either, but from the tone of your comments, the focus on what can’t be undone, it seems that you are suffering burnout which has a mental health component to it.

Pardon my language, but all jobs suck. At a Christmas party a couple of months ago, a frien said something about how one should love what they do. My reaction was ‘it’s a place of employment, not enjoyment’. Perhaps it’s my lower middle class (upper lower class?) background, but I never thought of it that way. I never saw anyone enjoying their jobs. It was a means to get money to live.

The room was split about 70-30 (in favor of those who work for the money, not satisfaction) and some of the jobs are pretty impressive. While it would be nice to be fulfilled, does it really happen all that much?

As I’ve read what you’ve written, the thought that comes to mind is that you could do some pro bono work to help the poor along with your regular cases. My sister, divorced with 3 kids, was unable to get legal aid for any of her needs. I ended up paying for her divorce ($$) and was quite disgusted with much of what I saw.

Your specialized skills are worth money and there are many who can’t afford anything but need help/advice with a few things. Of course, your skills are not easily transferable to other areas of law, but you could probably get free ‘how to’s’ from other attorneys here and there. Perhaps this is what God wants you to do by leading you to law.

Obviously you don’t want to advertise your free services, but I’m sure your priest could pre-screen and send a person over once in awhile. Instead of seeing Jesus in your clients, maybe a poor person could look to you and see Jesus?

All of you guys are in my prayers.

(Ms) Sheeniac

 

[Yeoman]

Thanks for the prayers, thoughts, suggestions and concerns. I do appreciate them.

Stop looking back is, I know, a very solid suggestion. I wish I could, and I’m trying to, but I’ve been very bad at that recently. I guess part of the analytical nature of the work involves constantly analyzing mistakes, which takes you on to your own mistakes.

I’ve also been trying to leave things at the office more, although I find doing that, mentally, extremely difficult to do.

On taking pro bono, I’m afraid I already carry quite a few people in that status or nearly that status, and it actually doesn’t make things better. I understand the impulse, but carrying more people’s burdens, for free or pay, isn’t something I feel that I want to do. That probably speaks poorly of me, but that is the case. Indeed, I tend to find that the people who appreciate pro bono or reduced fee work are those you know personally somehow. They know you as people and you know them. Otherwise, strangers who acquire free work are sometimes the most difficult people to work with.

For any souls looking to get into the law, one thing that they should be aware of, in my view, is that if your are introspective and analytical, you may be well suited to be a law student but not a lawyer. That’s part of my problem, or a lot of it, and its a problem with a lot of people who get into the law. The law is much less intellectual than people suppose, and much more about human interactions. Unfortunately, I tend to also think that perhaps some who are best suited for litigation are those who can really separate out empathy as well. So if you actually care about values, think a lot, and worry about the implications of things, you may very well be poorly suited for the job.

I really wish that law schools did a better job of informing students of that. An introduction to legal life, on the first day of law school, should probably warn people that if they are there because “they want to help people”, they’re in the wrong school, and if they are there because “they like to read”, or study, they’re in the wrong career as well. If pondering litigation, they probably are best off if they can be selectively misanthropic and have a bit of a mercenary spirit, and know that helping people is balanced out by hurting them as well.

A very negative view, I know. Of course, not all lawyers are courtroom lawyers.

 

[Yeoman]

Not a lawyer, but was accepted to Law School many moons ago. A dreadful condition prevented me from attending, and sent my career in a different path.

I’m sorry for the affliction that you had, and I hope all worked out well.

As a lawyer, I’ve run across quite a few people in the work setting who have told me “I’d planned to be a lawyer”, but life had intervened. I know its a compliment, or sort of a bonding attempt, but I always end up thinking that they were lucky for the intervention, assuming that it wasn’t due to disaster or illness, such as yours.

Conversely, I’ve never met a lawyer who got out, one way or another who regretted it.

An oddity thinking back is that I sat a year out after being admitted to law school, as a family illness called me home and I wasn’t certain about going. I was actually readmitted by a simple letter, which really amazed me. That meant that somebody went in the prior year in my place (I knew who she was once I started in law school) and they bizarrely didn’t require me to seek admission for the next year. I’ve often thought that really odd, and a bad break of fate. I’ve also hoped that the woman who secured a (literally) last minute entry into law school had the whole thing work out for her. I recall her being a very nice person, who never knew the back story to her getting a call just days before school was to commence.

 

[Mummsie]

After reading about your unusual entry into Law school, it does seem rather odd. We know that coincidences are seldom just that. Is it possible, you’re exactly where God wants you to be? Practicing law to help others. Period. Perhaps you might consider a change in your approach. Expect nothing from anyone…clients, other lawyers, family; just continue to do the excellent job you’re doing. Your hard work will be rewarded where it really counts-eternity.

I know changing unhealthy habits can be extremely difficult, you might want to try the “rubber band” method. Great aversion therapy

God Bless You.

 

[Yeoman]

After reading about your unusual entry into Law school, it does seem rather odd. We know that coincidences are seldom just that. Is it possible, you’re exactly where God wants you to be?

I’ve wondered that, but I certainly hope and pray not. Indeed, it occurs to me from time to time that life is short, eternity long, and perhaps being miserable in life doesn’t matter that much.

Expect nothing from anyone…clients, other lawyers, family; just continue to do the excellent job you’re doing. Your hard work will be rewarded where it really counts-eternity.

Pretty much the approach I’ve been taking this past year, although I wonder to what extent our work as lawyers really helps anyone all that much. I get quite a few thank yous anymore, but I rarely acknowledge them as it seems odd to me.

I know changing unhealthy habits can be extremely difficult, you might want to try the “rubber band” method. Great aversion therapy

God Bless You.

I hadn’t thought of the rubber band thing.

I’ve been a long time in responding here, in part because I’ve sort of reached the point of dull resignation on this. I still pray from time to time for God to relieve me of my error in becoming a lawyer. Over the past year, however, my world load has actually dramatically increased. I’m baffled by my seeming fate. I know God answers all prayers but I struggle to see the answer here, which is not obvious to me, or perhaps just not granted yet. My best hope is to struggle through to retirement age, should I live that long, and retire even if it means retiring into poverty.

We make our own mistakes, and can’t expect God to reverse them, even though I pray for that occasionally. It’s hard to see, however, in part why we might have desires that can’t seem to be fulfilled. Would that I’d been born a farmer.

 

[Yeoman]

I’ve been a long time in responding here, in part because I’ve sort of reached the point of dull resignation on this. I still pray from time to time for God to relieve me of my error in becoming a lawyer. Over the past year, however, my world load has actually dramatically increased. I’m baffled by my seeming fate. I know God answers all prayers but I struggle to see the answer here, which is not obvious to me, or perhaps just not granted yet. My best hope is to struggle through to retirement age, should I live that long, and retire even if it means retiring into poverty.

We make our own mistakes, and can’t expect God to reverse them, even though I pray for that occasionally. It’s hard to see, however, in part why we might have desires that can’t seem to be fulfilled. Would that I’d been born a farmer.

I’m posting on this long dormant thread again as I guess I’m asking for prayers, and comments.

As noted here, when I posted this a few months ago I found myself busier than I have ever been at my occupation. That is still true. Shortly after that my surviving parent entered the final stages of illness in her very long life, and then died a couple of months ago. The whole year, therefore, has been a blur.

I’ve been struggling with some very difficult work matters and then it dawned on me that, with what I’ve saved over the years, and with a small inheritance, I can actually quit this job, at least for a time. My wife won’t even hear me out on it however, she’s so terrified by the thought, and that being, I guess, the thought of no income when we still have a couple of teenagers at home.

I suppose its reckless, but I’m seriously contemplating it. And by that, at this point, I’m almost at the do and seek forgiveness from my spouse later. A door has opened, it seems, and maybe I should walk through it rather than hang on for a decade and retire like normal folks.

 

[LionsDen66]

My friend, I am sorry to hear of your mom’s passing. I will be praying for you so that you may discern what God’s will is for you, your wife and your kids. It would certainly be better if your wife was on board with your decision to leave the profession, and she must know how it has been effecting you for so many years. Perhaps a meeting with a trust financial advisor/friend whom your wife trusts may help to alleviate any concerns she may have about the financial consequences of your decision.

 

[PolarGuy]

Don’t do it. Please.

Some thoughts:

1. Quitting is easy. What makes you think it will be equally easy to, say, just to back to work all of a sudden on day 30? Day 60? Day 180?
2. I’ve worked so hard at a lawyer job I got myself sick over it. That said, when I was on disability for 3 months, I saw how very easy it was to call into a pattern of sleep late, lay around the house in sweatpants, and do nothing. I hated being out of work and my mind tuned to mush. If you quit, this will likely become you.
3. The law is a harsh job to try to walk back into after you’ve been out of it for a while. Cases get reversed. Judges at the courthouse who knew you retire and you find you have no contacts anymore. Worse, they whisper “what happened to mr. Yeoman? Did he have a breakdown?” Being a lawyer is a skill that requires industry, not sitting on the sidelines.
4. If you have teenagers and a wife you have an obligation to support them. Your wife’s attitude is correct. Lots of people dislike their jobs. Very few just walk out in them - don’t you be one of them.
5. To the extent you may be relying on a small inheritance, I’ll quote George bailey: “mr. Potter, do you have any idea how long it takes to save $500?” Point is, an inheritance is something to be guarded, not something that lets you finance indolence. If you’re unhappy at work, there are lots of things to do that don’t involve walking out cold.