http://www-personal.umich.edu/~lilyth/cartoon/mrdid.jpgSo we say, “Hey, American people! Lawyers, insurance companies, collection agencies, doctors and hospitals are all taking advantage of you. So we’ll fix it so that lawyers, insurance companies, collection agencies, doctors, hospitals and bureaucrats can take advantage of you!!”
Here’s Vern’s approach to medical care:
How childish.
I have a day off so I’m planting flowers in my garden. 
It sounds like to me that really what your saying here is that the US can’t do this. That’s an interesting position. Its depressing to be sure, but I’m not going to dismiss you on it. Again that might be worthy of a thread.
In theory you can if you don’t mind paying out of pocket. Most people would find that difficult if not impossible to do.
I’m not going to argue that this would be better than our current system. However, I’m not sure it would be better a system like the French have. It would certainly be better for middle class but how would this system help the poor?
Yeah, most insurance carriers only accept certain providers within their network. Of course while not as bad as your VA experience. Doctors usually have to pick referals to other doctors in the network. And most specialists won’t take you off the street.
Yeah and if you think that’s bad consider that the UK ranks better than us on patient wait times! Unless you’re talking non-essential specialists then we rank only behind Germany.
Sure we do get some docs from other countries. We do pay well. Which is good since we still have less docs per 100,000 than any industrialized nation and some third world nations.
Sometimes, simplicity is needed to make a point. Your “solution” is naïve and wishful thinking…just like magic. It is based on the notion that everyone is very well off and has thousands in expendable income that they can set aside for medical expenses. Your “solution” fails to take chronic conditions, like pathia’s, into account. Oh, you play lip service by adding a little pittance for the poor but otherwise, it’s another right-wing solution that helps no one but the already wealthy.
How about the people who work part time? Some of them don’t qualify for the insurance at their places of work.l And what about those who work for individuals, maids, yardmen, etc. If they don’t work for an agency, they don’t have insurance.
I appreciate the list, I will be contacting some of these organizations, however the bolded part is what messes me up. I have insurance coverage, they just refuse to cover most of my expenses. They are the only insurance company in the state that will cover me, so I have no other options. I don’t know if there are exceptions for this situation or not, most people I’ve contacted won’t help me because I have insurance. However, I’m forced it at work basically, I can’t exactly not-pay for it, even if I wanted to even though it doesn’t do anything for me. I’m currently discussing with HR what to do about this situation.
No, I’m saying the Government shouldn’t do it.
So the solution is to pay out of someone else’s pocket? And to thank that person by forcing him under the same restrictions?
Obviously you didn’t read the original post. I’ll repost it.
MSAs would give us much more freedom.
Which is an entirely different matter. Specialists rely on GPs and other physicians to diagnose and make tests. Would you expect to walk into a neurosurgeon’s office and say, “Hey, Doc! I need brain surgery right away?”
And if that happened to me, I’d quit and work elsewhere.
Funny how I never wind up on a waiting list – unless it’s with the VA.
My county has a population of about 12,000. If each of us saw the doctor once a year, and he spend an hour giving us a checkup, we’d need 6 physicians. We have 11 physicians. Do we need more?
The last time I managed to see an endocrinologist, the specialist I need to see the most often, I had to wait 6months after my GP had said I needed one. Most of the others had even longer waiting lists, I just picked the one that could see me the fastest and even then I drove 4hours.Funny how I never wind up on a waiting list – unless it’s with the VA.
And yet the rest of the industrialized world (with UHC) has better health care than we do. So if your above snip is accurate what does that make our system?
First sentence we pay out of pocket for lots of expenses that may or may not benefit us as individuals, healthcare would just be one of the better things to pay out to.
Please do and focus on the poor because what I saw before didn’t really seem offer much benefit to them.
Than what we have now certainly.
Well I wouldn’t tell him how to treat me, but why shouldn’t I be able to go to a specialist when I need one? Other countries allow it and works for them.
I’m glad that you have a profession that has a health job market. Many do not. Heck I’m on my second career profession because the first one pretty much locked me down into my position. I’m lucky though because I’m single and don’t have children. Other’s cannot be as flip with their decisions. Also, when one is in that scenario it doesn’t make the greatest amount of sense to leave what coverage you have to go to zero coverage. And Cobra is a joke.
I have, my mother has, my dad has, my brothers have, my aunts and uncles have. Many of my friends have. It isn’t uncommon but then again the US isn’t that bad in this area we’re in the top 6 that’s not to shabby. Also keep in mind that while we were at 37% for next day visits that is still pretty good. I only brought that one up because people always throw the “waiting list” card as con against universal healthcare but in reality 5 UHC countries have shorter waiting times than we do. But still this is the one area we do well in.Funny how I never wind up on a waiting list – unless it’s with the VA.
Vern and I mean this as kindly as possible please use some common sense here. You are blessed to live in area with a saturation of doctors. That’s awesome but try to understand your little county is not the entire United States. Not everyone is blessed with great health insurance and not everyone lives in an area that is convenient to healthcare.
This sounds like an extremely unusual situation to me. There must be more to this story.
…bang on. Debating with Vern is a waste of energy…he will never concede defeat and he has soundly lost this debate.
You say they have better health care. But under indentical circumstances, that isn’t so. Also, there’s a lot of juggling the figures – for example, obesity in America is cited. How will a government health care system cure obesity?
That assumes we will get better healthcare. What if we get a healthcare system that is as expensive and ineffective as our Public School System?
Ah, the old, “If you don’t want it, you don’t have to have it – but you still have to pay for it” ploy.
Watch for my next post.
Under MSAs, everyone could go to any specialist they wanted.
Which is why Congress should get off its butt and enact MSAs.
Pardon me!?!?
For one thing, the Clinton administration paid medical schools not to graduate so many doctors. They figured less is better.
The doctor shortage is a result of enrollment cutbacks by medical schools several years ago, which we are feeling the affects of now. At the same time these cutbacks occurred, there was a big push for enrollment in other medical professions, such as nurse practitioners and physician assistant programs. The purpose of this is debatable, but it is theorized that it was in anticipation of rising medical costs, and the eventual shift to UHC, which would result in a catastrophic exodus of doctors from the medical field.
Extremely naïve and wishful thinking.
Now that hurt – coming from someone who long ago admitted he knew nothing of economics.
Nope.