USCCB and Papal Letter

[bkovacs]

Why is it that the USCCB website has not front paged Pope Benedict XVI letter to all the Bishops in regards to the SSPX and V2. This is big news!. Are they avoiding showing it to the public.

 

[FAB]

Why is it that the USCCB website has not front paged Pope Benedict XVI letter to all the Bishops in regards to the SSPX and V2. This is big news!. Are they avoiding showing it to the public.

Perhaps because the lifting of excomunication did not end the skisim. Nothing has changed shince the SSPX bishops still do not accept Vatican II and it’s authorty.

 

[Deacon_Ed]

I’m not sure there’s anything to report! As the pope made clear in his letter to the bishops, the lifting of the excommunication had to do with individuals and not an organization. The SSPX does not have any official recognition from the Church and the bishops have not canonical mission or formal status in the Church. Unless that changes there’s really nothing to “front page.”

Deacon Ed

 

[malphono]

Perhaps because the lifting of excomunication did not end the skisim. Nothing has changed shince the SSPX bishops still do not accept Vatican II and it’s authorty.

This is merely an observation from someone who is not an avid SSPX-er. They (the USCCB) didn’t open their collective mouth in the Williamson affair, so perhaps they are taking the “ostrich approach” and burying their collective head in the sand with regard to anything involving the FSSPX. Could be. I don’t know. Maybe no. Maybe yes. As I said, merely an observation.

 

[Ottaviani]

Perhaps because the lifting of excomunication did not end the skisim. Nothing has changed shince the SSPX bishops still do not accept Vatican II and it’s authorty.

wow. If you’re going to make a false accusation, at least spell schism right.

 

[Ottaviani]

on that note, why did the USCCB condone voting for pro abortion candidates if “abortion wasn’t the central reason” (as if that somehow makes it ok to continue the genocide).

This from those who say we’re not in a crisis, make excuses for abortion, and chastise tradition. Stay classy USCCB:thumbsup:

 

[OseeMe]

on that note, why did the USCCB condone voting for pro abortion candidates if “abortion wasn’t the central reason” (as if that somehow makes it ok to continue the genocide).

This from those who say we’re not in a crisis, make excuses for abortion, and chastise tradition. Stay classy USCCB:thumbsup:

The USCCB is not the Pope and the Magisterium. Don’t let the fact that some miscreants who happen to be a few bishops in the United States that are misleading the populace with their ambiguous messages given by how they vote for issues at annual conferences scew the fact that the Church headed by the Pope and the Magisterium is the legitimate authority to be acknowledged, and the the last Council is valid, though misinterpreted due to those who seek to twist the decrees to their own insidious purposes. No legitimate organization or order can, with any intellectual honesty, take what the “Tares” in the Church stand for or say that may be contrary to the Church’s teachings, and try to blame it on the Church as a whole, thus broadstroking the whole Church as failing the faithful. This is what the SSPX has done regardless of any disputes they have with scandals that will always exist in the Church as long as sinners are its members, which will be until the end of time. Never will that reason make the Church illegitimate. We have to be just as vigilant, as faithful laypeople, to hold accountable those who seek to attempt to destroy the Church from within by keeping ourselves informed and getting the facts out concerning issues that can cause scandal and cause the faithful to doubt the Faith.

 

[Ottaviani]

The USCCB is not the Pope and the Magisterium. Don’t let the fact that some miscreants who happen to be a few bishops in the United States that are misleading the populace with their ambiguous messages given by how they vote for issues at annual conferences scew the fact that the Church headed by the Pope and the Magisterium is the legitimate authority to be acknowledged, and the the last Council is valid, though misinterpreted due to those who seek to twist the decrees to their own insidious purposes. No legitimate organization or order can, with any intellectual honesty, take what the “Tares” in the Church stand for or say that may be contrary to the Church’s teachings, and try to blame it on the Church as a whole, thus broadstroking the whole Church as failing the faithful. This is what the SSPX has done regardless of any disputes they have with scandals that will always exist in the Church as long as sinners are its members, which will be until the end of time. Never will that reason make the Church illegitimate. We have to be just as vigilant, as faithful laypeople, to hold accountable those who seek to attempt to destroy the Church from within by keeping ourselves informed and getting the facts out concerning issues that can cause scandal and cause the faithful to doubt the Faith.

I agree with the first half of your post. However, I’m not sure about your understanding of the SSPX. It’s not a blame game, it’s holding accountable those who have lost the faith. this isn’t “blaming it on the entire Church”, but instead pointing out heresy.

 

[OseeMe]

I agree with the first half of your post. However, I’m not sure about your understanding of the SSPX. It’s not a blame game, it’s holding accountable those who have lost the faith. this isn’t “blaming it on the entire Church”, but instead pointing out heresy.

Hey Ottaviani,

I know about the SSPX. I had an experience with them and even recieved their periodicals for a period of time, and was almost convinced by the arguements they had until I researched the order a little more. I am an orthodox believing Catholic that prefers the reverence of the Tridentine Mass, and the Novus Ordo Mass celebrated properly as evidenced by the Mass held on EWTN everyday. But have many issues with the commonly celebrated Masses I have witnessed over many years in several parishes that I have attended. I am curious though. Who are you attributing the heresy to that you are pointing out. Are you refering to those in the Church who have lost the faith, or those in the SSPX?

 

[elts1956]

wow. If you’re going to make a false accusation, at least spell schism right.

The USCCB is not the Pope and the Magisterium. Don’t let the fact that some miscreants who happen to be a few bishops in the United States that are misleading the populace with their ambiguous messages given by how they vote for issues at annual conferences scew the fact that the Church headed by the Pope and the Magisterium is the legitimate authority to be acknowledged, and the the last Council is valid, though misinterpreted due to those who seek to twist the decrees to their own insidious purposes. No legitimate organization or order can, with any intellectual honesty, take what the “Tares” in the Church stand for or say that may be contrary to the Church’s teachings, and try to blame it on the Church as a whole, thus broadstroking the whole Church as failing the faithful. This is what the SSPX has done regardless of any disputes they have with scandals that will always exist in the Church as long as sinners are its members, which will be until the end of time. Never will that reason make the Church illegitimate. We have to be just as vigilant, as faithful laypeople, to hold accountable those who seek to attempt to destroy the Church from within by keeping ourselves informed and getting the facts out concerning issues that can cause scandal and cause the faithful to doubt the Faith.

I think our best protection is to check with the Pope and the Vatican before making a serious choice, or judgement. The USCCB, as a group, didn’t clarify Church teaching regarding the abortion issue this past election. It was only through reading encyclicals such as Evangelium Vitae and Veritatis Splendor that I could make sense of the USCCB documents. Although the encyclicals are complex documents to read, they don’t lead one around in circles such as the USCCB Voting document did.

 

[benedictgal]

I think our best protection is to check with the Pope and the Vatican before making a serious choice, or judgement. The USCCB, as a group, didn’t clarify Church teaching regarding the abortion issue this past election. It was only through reading encyclicals such as Evangelium Vitae and Veritatis Splendor that I could make sense of the USCCB documents. Although the encyclicals are complex documents to read, they don’t lead one around in circles such as the USCCB Voting document did.

Rather than read the document on Faithful Citizenship, I chose to read the declarations made when Pope Benedict XVI served as Prefect for the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. The statements were crystal clear and easy to understand. It confirmed what I knew in my conscience I had to do when I darkened the ovals on my ballot box in October (we vote early in Texas).

Regarding the issue raised by the OP, I read the complete text of the letter as found in the online magazine Chiesa. Tonight’s Zenit English edition also carries the letter in full. Contrary to what some might think, this is big news because this is the first time that the Pope has had to make a clear and direct statement regarding why he did what he did. Furthermore, he clarified that the lifting of the excommunication had nodthing to do with the statements that Bishop Williamson made regarding the Holocaust. The two are separate affairs.

He also makes a statement that radical folks on both the left and the right should take note of and heed: the Church cannot stay frozen at 1962, nor can one hold the belief that the Second Vatican Council removed 2,000 years of Sacred Tradition, there is continuity in the Church. Both parties have to accept that.

Furthermore, the Holy Father reminded the bishops that he had first-hand experience in dealing wtih the SSPX back when he was prefect. Pope John Paul II asked him to personally intervene and visit with the group.

The letter was magnificentlly written in clear and direct language. It will bother people, but, then again, so did the epistles that St. Paul wrote.

 

[elts1956]

Rather than read the document on Faithful Citizenship, I chose to read the declarations made when Pope Benedict XVI served as Prefect for the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. The statements were crystal clear and easy to understand. It confirmed what I knew in my conscience I had to do when I darkened the ovals on my ballot box in October (we vote early in Texas).

Regarding the issue raised by the OP, I read the complete text of the letter as found in the online magazine Chiesa. Tonight’s Zenit English edition also carries the letter in full. Contrary to what some might think, this is big news because this is the first time that the Pope has had to make a clear and direct statement regarding why he did what he did. Furthermore, he clarified that the lifting of the excommunication had nodthing to do with the statements that Bishop Williamson made regarding the Holocaust. The two are separate affairs.

He also makes a statement that radical folks on both the left and the right should take note of and heed: the Church cannot stay frozen at 1962, nor can one hold the belief that the Second Vatican Council removed 2,000 years of Sacred Tradition, there is continuity in the Church. Both parties have to accept that.

Furthermore, the Holy Father reminded the bishops that he had first-hand experience in dealing wtih the SSPX back when he was prefect. Pope John Paul II asked him to personally intervene and visit with the group.

The letter was magnificentlly written in clear and direct language. It will bother people, but, then again, so did the epistles that St. Paul wrote.

That works too. I just wish more people had at least read something other than Faithful Citizenship. Their consciences might have been given an awakening.

 

[daughteroftruth]

Why is it that the USCCB website has not front paged Pope Benedict XVI letter to all the Bishops in regards to the SSPX and V2. This is big news!. Are they avoiding showing it to the public.

Is that really such a shock, considering the wonderful job they’ve done shepherding the Church in America?

 

[Ottaviani]

I think our best protection is to check with the Pope and the Vatican before making a serious choice, or judgement. The USCCB, as a group, didn’t clarify Church teaching regarding the abortion issue this past election. It was only through reading encyclicals such as Evangelium Vitae and Veritatis Splendor that I could make sense of the USCCB documents. Although the encyclicals are complex documents to read, they don’t lead one around in circles such as the USCCB Voting document did.

You made sense of the USCCB documents? Impressive

Here’s my take: The documents made it easier for much of the laity to vote for pro abortion candidates without a guilty conscience. They made it easier for abortion. They led the sheep astray.

If only it were true that the majority of the laity followed Evangelium Vitae, but the fact of the matter is, the USCCB garbage gets thrown around at all of the liberal parishes and nothing is done to turn slow down the genocide.

 

[Ottaviani]

Hey Ottaviani,

I know about the SSPX. I had an experience with them and even recieved their periodicals for a period of time, and was almost convinced by the arguements they had until I researched the order a little more. I am an orthodox believing Catholic that prefers the reverence of the Tridentine Mass, and the Novus Ordo Mass celebrated properly as evidenced by the Mass held on EWTN everyday. But have many issues with the commonly celebrated Masses I have witnessed over many years in several parishes that I have attended. I am curious though. Who are you attributing the heresy to that you are pointing out. Are you refering to those in the Church who have lost the faith, or those in the SSPX?

Pointing out heresy and spiritual danger is the job of those in the Church, whatever order they come from. Those who have lost the faith no longer belong to the Church spiritually, yet corrupt Her from within. They are our enemy.

 

[bkovacs]

Rather than read the document on Faithful Citizenship, I chose to read the declarations made when Pope Benedict XVI served as Prefect for the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. The statements were crystal clear and easy to understand. It confirmed what I knew in my conscience I had to do when I darkened the ovals on my ballot box in October (we vote early in Texas).

Regarding the issue raised by the OP, I read the complete text of the letter as found in the online magazine Chiesa. Tonight’s Zenit English edition also carries the letter in full. Contrary to what some might think, this is big news because this is the first time that the Pope has had to make a clear and direct statement regarding why he did what he did. Furthermore, he clarified that the lifting of the excommunication had nodthing to do with the statements that Bishop Williamson made regarding the Holocaust. The two are separate affairs.

He also makes a statement that radical folks on both the left and the right should take note of and heed: the Church cannot stay frozen at 1962, nor can one hold the belief that the Second Vatican Council removed 2,000 years of Sacred Tradition, there is continuity in the Church. Both parties have to accept that.

Furthermore, the Holy Father reminded the bishops that he had first-hand experience in dealing wtih the SSPX back when he was prefect. Pope John Paul II asked him to personally intervene and visit with the group.

The letter was magnificentlly written in clear and direct language. It will bother people, but, then again, so did the epistles that St. Paul wrote.

Quote: “the Second Vatican Council removed 2,000 years of Sacred Tradition”. Problem is that most of the American Catholic Church feels that way. And it won’t change as long as all the V2 only clergy vacate our churches. All they talk about is V2. Never heard them once mention V1 or Trent. I would take an SSPX priest any day, over a priest in the Philadelphia Archdiocese.

 

[elts1956]

You made sense of the USCCB documents? Impressive

Here’s my take: The documents made it easier for much of the laity to vote for pro abortion candidates without a guilty conscience. They made iteasier for abortion. They led the sheep astray.

If only it were true that the majority of the laity followed Evangelium Vitae, but the fact of the matter is, the USCCB garbage gets thrown around at all of the liberal parishes and nothing is done to turn slow down the genocide.

As I said, if I hadn’t read the encyclicals I would have just skimmed over the Bishop’s documents and made no specific discoveries as to what jellyfish those men were for the most part. The documents were contradictory and confusing. Another thing that helped me was the refusal of almost 200 Bishops to protect the Holy Eucharist from sacrilege by pro abort pols. That gave me as great big read flag that, “something is rotten in Denmark.”

It wasn’t only the encyclicals, but also the fact that I had a thorough Catholic upbringing by those Notre Dame sisters in the 40s and 50s. Life was not so wild then as it is now. There weren’t as many temptations, but we were also raised with the concept of self-discipline and delayed gratification which people who lean toward the liberal today have not heard anything about.

 

[Ottaviani]

As I said, if I hadn’t read the encyclicals I would have just skimmed over the Bishop’s documents and made no specific discoveries as to what jellyfish those men were for the most part. The documents were contradictory and confusing. Another thing that helped me was the refusal of almost 200 Bishops to protect the Holy Eucharist from sacrilege by pro abort pols. That gave me as great big read flag that, “something is rotten in Denmark.”

It wasn’t only the encyclicals, but also the fact that I had a thorough Catholic upbringing by those Notre Dame sisters in the 40s and 50s. Life was not so wild then as it is now. There weren’t as many temptations, but we were also raised with the concept of self-discipline and delayed gratification which people who lean toward the liberal today have not heard anything about.

Very well said.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

As I said, if I hadn’t read the encyclicals I would have just skimmed over the Bishop’s documents and made no specific discoveries as to what jellyfish those men were for the most part. The documents were contradictory and confusing. Another thing that helped me was the refusal of almost 200 Bishops to protect the Holy Eucharist from sacrilege by pro abort pols. That gave me as great big read flag that, “something is rotten in Denmark.”

It wasn’t only the encyclicals, but also the fact that I had a thorough Catholic upbringing by those Notre Dame sisters in the 40s and 50s. Life was not so wild then as it is now. There weren’t as many temptations, but we were also raised with the concept of self-discipline and delayed gratification which people who lean toward the liberal today have not heard anything about.

Ain’t that the Truth…

 

[Patrick_Eastin]

Thread closed. We are not going to discuss anything dealing with the USCCB on this forum.