Unitarian Christians- true or not true?

[cheese_sdc]

So, the individual in the pew has a right to hold his own religious beliefs. Except if you are a neo-Nazi. What other exceptions are there? Satanists? Westboro Baptists? So there are commonly held beliefs that exclude other’s beliefs. Where does one draw the line and who makes the decision?

I know it sounds weird, but when I go to services at the UCBR, I’m sitting with Pagans, Jews, Atheists, Agnostics, Christians, Taoists, etc. And we manage to make it work.

So how does one then qualify to be a “minster”? And what is his or her ministry? To get up and spout whatever he or she wishes with no obligation on the part of the congregation to adhere to the principles being espoused? I don’t see the point.

There are UU seminaries. As I understand it, one must have graduated from one, and then be called and ordained by a particular congregation.

I will admit that my understanding of the process is incomplete.

I remember visiting “Speakers Corner” in Hyde Park in London when I was living in Europe. This is where open-air public speaking, debate and discussion are allowed. Everyone and anyone is allowed to get up and rant until the cows come home. I see absolutely no difference between this and a UCC meeting.

As I’ve never been to “Speakers Corner”, I can’t really comment. I can say that if the UCBR (Unitarian Church of Baton Rouge) services ran 'til the cow came home, I’d probably leave early.

 

[andrewstx]

So, the individual in the pew has a right to hold his own religious beliefs. Except if you are a neo-Nazi. What other exceptions are there? Satanists? Westboro Baptists? So there are commonly held beliefs that exclude other’s beliefs. Where does one draw the line and who makes the decision?

So how does one then qualify to be a “minster”? And what is his or her ministry? To get up and spout whatever he or she wishes with no obligation on the part of the congregation to adhere to the principles being espoused? I don’t see the point.

I remember visiting “Speakers Corner” in Hyde Park in London when I was living in Europe. This is where open-air public speaking, debate and discussion are allowed. Everyone and anyone is allowed to get up and rant until the cows come home. I see absolutely no difference between this and a UCC meeting.

They do have a seminary, I think to be a minister one has to graduate from seminary.

BTW, it is UU, not UCC. UCC stands for the United Church of Christ which is Christian just liberal Christian. They were known as the Congregational Christian church before a church union.

 

[SteveVH]

They do have a seminary, I think to be a minister one has to graduate from seminary.

BTW, it is UU, not UCC. UCC stands for the United Church of Christ which is Christian just liberal Christian. They were known as the Congregational Christian church before a church union.

Yes, thank you for the correction.

 

[SteveVH]

I know it sounds weird, but when I go to services at the UCBR, I’m sitting with Pagans, Jews, Atheists, Agnostics, Christians, Taoists, etc. And we manage to make it work.

So how does this square with the “creed” stated above?

There are UU seminaries. As I understand it, one must have graduated from one, and then be called and ordained by a particular congregation.

Ordained by the congregation? And where does the congregation get its authority to ordain anyone?

As I’ve never been to “Speakers Corner”, I can’t really comment. I can say that if the UCBR (Unitarian Church of Baton Rouge) services ran 'til the cow came home, I’d probably leave early.

lol. Yeah, I didn’t hang around long either.

 

[cheese_sdc]

So how does this square with the “creed” stated above?

Frobert is part of the UCC, which is different than the Unitarian Church - all the Unitarians have have are “The 7 Principles”.

Frobert: UCC
Cheese: Unitarian Universalist.

Ordained by the congregation? And where does the congregation get its authority to ordain anyone?

From itself. Again, I’m sure that sounds strange to Catholic ears.

lol. Yeah, I didn’t hang around long either.

 

[PRmerger]

For the third or fourth time you appear to have a problem with UCC teachings which is not my problem or responsibility to address.

Yes, I do have a problem with many UCC teachings.

As far as whether it’s “your problem or responsibility”–well, yes and no.

If you come to a Catholic forum and want to dialogue with Catholics about religion, you better believe that you’re going to be questioned about your beliefs and practices. And you’re going to be asked to defend them. And you’re going to be challenged.

And you ought to be able to offer some apologia for what you believe.

Not wishing to answer questions about your faith on a forum that discusses religion is about as peculiar as going to a Cruciverbalist forum but getting offended when people are all over you for saying, “What do you mean you don’t want to talk about crossword puzzles?!!!”

But as far as, generally speaking, it being “not your problem” that I have grave reservations about your UCC doctrines, well, in that sense, you are correct.

But then again, don’t come to a Catholic forum and attempt to dialogue with Catholics about religion.

 

[SteveVH]

Frobert is part of the UCC, which is different than the Unitarian Church - all the Unitarians have have are “The 7 Principles”.

Frobert: UCC
Cheese: Unitarian Universalist.

Now I understand my confusion. Why in the world are we discussing the beliefs of the United Church of Christ on a UU thread?

From itself. Again, I’m sure that sounds strange to Catholic ears.

Very.

 

[cheese_sdc]

Now I understand my confusion. Why in the world are we discussing the beliefs of the United Church of Christ on a UU thread?

I think frobert introduced the subject, but I could be wrong.

 

[andrewstx]

Now I understand my confusion. Why in the world are we discussing the beliefs of the United Church of Christ on a UU thread?

Very.

They are connected. The first Unitarians in this country were originally New England Congregationalists who objected to the strict Calvinism practiced in the Congregational churches.

The first Unitarian church was in Boston.

 

[frobert]

I think frobert introduced the subject, but I could be wrong.

PRmerger first brought up the UCC here… I strenuously tried not to post about the UCC but PR insisted on prodding me about my beliefs disregarding my requests that she stop. It appeared to me that she had a problem with UCC’s teachings so I suggested several times that she visit the UCC website for further information.

 

[PRmerger]

PRmerger first brought up the UCC here… I strenuously tried not to post about the UCC but PR insisted on prodding me about my beliefs disregarding my requests that she stop. It appeared to me that she had a problem with UCC’s teachings so I suggested several times that she visit the UCC website for further information.

That’s actually not a valid link you provided.

Can you offer the correct one?

 

[frobert]

That’s actually not a valid link you provided.

Can you offer the correct one?

Sorry about that, I must have made an error when I transcribed the link

Here is the correct link

My post that you responded to

“By Dave’s reasoning it would appear that Catholics are as foolish as Protestants.”

As you are aware from other posts of mine in other threads that your responded to, I am not as cynical and I believe that many non-Catholics use their ability of reason that goes well beyond “picking and choosing” in matters of faith. I would imagine that some Catholics also do.

Your response

So can you give an example, then, of a church doctrine from the UCC* that you have conformed to, even if you personally wouldn’t profess if you were, say, king of the world?

*emphasis added

Note: There appears to be an erratic problem and the link does not resolve properly. The post in question is on page 7

 

[PRmerger]

No, there is nothing that my faith teaches that I don’t believe. There are things I don’t understand, that’s where faith comes in, but there is nothing I don’t believe.

Excellent.

So can you give an example of something that you conformed your belief system to?

The question about what I would do if I was creating a church is bizarre.

sigh.
It’s not to be taken literally, schaeffer.

It, too, is a hypothetical for the purpose of discussion.

I will give an example of my own: if I were going to create a church of my own making what I would decree is this: divorce and re-marriage is NOT adultery. In fact, if someone married a jerk the first time, she ought to be able to be given a second chance at love and marry again.

However, I am bound as a creature to follow the commands of the Creator. So, I conform my views to that which God has said, and I, too, profess: divorce and re-marriage is adultery.

 

[PRmerger]

Sorry about that, I must have made an error when I transcribed the link

Here is the correct link

My post that you responded to

Your response

*emphasis added

Note: There appears to be an erratic problem and the link does not resolve properly. The post in question is on page 7

Ah, I see then.

And my reference to the UCC was prompted by your comment here (bold mine):

Nice try at misdirection from what I said and intended. I said

“By Dave’s reasoning it would appear that Catholics are as foolish as Protestants.”

As you are aware from other posts of mine in other threads that your responded to, I am not as cynical and** I believe** that many non-Catholics use their ability of reason that goes well beyond “picking and choosing” in matters of faith. I would imagine that some Catholics also do.

When you cite yourself and your beliefs with “I believe” the referent is, of course, the UCC beliefs, for that is what you identify yourself as.

So, when you reference your beliefs it is bringing up your church, the UCC.

 

[frobert]

Ah, I see then.

And my reference to the UCC was prompted by your comment here (bold mine):

When you cite yourself and your beliefs with “I believe” the referent is, of course, the UCC beliefs, for that is what you identify yourself as.

So, when you reference your beliefs it is bringing up your church, the UCC.

If it matters that much to you, I agree I made you reference UCC. Now let’s let the thread get back on track.

 

[PRmerger]

If it matters that much to you, I agree I made you reference UCC. Now let’s let the thread get back on track.

And when you are challenged to support your beliefs, you ought to be able to offer some apologia, frobert.

The Scriptures command that you do so.

 

[frobert]

And when you are challenged to support your beliefs, you ought to be able to offer some apologia, frobert.

The Scriptures command that you do so.

I disagree but I will answer your question. Similar to schaeffer, to the best of my knowledge there is nothing that I have come to know about the UCC teaching that I don’t believe. There are things I don’t understand, that’s where faith comes in, but there is nothing I don’t believe.

To save you further difficulties, I do not intend to answer any further questions from you. If you persist I will simply put you on my ignore list. If you want to know my reason send me a PM and I will tell you.

 

[PRmerger]

I disagree but I will answer your question. Similar to schaeffer, to the best of my knowledge there is nothing that I have come to know about the UCC teaching that I don’t believe. There are things I don’t understand, that’s where faith comes in, but there is nothing I don’t believe.

To save you further difficulties, I do not intend to answer any further questions from you. If you persist I will simply put you on my ignore list. If you want to know my reason send me a PM and I will tell you.

As you wish.

Buh-bye. :compcoff:

 

[Sy_Noe]

That proves my point, then. He has joined a church that happens to agree with everything he finds palatable.

God, however, logically, would not happen to agree with all of our own personal tastes, ethics and morals.

Therefore, it is a church of the Almighty Self to which one is joining, rather than the Church of the Almighty if one cannot offer a single doctrine which one has conformed to because…God said it/I believe it.

This inquisition I find tiring and frankly lacking. You don’t have to disagree if you believe. There have been posters who have repeatedly explained to you there is nothing about a religion’s teachings they don’t believe. Yet you continue to insist they must disagree with something. But It would be foolish for them to disagree if they believe. If they believe they’ve found God there or are seeking within the religion they believe in.

 

[Sy_Noe]

I disagree but I will answer your question. Similar to schaeffer, to the best of my knowledge there is nothing that I have come to know about the UCC teaching that I don’t believe. There are things I don’t understand, that’s where faith comes in, but there is nothing I don’t believe.

To save you further difficulties, I do not intend to answer any further questions from you. If you persist I will simply put you on my ignore list. If you want to know my reason send me a PM and I will tell you.

Indeed I find it tiring and nonsensical for someone to continuously argue that one must disagree with something about the teachings of their faith if there is nothing in their religion’s teachings the person does not believe. If one believes in a religion’s teachings, or believes they’ve found God there, it would be foolish for them to disagree. That’s not the same as creating God in one’s own image. But rather following the image one believes is God’s.