Unkindness is shaking my faith

[MNathaniel]

Definitely get off social media. I’d strongly suggest avoiding ‘news’ websites as well (unless you’ve found a magically balanced, non-partisan, calm-language, respectful and mutually loving news source… in which case… what is it???)

You soul and emotional and mental health are important. The enemy wants to test that and shake you into despair. The world becomes better almost immediately once you put down the screen.

Apart from that… I strongly recommend, if possible? that you take time to sit with Jesus in the Eucharist. Remember that it is his compassion that you rely on and strive to embody. He is our rock. Hold on to Him, and nothing else can shake you (though everything else will indeed be shaken away).

Let yourself be the change you want to see in the world. This song often cheers me up on that front

Focus on what God is calling you to do; you don’t know what God is calling your neighbour to do. It’s a hard truth to remember, but we’re all on a battlefield… and the enemy isn’t flesh and blood, but powers and principalities. The Catholics and other Christians you are observing participate in wicked actions, may be losing their battles against the powers attacking them and need your prayers – or they might be overcoming as much as possible, but in ways you can’t see. Either way, please pray for them; I often find that helps relax my judgment and anger against other people, too. When I pray for them – and not just pray for them to be ‘kinder’, ‘wiser’, etc (you know, the opposite of the things that annoy me about them, or the things that I think would make them act like better people to others) – but when I have to really think about something that will benefit them without benefitting me, like: “Lord, please bless Patricia with a day full of joy and consolations today; please bless her with a friend to listen to her struggles; please bless her with some really good food and ____ [whatever else.” Prayers that re-orient me towards loving the person, not angsting about them needing to be a ‘good person’ right now (as much as of course, part of loving someone is wanting them to be fully themselves as God made them to be, which will be a ‘good person’).

 

[Sarcelle]

But sometimes - observing comments on social media - I think how can the faith possibly be true if its done nothing to soften our hearts, and we are just as nasty to each other as anyone else. Its as if we have never seen the words “love your enemies”.

I think you would have to divorce what is truth and how people act.

For example, someone who says that the earth revolves around the sun will still be right no matter how unpleasant that someone is.

Truth does not depend on how people treat each other. They’re two different things.

Truth stands on its own.

Sure people do not always abide by Christian ideals but that doesn’t make Christian ideals wrong.

 

[Sarcelle]

The Divine Mercy prayer centers me.

Same here.

I remember an excerpt from St. Faustina’s diary where she complains to Jesus about how the other nuns were treating her.

He told her and I’m paraphrasing here “So, what’s it to you? Be merciful to them anyway.”

I remember this every time someone is rude to me and it gives me peace.

 

[Donkey]

Imitation of Christ Book 1 Chapter 16
BEARING WITH THE FAULTS OF OTHERS

UNTIL God ordains otherwise, a man ought to bear patiently whatever he cannot correct in himself and in others. Consider it better thus – perhaps to try your patience and to test you, for without such patience and trial your merits are of little account. Nevertheless, under such difficulties you should pray that God will consent to help you bear them calmly.

If, after being admonished once or twice, a person does not amend, do not argue with him but commit the whole matter to God that His will and honor may be furthered in all His servants, for God knows well how to turn evil to good. Try to bear patiently with the defects and infirmities of others, whatever they may be, because you also have many a fault which others must endure.

If you cannot make yourself what you would wish to be, how can you bend others to your will? We want them to be perfect, yet we do not correct our own faults. We wish them to be severely corrected, yet we will not correct ourselves. Their great liberty displeases us, yet we would not be denied what we ask. We would have them bound by laws, yet we will allow ourselves to be restrained in nothing. Hence, it is clear how seldom we think of others as we do of ourselves.

If all were perfect, what should we have to suffer from others for God’s sake? But God has so ordained, that we may learn to bear with one another’s burdens, for there is no man without fault, no man without burden, no man sufficient to himself nor wise enough. Hence we must support one another, console one another, mutually help, counsel, and advise, for the measure of every man’s virtue is best revealed in time of adversity – adversity that does not weaken a man but rather shows what he is.

This book has pure guidance in all matters.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Sure people do not always abide by Christian ideals but that doesn’t make Christian ideals wrong.

I agree. I think we also have to be really cognizant of our own biases when we’re judging whether someone else lives up to “Christian ideals”.

Obviously if someone is calling another person 15 nasty names and screaming at them, that’s not very Christian.

But too often I see people being accused of being un-Christian because they don’t agree with the other person’s view on a political or social issue, and that’s not necessarily fair.

For example, I think a lot of what gets posted on this forum regarding gay people is un-Christian in the extreme because to me it seems very uncharitable. The people who are posting it, on the other hand, think they are protecting the Church and Catholics from a major evil. We are both trying to be Christian, but in very different ways.

 

[Maragal]

Thank you all…the divine mercy paraphrase someone mentioned…God telling Saint Faustina “whats it to you…be compassionate to them anyway” (when the other nuns were unkind) hits the nail on the head…I actually today thought of “whats it to you” (from the Bible) in relation to sll this…

The poster who said you get a hard time in your particular part of america 1)for simply being catholic and 2) for ever havng a critique of the current administration…I feel your pain! Its the inability of folks (from all and every side of every political angle) to just stop…consider…and disagree in love…I hope we can all do better.

I love all the advice about prayer…Im going to try and pray for anyone who I encounter, who, for whatever reason, rubs me the wrong way…and just pray for their happiness and joy in God…

I do tons and tons of spiritual reading and Im HUGE on the saints, so theres always encouragement in their stories…Someone mentioned eucharistic adoration, and thats been a goal for a while…

Tisbear REALLY interesting your words about different “sides” being Christian but in different ways…different emphases…thats a lot to ruminate on…I hope even those of us who come down in different sides, while trying to be the best christians we can be - can do so with understanding.

 

[Donkey]

For example, I think a lot of what gets posted on this forum regarding gay people is un-Christian in the extreme because to me it seems very uncharitable. The people who are posting it, on the other hand, think they are protecting the Church and Catholics from a major evil. We are both trying to be Christian, but in very different ways.

Can you give a few actual examples of that because I fail to see that. I am just saying that is a bad example because that just doesn’t happen here, people here are not uncharitable in that regard.

 

[StudentMI]

I remember it used to be really bad. I don’t even read threads that have that topic anymore due to what happened in the past so I can’t speak about what it’s like now, but not that long ago? Yeah, it was bad. And I say that as someone with same sex attraction.

 

[Donkey]

Concrete examples please because I disagree. I just hate to see this thread being used for an agenda.

 

[StudentMI]

Just look up Catolico65.

 

[Donkey]

I won’t do that. If the mods felt something offensive was shared they would have removed it.

The truth simply hurts sometimes.

 

[StudentMI]

You won’t look it up despite asking for concrete examples. I gave you one. Then without looking at the posts, you declare the truth hurts. So, did you look up the posts or with that remark are you endorsing his views without looking at them?

 

[Maragal]

Donkey and Student - I absolutely have seen charitable conversations,
even in disagreement, re that topic, people disagreeing in love… and also extremely uncharitable ones re that topic, people being horrible…here on CAF…CAF is a BIG place and moderators cant always have oversight…so I cannot agree all inappropriate conversation on CAF is stopped. As a matter of fact, Ive had very un kind things said to me, and name calling, a few times. I think the whole point is - we are going to find unkindness even on catholic forums (including CAF) Thats what I started this thread about…and about how I work to keep my faith even when I see lack of charity - and challenging lack of charity in myself!!! Lets not turn my thread into something else, I ask respectfully. If someone has experienced unkindness re a certain topic - I will give them the benefit of the doubt that its true. Ill also believe the person who hasnt seen it - maybe its been different threads!

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Sorry, not interested in taking the thread off topic, nor in debating this with anyone here. I just used it as an example. Thanks for your understanding.

 

[Donkey]

I am the wrong person to report issues to. Just saying that problems are generally swiftly taken care at CAF. I asked for actual quotations not a search word.

 

[StudentMI]

I’m sorry for taking it off topic.

I’ve encountered unkindness as well. It can be hard to deal with. I find reflecting on the opposition Our Lord faced helps, as well as some of his saints like Padre Pio. If you haven’t read the book Arise from Darkness by Fr. Benedict Groeschel yet I highly recommend it. There’s a chapter in there about being treated badly by the Church.

 

[Donkey]

That’s okay tis bear and student mi. I am just a little defensive because for years I see that CAF moderates super well…protecting the Faith and keeping order and freedom of speech.

 

[JanR]

The MSM is downright toxic. Social media is only slightly different because it’s not totally controlled but it’s open to the public.

Aside from that, I think that people IRL are generally more kind than they used to be. I can remember adults and children being mean in a way that I just don’t see anymore. I’m sure it has to do with the proliferation of ideas like equality, tolerance etc. But not just that, in the last 50 years discoveries in the fields of neuroscience, psychology, sociology etc. have changed the way we teach children, treat addicts, accept minorities, etc.

So there’s a case to be made either way. YMMV

Boy, is that true! When discussing my ancestors with some of my cousins, I learned that my great-grandfather, who was a farmer, would whip grandpa and my older grand-uncles when they were working in the fields, apparently because he didn’t think they were working fast enough. He also drank, and that didn’t help. I recall one of the cousins saying that my great-grandmother tried to warn him that his older boys would leave home and never return. They did, although many years later they returned only to visit, with their own families. He died from falling off a fence while being intoxicated.

One story went that great-grandpa was popping that whip one day and accidentally cut a hole in the calf of his younger daughter, and it left a permanent scar.

This was in the deep, rural south around the turn of the 20th century. Apparently, that sort of thing was a cultural norm back then.

Today, that behavior would be considered child abuse, and undoubtedly, great-grandpa would have been arrested and his children removed from the home. Great-grandma might also have been arrested for letting him do that, although I suspect he might have abused her, too. He was drunk a great deal of the time.

Yes, times have changed in the way we treat kids.

HOWEVER, seeing how some of our leaders treat one another when they disagree with them makes me wonder if things haven’t actually gotten worse, as far as intolerance and lack of civility is concerned. I.E. – Nancy Pelosi publicly tearing up the President’s speech. Just one example.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

This has nothing to do with moderation. There are plenty of comments on the forum on many different subjects, not just the example I gave, that I feel are quite uncharitable but which cannot be flagged as they do not violate TOS. I usually don’t say anything about it because like I said, no TOS violation, otherwise I would flag.

And I am sure people feel that way about some of my comments. I was recently accused of a lack of charity because I did not approve of one of my former bishops, now deceased, closing churches without following the established canon law process. Someone thought it was uncharitable for me to criticize the bishop and/or to express that I hoped we did not get another bishop doing that, even though I was simply factually stating what happened and how badly it made me and a lot of other people feel.

Like I said, “Uncharitable” is often a synonym for “I disagree and I don’t think whatever you’re talking about should be such a big deal,” rather than actual lack of charity.

 

[childinthefaith]

Im really struggling with this. Everywhere I go - nasty comments, sarcasm, downright hatred spewed - by those calling themselves Catholics and Christians. Those on the right, those on the left. Those who support Trump, those who dont.

I would call this not a “faith” problem, but a "people’ problem. That is to say, perhaps your faith in the goodness of people is being shaken rather than your faith in God. But, they are after all people just like you and I, “sinned and fallen short.”

My personal advice would be to take care where you are looking. Focus on God rather than these people and issues and you will probably notice they bother you less, but that you find how you, as a Christian setting an example, can best respond so that others may take note and change themselves.

Best wishes,