Unsweetened tea and Sunday fast

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Hi all, just wondering about the hour fast before taking the Eucharist (I heard it used to be 3 hours.) Anyway, I am in my parish’s choir, and I have trouble hitting certain notes when my mouth inevitably dries out halfway through service. Also, hot beverages relax the throat. So, I was considering, assuming I get approval to have it in the church, bringing a thermos of unsweetened herbal tea to sip to keep my mouth and throat moist and my vocal chords relax. I’m a bass, and by the end of a mass my throat is hurting from notes I can’t pull from the diaphragm; the higher notes. At the same time, if it violates the hour fast before taking Eucharist I’ll just keep doing without.
 
I was in the ministry of cantor, and my leading the congregation did not depend on many, such as a choir, but it was solely on my shoulders to lead the singing. Mornings are sometimes bad, with me having phlegm in my throat. My priest said not to worry about eating a throat-clearing cough drop just moments before mass, and if necessary, during mass.

Why not ask your pastor for dispensation?
 
This is a question for your pastor. Medicine does not break the fast, so, if hot tea has a medicinal purpose for you, it might be permitted.
 
Professional vocalist, voice teacher, and experienced cantor here to give you more of an answer than you were probably looking for: Hot tea is not medicine, because it is not necessary, nor even indicated. Hot water will do the same thing – it’s actually the swallowing, the steam, and possibly the heat that does the job of relaxing the folds, not the tea. No liquid of any sort actually hits your vocal folds, ever, or else you choke. Tea will violate the fast; but hot water won’t.

Teas such as slippery elm or licorice, which “lubricate the throat,” are only touching the passageway that leads to your stomach. The folds themselves are located in the passageway leading directly to your lungs, and are therefore protected from swallowed items - such as food and drink - by your epiglottis. which folds down to cover the trachea. There’s a decent diagram here.

Now: rather than treat the symptom, let’s talk about some of the underlying problems. PAIN is not normal or acceptable in singing!


  1. *]If you’re drying out in 30 minutes, you’re starting out already dehydrated. Hydration for a singer must be around-the-clock. A dry throat is not a quick fix. It takes 45 minutes for swallowed water to benefit the vocal folds – and it might not actually give the folds any benefit at all if the rest of your body is dehydrated, because the body will prioritize more essential systems. Drink. Water. All. The. Time. Do it for just two weeks and you’ll see a difference. (Adrenaline, which gives us that feeling of “nerves”, can also dry you out, and in that case a swallow of water can make you feel more comfortable. But well-learned music coming from a hydrated body will still be singable with that kind of dryness.)

    *]Your description of “pulling” the high notes “from your diaphragm” is physiologically inaccurate, and that perception is likely contributing to hyperfunction (doing too much work), which is making you tire so quickly. And then, once you’re tired, your breathing apparatus won’t function in a properly coordinated manner, so your vocal folds will end up doing more work. This is one possible source of the tension you feel in your voice.

    *]I wonder if you’re singing by feel or by listening for your own voice with your ears? If the latter, you’re probably over-singing, which again would tire you more quickly.

    *]Given that same description of high notes, I suspect your concepts of breathing and sound production have some important flaws which translate to real physical difficulties.

    *]Breathe through your nose whenever possible during Mass. Singing often requires mouth-breathing, which is fine and even good – but it will dry you out faster. When you have time for a slower breath within the music, or when you’re not singing, breathe through your nose.

    I would say that you need to drink more water in your daily life and take some voice lessons, including breathing work, from a good teacher. The answer is education, not a dispensation. 🙂 And I really do encourage you to take some voice lessons. It will benefit you, your choir, your church, and your relationship with God. Learning to use our bodies the way God designed them, and to produce a beautiful thing from that cooperation with him, is very rewarding.

    [To the poster about phlegm: steaming or a proper warm-up including some agility exercises are two healthy ways to get rid of phlegm. Cough drops are problematic for a couple of reasons, and like tea, are not indicated… but I don’t want to hijack the thread.]
 
MrsAngelala said:
[To the poster about phlegm: steaming or a proper warm-up including some agility exercises are two healthy ways to get rid of phlegm. Cough drops are problematic for a couple of reasons, and like tea, **are not indicated
Click to expand...
… but I don’t want to hijack the thread.]

Not indicated, perhaps, but cantoring IS “indicated” and necessary. Whatever is needed to perform this ministry is acceptable and dispensable by my pastor. By the way, he is not expected to know all the trade and medical secrets of professional vocalists. I believe his directive to me was valid and I prefer to follow him, since he is my spiritual advisor.

I have also brought holy communion to the sick in the hospital. There is no way we are to inquire whether they have kept the one-hour fast. The fact that they are in the hospital dispenses them. Rules are for the able-bodied, not the infirm, and even our bishop has dispensed from the Friday abstinence on certain occasions, which is his lawful right to do.

Incidentally, although I am not required to fast on Good Friday since I am well past the age limit, I did keep it all day. However, when evening came and it was time to take Ibuprofen in order to sleep well, I had to eat so that it would not bother my stomach. Do you see that it is what lies in the intention as a necessity, and not the fact of breaking a rule?
 
Sirach2, in your answer to me, I see you attributing to me things that I didn’t say or imply. I find this troubling and hurtful.

Of course you’re bound by what your pastor told you; and of course he’s not trained in this field. Perhaps you didn’t know any better at the time, but that doesn’t mean that you were objectively correct to tell him cough drops were a necessity. The most fundamental thing that *is *necessary for a cantor is the humility to pursue training in the ministry and in the proper use of one’s voice, that one may serve God to the utmost of one’s ability. (A person unable to do this for certain reasons may perhaps be justified in continuing in the ministry, though a person unwilling is of course not.)

A singer who is limited because of lack of understanding is not less than able-bodied. The kindest and most helpful way to address honest ignorance is through education, not necessarily or at all points by changing or suspending the rules.

The ministry of cantor is not necessary in some cases, one of the jobs of cantors is to make it less necessary, and the ministry is never fundamental to the Mass. I’m not going to discourse upon this, however; if you’re truly interested, the Church documents are easy enough to find.

Voice is a science as well as an art, and though most people engage in the field as amateurs (and welcome are they to do it, though I could wish they would stop slamming the professionals!), it is a serious study for some. I write as a trained vocalist, very experienced cantor, and skilled teacher. I have gone to a great deal of trouble to advance my education in these areas - including but not limited to earning the highest degree of cantor certification available nationally.

The next time you write a post, please consider responding to what was written instead of reacting to what was not. I may be a person you’ll never meet, but I am a person - one who is quickly learning not to offer the benefits of her hard-won education and experience within this forum.

I cordially invite you to bring this exchange to your spiritual director.

Unsubscribing from this thread.
 
MrsAngelala said:
I cordially invite you to bring this exchange to your spiritual director.
Click to expand...
I have, and **he **is the one whom I will listen to, as I said.
Wow, both barrels fully loaded! How condescending of you to expect either I or my pastor to have your training - and, how do you know I did NOT have professional vocal lessons?
Yes, thank you for unsubscribing. You are not being a bit helpful to the OP or to myself.
 
MrsAngelala said:
Sirach2, in your answer to me, I see you attributing to me things that I didn’t say or imply. I find this troubling and hurtful.

Of course you’re bound by what your pastor told you; and of course he’s not trained in this field. Perhaps you didn’t know any better at the time, but that doesn’t mean that you were objectively correct to tell him cough drops were a necessity. The most fundamental thing that *is *necessary for a cantor is the humility to pursue training in the ministry and in the proper use of one’s voice, that one may serve God to the utmost of one’s ability. (A person unable to do this for certain reasons may perhaps be justified in continuing in the ministry, though a person unwilling is of course not.)

A singer who is limited because of lack of understanding is not less than able-bodied. The kindest and most helpful way to address honest ignorance is through education, not necessarily or at all points by changing or suspending the rules.

The ministry of cantor is not necessary in some cases, one of the jobs of cantors is to make it less necessary, and the ministry is never fundamental to the Mass. I’m not going to discourse upon this, however; if you’re truly interested, the Church documents are easy enough to find.

Voice is a science as well as an art, and though most people engage in the field as amateurs (and welcome are they to do it, though I could wish they would stop slamming the professionals!), it is a serious study for some. I write as a trained vocalist, very experienced cantor, and skilled teacher. I have gone to a great deal of trouble to advance my education in these areas - including but not limited to earning the highest degree of cantor certification available nationally.

The next time you write a post, please consider responding to what was written instead of reacting to what was not. I may be a person you’ll never meet, but I am a person - one who is quickly learning not to offer the benefits of her hard-won education and experience within this forum.

I cordially invite you to bring this exchange to your spiritual director.

Unsubscribing from this thread.
Click to expand...
I can’t imagine what in the world you are talking about.
No one insulted you.

Who offers national certification of cantors?
 
Sorry to see so much misunderstanding between folks in this thread. I didn’t mean any harm. Apparently some nerves got touched. We all love God, and God loves all of us; so, I hope we can move beyond any intended or unintended hurt.

Anyway, I have had voice training, and I think the higher notes hurt because they’re just out of my range. I’m not a basso profundo, but I am definitely a bass. I don’t like baritone lines because they’re usually written more for the tenor, and even some bass lines go way too high, above the bass clef.

Previous voice coaches have recommended hot herbal tea, but being right for the Eucharist is way more important to me. I can’t drink enough water beforehand, but maybe I can get permission to bring a bottle of room temperature water. It could at least help. Our parish is in a historic mission, with brick floors, so maybe it’ll be alright.

Cough drops are fine if a person medically needs them. I have seasonal allergies, but I still prefer not to use them before mass. Other members of my choir use cough drops, and I don’t judge for them if it’s right or not. I have a better Eucharist experience when I don’t, but that doesn’t mean it’s the same for everyone.

Pax et bonum
 
I appreciated MsAngelala’s informative reply. I sing in church as well and do not find drinking water helpful when I have a healthy but dry throat…usually it just makes me cough. I do find hot water soothing when my throat is irritated due to a mild cold, probably because of the steaming effect, as she noted.

To the OP, you should talk to your pastor about what you may be allowed to drink and still receive Communion. You might also want to take MsAngelala’s professional advice into consideration. There are always ways in which we can improve ourselves mentally, physically, and spiritually so that we can become better servants for God within our ministries.
 
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