T
Tomdstone
Guest
Why did the US Public Health Service (USPHS) and the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) jointly recommend in 1999 that thimerosal should be phased out of use in childhood vaccines ?
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T
TheDoctor
Guest
As part of an overall effort to reduce the total amount of mercury in the biosystem. It had nothing specifically to do with any perceived link to autism (as far as I have been able to determine). From the CDC:Why did the US Public Health Service (USPHS) and the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) jointly recommend in 1999 that thimerosal should be phased out of use in childhood vaccines ?
Why was thimerosal removed from vaccines given to children?
In 1999, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) was required by law to assess the amount of mercury in all the products the agencyoversees, not just vaccines. The U.S. Public Health Service decided that as much mercury as possible should be removed from vaccines,and thimerosal was the only source of mercury in vaccines. Even though there was no evidence that thimerosal in vaccines was dangerous, the decision to remove it was a made as a precautionary measure to decrease overall exposure to mercury among young infants.This decision was possible because childhood vaccines could be reformulated to leave out thimerosal without threatening their safety,effectiveness, and purity. Today, no childhood vaccine used in the U.S.—except some formulations of flu vaccine in multi-dose vials—use thimerosal as a preservative.
cdc.gov/vaccines/hcp/patient-ed/conversations/downloads/vacsafe-thimerosal-color-office.pdf
There is no peer reviewed data to link vaccines with autism and no national medical organization in any country that adheres to such a hypothesis, again, as far as I have been able to determine.
O
on_the_hill
Guest
THERE IS NOT CAUSAL CONNECTION BETWEEN VACCINES AND AUTISM!!! Anyone who refuses to vaccinate a child because of the urban legend of autism being caused by vaccines ought to join the Flat Earth Society and the people who believe the Apollo Moon landings were faked.The extreme increase of autism over the past 20 years correlates to the increase in vaccinations.
What’s the epicenter of the American Anti-Vaxxer movement? Silicon Valley. Why Silicon Valley? Because there was a sharp increase in autism rates there. Why? Because there are a lot of people on the autism spectrum who work in computer-oriented careers. In other words, Sally and Joe both suffer from autism, both work for a tech giant in Silicon Valley, they meet, get married, and have a child. Surprise! Baby has autism. And right around this time that charlatan Dr. Andrew Wakefield published his pack of lies that autism is caused by vaccines.
Fortunately, he lost his license to practice medicine. Unfortunately, thousands of supposedly well-educated Americans are exposing their children and my children to deadly diseases.
And people die from chicken pox.
T
Tomdstone
Guest
THERE IS NOT CAUSAL CONNECTION BETWEEN VACCINES AND AUTISM!!!.Oh? Why has the government given money to families whose children became autistic after being vaccinated?
ebcala.org/areas-of-law/vaccine-law/watch-hdnet-world-report-vaccines-autism-mixed-signals
O
on_the_hill
Guest
I have no idea why. But I’m not going to rely on an advocacy site for unbiased information.Oh? Why has the government given money to families whose children became autistic after being vaccinated?
ebcala.org/areas-of-law/vaccine-law/watch-hdnet-world-report-vaccines-autism-mixed-signals
The vaccine-autism link was created by a doctor who:
" (i) [Wakefield] spread fear that the MMR vaccine might lead to autism, even though he knew that his own laboratory had carried out tests whose results dramatically contradicted his claims in that the measles virus had not been found in a single one of the children concerned in his study and he knew or ought to have known that there was absolutely no basis at all for his belief that the MMR should be broken up into single vaccines.
Code:
(ii) In spreading such fear, acted dishonestly and for mercenary motives in that, although he improperly failed to disclose the fact, he planned a rival vaccine and products (such as a diagnostic kit based on his theory) that could have made his fortune [emphasis mine]
(iii) **Gravely abused the children under his care** [emphasis mine] by unethically carrying out extensive invasive procedures (on occasions requiring three people to hold a child down), thereby driving nurses to leave and causing his medical colleagues serious concern and unhappiness
(iv) Improperly and/or dishonestly failed to disclose to his colleagues and to the public that his research on autistic children had begun with a contract with solicitors who were trying to sue the manufacturers of the MMR vaccine
(v) Improperly or dishonestly lent his reputation to the International Child Development Resource Centre, which promoted to very vulnerable parents expensive products for whose efficacy (as he knew or should have known) there was no scientific evidence "
E
estesbob
Guest
Both children had negative reactions to the vaccine that went far beyond autism. The board that granted the compensation did not mention autism as one of the reasons that compensation was appropriate.Oh? Why has the government given money to families whose children became autistic after being vaccinated?
ebcala.org/areas-of-law/vaccine-law/watch-hdnet-world-report-vaccines-autism-mixed-signals
If you are not comfortable having your children vaccinated that is your right. By the same token if schools are not comfortable having unvaccinated children attending classes that is their right.
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Boatswain2PA
Guest
First, I want to correct something. Vaccines are not made OF cells, vaccines are proteins which require cells to produce.
I work in emergency medicine. I see lots of sick kids every shift. ALMOST EVERY TIME the sick kid just has a viral syndrome and simply needs alternating doses of acetaminophen (tylenol) and ibuprofen (motrin), more fluids, and close observation by mom and dad. If it’s not a viral syndrome, then it is probably strep throat or an ear infection and they get amoxicillin (although studies show that this is unnecessary, the kiddo will get better without the antibiotic). Rarely is it something more serious like appendicitis, but I always have to be on guard to find the more serious thing.
And then there are the un-vaccinated kids. These kids scare the HELL out of me because I have rarely, if ever, seen some of the diseases THAT THIS KID SHOULDN’T EVEN BE AT RISK FOR GETTING. I’ve never seen Diphtheria, Tetanus, Polio, or even mumps. Now this mild rash on the kids leg, which is almost assuredly just a viral xanthem (a viral “cold” in the skin) just might be a meningiococcal rash which means this kid could be dead in a few hours if I don’t diagnose it immediately and start intravenous antibiotics. That cough that the 4 month old has had for 3 days might not be his first case of viral bronchitis, it may be pertussis that can have him cough so much he gets hypoxic brain damage.
Here is a list of childhood vaccines that are recommended by the Centers for Disease Control. Next to the vaccine is the recommended age for first vaccination (most require multiple innoculations for best immunity). Then I describe to you what this MOSTLY PREVENTABLE disease can do to your child or to others.
meningiococcal (6 weeks): This prevents a bacteria that wants to cause two different, but related diseases in your child: Meningococcemia and Meningitis.
Meningococcemia is a bacterial infection of the blood. It often starts with flu-like symptoms. A fever, nausea, body aches, headache, and tiredness. Sounds like the viral syndrome that every healthy kid gets several times a year. That rash on your child’s leg may look just like a viral xanthem when you bring them to see me in the ER. We give him acetaminophen in the ER, tell you to alternate with ibuprofen, push fluids, watch him closely, and bring him back if anything gets worse. The acetaminophen brings the fever down and you put him to bed. The next morning you go to wake him up and notice he is burning hot, his legs are all splotchy, and he doesn’t want to wake up. You rush him back to my ER where he is diagnosed with Meningiococcmia, started on intravenous antibiotics, put on a ventilator, and admitted to the ICU. If we are lucky your child will survive, although he will likely lose his legs.
Meningitis is an infection or inflammation of the lining around the brain and spinal cord. It can be caused by many different viruses or bacteria. Bacterial meningitis commonly has a much worse outcome in terms of death and long term disability than viral meningitis. Until the development of meningococcal and pneumococcal vaccines the most common cause of meningitis were these bacteria. Meningitis can also start with flu-like symptoms of fever, nausea, body and headaches, and fatigue…looks very much like that viral syndrome that your child gets several times a year. Bacterial meningitis however, can quickly move from these benign symptoms to permanent brain damage or death in a matter of hours.
Here are some links to videos of Meningococcemia and Bacterial Meningitis:
youtube.com/watch?v=B0PkeJsAtfM (in spanish, but pictures in the first two minutes tell the story)
youtube.com/watch?v=URKtW21a9So
youtube.com/watch?v=amVq0EH3Nvs (the caption states this was viral meningitis, but I doubt it was due to the need for amputation).
pneumococcus (2 month) covers 13 of the worst serotypes of Streptococcus pneumoniae which are the second leading cause (next to Meningococcal) of bacterial meningitis. Strep pneumoniae is also a primary cause of ear infections and systemic blood infections. Some statistics say that, in developing countries, pneumococcus kills more kids than malaria, AIDS, and measles combined. Of course, as it’s name implies, it also is a primary cause of pneumonia.
Here’s what can happen to your child:
youtube.com/watch?v=0K9sz24Zn9k
Pertussis (2 months) Your kiddo comes home from school with a mild fever and a cough. This is going to happen a few times every school year, and you’re sure he will get better. If he’s vaccinated, he probably will. If he’s unvaccinated, you need to worry, because I certainly will in the emergency department because this may be whooping cough. No big deal if you bring him to see me because if I suspect it then I can treat it easily with an antibiotic. But the much bigger deal is your younger children, or your younger nieces and nephews who are not old enough to be immunized. Your unvaccinated child may have been carrying, and spreading, pertussis for as long as a MONTH before he started coughing. Now all of those unimmunized babies your child has been around may wind up in the pediatric ICU looking like this baby.
youtube.com/watch?v=S3oZrMGDMMw
I work in emergency medicine. I see lots of sick kids every shift. ALMOST EVERY TIME the sick kid just has a viral syndrome and simply needs alternating doses of acetaminophen (tylenol) and ibuprofen (motrin), more fluids, and close observation by mom and dad. If it’s not a viral syndrome, then it is probably strep throat or an ear infection and they get amoxicillin (although studies show that this is unnecessary, the kiddo will get better without the antibiotic). Rarely is it something more serious like appendicitis, but I always have to be on guard to find the more serious thing.
And then there are the un-vaccinated kids. These kids scare the HELL out of me because I have rarely, if ever, seen some of the diseases THAT THIS KID SHOULDN’T EVEN BE AT RISK FOR GETTING. I’ve never seen Diphtheria, Tetanus, Polio, or even mumps. Now this mild rash on the kids leg, which is almost assuredly just a viral xanthem (a viral “cold” in the skin) just might be a meningiococcal rash which means this kid could be dead in a few hours if I don’t diagnose it immediately and start intravenous antibiotics. That cough that the 4 month old has had for 3 days might not be his first case of viral bronchitis, it may be pertussis that can have him cough so much he gets hypoxic brain damage.
Here is a list of childhood vaccines that are recommended by the Centers for Disease Control. Next to the vaccine is the recommended age for first vaccination (most require multiple innoculations for best immunity). Then I describe to you what this MOSTLY PREVENTABLE disease can do to your child or to others.
meningiococcal (6 weeks): This prevents a bacteria that wants to cause two different, but related diseases in your child: Meningococcemia and Meningitis.
Meningococcemia is a bacterial infection of the blood. It often starts with flu-like symptoms. A fever, nausea, body aches, headache, and tiredness. Sounds like the viral syndrome that every healthy kid gets several times a year. That rash on your child’s leg may look just like a viral xanthem when you bring them to see me in the ER. We give him acetaminophen in the ER, tell you to alternate with ibuprofen, push fluids, watch him closely, and bring him back if anything gets worse. The acetaminophen brings the fever down and you put him to bed. The next morning you go to wake him up and notice he is burning hot, his legs are all splotchy, and he doesn’t want to wake up. You rush him back to my ER where he is diagnosed with Meningiococcmia, started on intravenous antibiotics, put on a ventilator, and admitted to the ICU. If we are lucky your child will survive, although he will likely lose his legs.
Meningitis is an infection or inflammation of the lining around the brain and spinal cord. It can be caused by many different viruses or bacteria. Bacterial meningitis commonly has a much worse outcome in terms of death and long term disability than viral meningitis. Until the development of meningococcal and pneumococcal vaccines the most common cause of meningitis were these bacteria. Meningitis can also start with flu-like symptoms of fever, nausea, body and headaches, and fatigue…looks very much like that viral syndrome that your child gets several times a year. Bacterial meningitis however, can quickly move from these benign symptoms to permanent brain damage or death in a matter of hours.
Here are some links to videos of Meningococcemia and Bacterial Meningitis:
youtube.com/watch?v=B0PkeJsAtfM (in spanish, but pictures in the first two minutes tell the story)
youtube.com/watch?v=URKtW21a9So
youtube.com/watch?v=amVq0EH3Nvs (the caption states this was viral meningitis, but I doubt it was due to the need for amputation).
pneumococcus (2 month) covers 13 of the worst serotypes of Streptococcus pneumoniae which are the second leading cause (next to Meningococcal) of bacterial meningitis. Strep pneumoniae is also a primary cause of ear infections and systemic blood infections. Some statistics say that, in developing countries, pneumococcus kills more kids than malaria, AIDS, and measles combined. Of course, as it’s name implies, it also is a primary cause of pneumonia.
Here’s what can happen to your child:
youtube.com/watch?v=0K9sz24Zn9k
Pertussis (2 months) Your kiddo comes home from school with a mild fever and a cough. This is going to happen a few times every school year, and you’re sure he will get better. If he’s vaccinated, he probably will. If he’s unvaccinated, you need to worry, because I certainly will in the emergency department because this may be whooping cough. No big deal if you bring him to see me because if I suspect it then I can treat it easily with an antibiotic. But the much bigger deal is your younger children, or your younger nieces and nephews who are not old enough to be immunized. Your unvaccinated child may have been carrying, and spreading, pertussis for as long as a MONTH before he started coughing. Now all of those unimmunized babies your child has been around may wind up in the pediatric ICU looking like this baby.
youtube.com/watch?v=S3oZrMGDMMw
B
Boatswain2PA
Guest
Haemophilus Influenza B (2 months). Or that mild fever and cough could progress into something else, like epiglotittis. This is an inflammation of the epiglottis, which is the flap that covers your windpipe when you swallow so that food doesn’t go down it. What happens when your epiglottis gets inflammed? It covers that windpipe and you can’t breathe. This can happen very quickly and is an absolute emergency.
youtube.com/watch?v=R9puIKVON-s
What happens when your child can’t breathe due to epiglottitis closing off his windpipe and you bring him to my ER? I have to cut a hole in his throat so he breathe through it. Here is a video of that procedure, although this is done in the operating room. If I have to do it in the emergency department it is a lot faster, messier, and bloodier.
Imagine watching me do this to your child in the emergency room: youtube.com/watch?v=6_0bH6KxPYA
By the way, I’ve never done one of these in the ER. If you don’t get your child immunized with the HIB vaccine, your child may be the first one I do.
Diphtheria (2 months): Fever, chills, fatigue, cough, headache…sounds like the viral syndrome again doesn’t it? And it probably is, but if your child isn’t vaccinated it could be diphtheria. Your child’s lymph nodes in their neck may swell up so much that I have to put a tube down their throat so they can breathe. If I can’t get the tube down their throat, I may have to again cut a hole in your child’s throat so they can breathe. Diphtheria is fatal in upwards of 10% of cases, and possibly as high as 20% in the very young or elderly.
Polio (2 months): The poliovirus wants to attack the nerves that control your child’s muscles. Polio is almost wiped out from the planet due to the vaccines…but we could have said the same thing about Diphtheria 15 years ago before it’s resurgence. I’ve never seen a single case of it, so I’m sure I will miss it the first time I do see it.
Hep B (birth) - Very infective. Causes hepatitis which can lead to permanent liver damage, and sometimes death.
Hep A (1 year) - Similar to Hep B.
Rotavirus (2 month) - Very infective horrible diarrhea that can lead to severe dehydration and hospitalization. In America this has a very low death rate, but very uncomfortable for the child and parents.
tetanus (2 month) - If your child gets tetanus their muscles can cramp up so much that they break their own bones. Yes, your child can cramp up so much that they break their own bones. We can prevent that with tetanus vaccine.
Measles (1 year) - Fever, fatigue, body aches, and a rash everywhere. While not typically a fatal disease, it often progresses to a serious pneumonia that can require hospitalization.
mumps(1 year) Fever, fatigue for few days. Swelling in the throat. Usually goes away without any big deal. Unless you are a male who is past puberty, then you are at risk for inflammation of your testicles which can lead to infertility. Women too can have inflammation of her ovaries and infertility issues. And then there is the nearly 30% chance of spontaneous miscarriage if a pregnant woman contracts mumps.
rubella(1 year) Not commonly a significant disease for your child. But if your child gives it to a pregnant woman then the pre-born child is at high risk for congenital rubella syndrome (CRS). This results in a miscarriage approximately 20% of the time. The surviving babies have significant risk of being born with a wide range of deformities including mental retardation, deafness, cataracts, retina problems, congenital heart problems, small head, etc etc, etc.
This is what rubella vaccine prevents: youtube.com/watch?v=v_aQVcaQ_OU
Varicella(1 year) Yeah, I know, it’s only chickenpox. You probably had chickenpox when you were a child and you don’t think it’s a big deal. It usually isn’t. It can RARELY cause swelling around the brain, but that’s very rare. However the bigger consequence of chickenpox happens 30-60 years AFTER they go away because, you see, the virus never really goes away. It just hides in a nerve root for decades until it comes back as shingles which is an incredibly painful rash. I’ve had to put people into the hospital before just to control their pain.
HPV (11 year) prevents most of the papilloma viruses that cause the most aggressive forms of cervical cancer. While cervical cancer can be detected early by annual pap smears, these pap smears on detect the cancer, they don’t prevent or treat it. Furthermore many young woman do not get the pap smears, and don’t go to the doctor until they have symptoms. But in that respect cervical cancer is like colon cancer; once you have symptoms, you probably have very advanced disease.
Now you know the risks of NOT getting the vaccines. While there is some small risk from getting vaccines (injection site discomfort, guillain-barre, anaphylaxis, etc), these risk are miniscule compared to the risks of preventable diseaes
youtube.com/watch?v=R9puIKVON-s
What happens when your child can’t breathe due to epiglottitis closing off his windpipe and you bring him to my ER? I have to cut a hole in his throat so he breathe through it. Here is a video of that procedure, although this is done in the operating room. If I have to do it in the emergency department it is a lot faster, messier, and bloodier.
Imagine watching me do this to your child in the emergency room: youtube.com/watch?v=6_0bH6KxPYA
By the way, I’ve never done one of these in the ER. If you don’t get your child immunized with the HIB vaccine, your child may be the first one I do.
Diphtheria (2 months): Fever, chills, fatigue, cough, headache…sounds like the viral syndrome again doesn’t it? And it probably is, but if your child isn’t vaccinated it could be diphtheria. Your child’s lymph nodes in their neck may swell up so much that I have to put a tube down their throat so they can breathe. If I can’t get the tube down their throat, I may have to again cut a hole in your child’s throat so they can breathe. Diphtheria is fatal in upwards of 10% of cases, and possibly as high as 20% in the very young or elderly.
Polio (2 months): The poliovirus wants to attack the nerves that control your child’s muscles. Polio is almost wiped out from the planet due to the vaccines…but we could have said the same thing about Diphtheria 15 years ago before it’s resurgence. I’ve never seen a single case of it, so I’m sure I will miss it the first time I do see it.
Hep B (birth) - Very infective. Causes hepatitis which can lead to permanent liver damage, and sometimes death.
Hep A (1 year) - Similar to Hep B.
Rotavirus (2 month) - Very infective horrible diarrhea that can lead to severe dehydration and hospitalization. In America this has a very low death rate, but very uncomfortable for the child and parents.
tetanus (2 month) - If your child gets tetanus their muscles can cramp up so much that they break their own bones. Yes, your child can cramp up so much that they break their own bones. We can prevent that with tetanus vaccine.
Measles (1 year) - Fever, fatigue, body aches, and a rash everywhere. While not typically a fatal disease, it often progresses to a serious pneumonia that can require hospitalization.
mumps(1 year) Fever, fatigue for few days. Swelling in the throat. Usually goes away without any big deal. Unless you are a male who is past puberty, then you are at risk for inflammation of your testicles which can lead to infertility. Women too can have inflammation of her ovaries and infertility issues. And then there is the nearly 30% chance of spontaneous miscarriage if a pregnant woman contracts mumps.
rubella(1 year) Not commonly a significant disease for your child. But if your child gives it to a pregnant woman then the pre-born child is at high risk for congenital rubella syndrome (CRS). This results in a miscarriage approximately 20% of the time. The surviving babies have significant risk of being born with a wide range of deformities including mental retardation, deafness, cataracts, retina problems, congenital heart problems, small head, etc etc, etc.
This is what rubella vaccine prevents: youtube.com/watch?v=v_aQVcaQ_OU
Varicella(1 year) Yeah, I know, it’s only chickenpox. You probably had chickenpox when you were a child and you don’t think it’s a big deal. It usually isn’t. It can RARELY cause swelling around the brain, but that’s very rare. However the bigger consequence of chickenpox happens 30-60 years AFTER they go away because, you see, the virus never really goes away. It just hides in a nerve root for decades until it comes back as shingles which is an incredibly painful rash. I’ve had to put people into the hospital before just to control their pain.
HPV (11 year) prevents most of the papilloma viruses that cause the most aggressive forms of cervical cancer. While cervical cancer can be detected early by annual pap smears, these pap smears on detect the cancer, they don’t prevent or treat it. Furthermore many young woman do not get the pap smears, and don’t go to the doctor until they have symptoms. But in that respect cervical cancer is like colon cancer; once you have symptoms, you probably have very advanced disease.
Now you know the risks of NOT getting the vaccines. While there is some small risk from getting vaccines (injection site discomfort, guillain-barre, anaphylaxis, etc), these risk are miniscule compared to the risks of preventable diseaes
P
pnewton
Guest
Instead of looking here for what people say the Church says, the OP should click on the links given and read what is available. This issue has already been looked at by Catholic theologians and medical professionals a the NCBC. This is where Church authorities go to keep them up to date and informed.
If you note, the only one who denied that this is the Church’s position also expressed belief that vaccination is dangerous. No, the Church has always understood our need to do what we can for the good of society.
If you note, the only one who denied that this is the Church’s position also expressed belief that vaccination is dangerous. No, the Church has always understood our need to do what we can for the good of society.
R
Rosebud77
Guest
Accusing parents of child abuse like this is appalling. We make choices, and home schooling is grand, NB your last sentence makes no sense. Choice is not ignorance.There is no relationship between vaccines and autism. Numerous studies have shown this. Not vaccinating ones children IMO is tantamount to child abuse. It is a parents right to not do so but they should not be surprised when the schools refuse to put other children at risk because of their ignorance
B
Boatswain2PA
Guest
His last sentence made perfect sense. If a parent chooses not to vaccinate their children, they are choosing to RISK many things.Accusing parents of child abuse like this is appalling. We make choices, and home schooling is grand, NB your last sentence makes no sense. Choice is not ignorance.
Not vaccinating your child puts them at the risk of not being allowed in school, because the school doesn’t want to risk your child infecting others (who may not be able to get vaccinated).
Not vaccinating your child puts them at greater risk of many terrible, life-threatening diseases. See my previous post.
Not vaccinating your child means that when you bring your 6 month old to me in the ED for their fever, I’m going to stick a big needle in their back to rule out meningitis.
C
Colorad007
Guest
No, it isn’t that simple. There also must be a sufficiently grave health threat to weigh, and even if you do use them the Vatican document says that one should nevertheless make a concerted effort to lobby governments and companies to produce vaccines ethically. I can’t see, for example, the Chicken Pox vaccine being ethical, because Chicken Pox isn’t going to seriously harm or kill the vast majority of people who happen to get it. It stinks to have it–but most of us have, and we survived, easily.Its complicated for sure. From my reading the Church says you can use the vaccine if no other versions are available
In other words, it definitely isn’t a matter of shrugging it off if there isn’t another alternative. If that is what one is doing, they are really doing it wrong.
C
Colorad007
Guest
Why do you keep talking about meningitis? All meningitis vaccine are ethically produced. The discussion is about vaccines from lines derived from aborted fetal cells, and meningitis is among them.His last sentence made perfect sense. If a parent chooses not to vaccinate their children, they are choosing to RISK many things.
Not vaccinating your child puts them at the risk of not being allowed in school, because the school doesn’t want to risk your child infecting others (who may not be able to get vaccinated).
Not vaccinating your child puts them at greater risk of many terrible, life-threatening diseases. See my previous post.
Not vaccinating your child means that when you bring your 6 month old to me in the ED for their fever, I’m going to stick a big needle in their back to rule out meningitis.
Moreover, some vaccines (flu, for example) are wholly unnecessary, regardless of where they come from. We over-vaccinate and over-medicate in many ways, and that isn’t something anyone should take lightly. So the “risk” you mention is often enough media-contrived hoopla detached from reality. I am not anti-vaccine, although I am definitely against using the vaccines produced unethically. But I wouldn’t be so quick to jump on parents who choose not to vaccinate.
C
Colorad007
Guest
Actually, no, the Church has never said that. It far more complex than that.There is no relation between autism and vaccination. The Church has stated that it is morally permissible to have children vaccinated.
B
Boatswain2PA
Guest
Because (bacterial) meningitis is an absolutely terrifying, horrible disease which is 95% preventable with vaccines.Why do you keep talking about meningitis? All meningitis vaccine are ethically produced. The discussion is about vaccines from lines derived from aborted fetal cells, and meningitis is among them.
Moreover, some vaccines (flu, for example) are wholly unnecessary, regardless of where they come from. We over-vaccinate and over-medicate in many ways, and that isn’t something anyone should take lightly. So the “risk” you mention is often enough media-contrived hoopla detached from reality. I am not anti-vaccine, although I am definitely against using the vaccines produced unethically. But I wouldn’t be so quick to jump on parents who choose not to vaccinate.
I am not “jumping on parents”. I am giving them accurate information about the risks involved with vaccinating, or not vaccinating, their children.
The “risk” of preventable diseases is not "detached from reality. It is science. Not “global warming is going to kill us all so nobody drive your car” science, but actual science.
O
on_the_hill
Guest
I think you’re mixing things up a bit. The Vatican is concerned with vaccines derived from cells from an aborted fetus 40-some years ago. The Vatican’s standpoint about sufficiently grave health threats is connected to those particular vaccines.No, it isn’t that simple. There also must be a sufficiently grave health threat to weigh, and even if you do use them the Vatican document says that one should nevertheless make a concerted effort to lobby governments and companies to produce vaccines ethically. I can’t see, for example, the Chicken Pox vaccine being ethical, because Chicken Pox isn’t going to seriously harm or kill the vast majority of people who happen to get it. It stinks to have it–but most of us have, and we survived, easily.
In other words, it definitely isn’t a matter of shrugging it off if there isn’t another alternative. If that is what one is doing, they are really doing it wrong.
It is not about grave health threats in general. You don’t need to wait until you are suffering from a grave health threat before you can morally seek medical care. Your statement seems to indicate that the Vatican wants us to get really sick before we seek help, and that’s not the case at all.
Furthermore, is the Chicken Pox vaccine derived from cells derived from aborted fetus tissue?
I’ll believe real science. In fact, I trust it with my life. I categorically do not trust information from conspiracy websites that purport to know the truth as it flies in the face of millions of doctors and scientists around the world. I also don’t believe that the moon is made of green cheese.
O
on_the_hill
Guest
That’s a reckless statement. Would it have been wholly unnecessary to immunize people during the Spanish Flu epidemic in 1918?Moreover, some vaccines (flu, for example) are wholly unnecessary,
P
pnewton
Guest
From the NCBC
ncbcenter.org/page.aspx?pid=1284#assocAbort
What do I do if there is no alternative to a vaccine produced from these cell lines?
Do not trust such people with telling you what the Church teaches. Look it up.
ncbcenter.org/page.aspx?pid=1284#assocAbort
What do I do if there is no alternative to a vaccine produced from these cell lines?
No one is shrugging anything off. What is “wrong” is trying to throw moral obligations at others where the Church has granted moral permissiveness. I think the correlation between those that see a moral dilemma with vaccines and those that are generally opposed to vaccines because of some conspiracy theory, amateur medical belief of a general sense of “not my child”, should let us all be suspect of their claim as to what the Church teaches.One is morally free to use the vaccine regardless of its historical association with abortion. The reason is that the risk to public health, if one chooses not to vaccinate, outweighs the legitimate concern about the origins of the vaccine. This is especially important for parents, who have a moral obligation to protect the life and health of their children and those around them.
Do not trust such people with telling you what the Church teaches. Look it up.
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