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Cyber_Knight
Guest
Correct Vickie, sorry if sound harsh at least the phrase would be like : You give them food, they give you sh!t on your face as a thanks.
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Pjs2ejs
Guest
The problem is Italy’s law allowing religion to be taught to children in public schools an hour a week.
When you have a rule like this, you can’t deny certain groups when you have a democracy.
So is it fair that Christian students have an hour from the public school to learn Christianity?
I don’t agree with Islam. So for crying out loud, don’t enable them by having a lame law like the one they do. Shame on Italy’s “democracy”!!!
When you have a rule like this, you can’t deny certain groups when you have a democracy.
So is it fair that Christian students have an hour from the public school to learn Christianity?
I don’t agree with Islam. So for crying out loud, don’t enable them by having a lame law like the one they do. Shame on Italy’s “democracy”!!!
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Mike_D30
Guest
Italy is not a full blown Democracy and the it’s the cradle of Catholicism, I say what’s good for the goose for the gander. Why appease Muslims while missionaries are beheaded in Muslim lands?
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Giovanni
Guest
Odd, since a couple of years back, a muslim oraganization in Italy had sued, wanting to remove all Crucifixes from italian schools, because muslim children would feel out of place, now this.
I don’t know what to think sometimes, is there any logic in anything that has to do with islam?
Pray!
I don’t know what to think sometimes, is there any logic in anything that has to do with islam?
Pray!
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inJESUS
Guest
and they are a very small minority…a rude minority i guess…just imagine when they increase…
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freedomm
Guest
You mean you want present day secular West to abondone her secularism and embrace once again the Christian Fundamentalism thus go back in her Dark Ages, again?
Do you know how hard it was to get rid of the *Dark Ages * through the Renaissance? The Renaissance whose foundations actually laid down by the Arab/Muslim scientists/intellectuals.
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freedomm
Guest
Whoever is comparing Italy with the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia is making a false comparision.
The whole 100% population of Saudi Arabia is Muslim thus it make no sense to teach them other religions.
When you say Saudis must be taught Christianity, then question arises, why not Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, Mormonism, Protestantism of Martin Luther, Seventh Day Adventism, Bhagwan Rajnish-ism, David Koresh-ism, as well? Why just Catholicism?
As far knowing Christianity is concerned, Muslims have been keep knowing it for centuries, whereas Western Europe in her Dark Ages busy in defaming Islam and kept her people in dark about the truth of Islam. It is only in Christianity-free secular West, that people were allowed to know Islam if they want to but still all the propaganda machines in the West were and are busy in defaming Islam as much as possible to create an animosity towards Islam/Muslims and Islamophobia.
The whole 100% population of Saudi Arabia is Muslim thus it make no sense to teach them other religions.
When you say Saudis must be taught Christianity, then question arises, why not Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, Mormonism, Protestantism of Martin Luther, Seventh Day Adventism, Bhagwan Rajnish-ism, David Koresh-ism, as well? Why just Catholicism?
As far knowing Christianity is concerned, Muslims have been keep knowing it for centuries, whereas Western Europe in her Dark Ages busy in defaming Islam and kept her people in dark about the truth of Islam. It is only in Christianity-free secular West, that people were allowed to know Islam if they want to but still all the propaganda machines in the West were and are busy in defaming Islam as much as possible to create an animosity towards Islam/Muslims and Islamophobia.
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cestusdei
Guest
False. Islam only had ancient scholarship because of the Greek’s they conquered and enslaved. Without the Byzantines you would have continued to be as backward as you have become now. I suggest the book “Those Terrible Middle Ages”. It devastes the pc view.
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freedomm
Guest
Prince Charles, Heir to the British Monarchy in a recent public speech at Oxford University stated:
**“If there is much misunderstanding in the West about the nature of Islam, there is also much ignorance about the debt our own culture and civilisation owe to the Islamic world. It is a failure, which stems, I think, from the straight-jacket of history, which we have inherited. The medieval Islamic world, from central Asia to the shores of the Atlantic, was a world where scholars and men of learning flourished. But because we have tended to see Islam as the enemy of the West, as an alien culture, society, and system of belief, we have tended to ignore or erase its great relevance to our own history.” **
muslimheritage.com/
muslimheritage.com/about/default.cfm
muslimheritage.com/topics/default.cfm?ArticleID=3 41
**“If there is much misunderstanding in the West about the nature of Islam, there is also much ignorance about the debt our own culture and civilisation owe to the Islamic world. It is a failure, which stems, I think, from the straight-jacket of history, which we have inherited. The medieval Islamic world, from central Asia to the shores of the Atlantic, was a world where scholars and men of learning flourished. But because we have tended to see Islam as the enemy of the West, as an alien culture, society, and system of belief, we have tended to ignore or erase its great relevance to our own history.” **
muslimheritage.com/
muslimheritage.com/about/default.cfm
muslimheritage.com/topics/default.cfm?ArticleID=3 41
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freedomm
Guest
George Sarton, a Professor in the history of science at Harvard University, stated in his book The Life of Science that:
**The foundations of science were laid for us by the Mesopotamian civilization (present day Iraq) whose scholars and scientists were their priests.
The second development in science came through the Greeks.
The third stage of development, however, is to be credited to the meteoric rise of Islam.
For nearly four hundred years Islam led the scientific world as, from Spain to India the great body of past knowledge was exchanged between Muslim scholars and carried forward with new discoveries and new ideas. Scholars in Christendom, from about the eleventh century, were mainly occupied for over two hundred years in translating from Arabic into Latin.
Thus Islam paved the way for the European Renaissance, which in turn led to science’s fourth great development in the modem world. **
(Sarton. 1971, pp. 146-166)
**The foundations of science were laid for us by the Mesopotamian civilization (present day Iraq) whose scholars and scientists were their priests.
The second development in science came through the Greeks.
The third stage of development, however, is to be credited to the meteoric rise of Islam.
For nearly four hundred years Islam led the scientific world as, from Spain to India the great body of past knowledge was exchanged between Muslim scholars and carried forward with new discoveries and new ideas. Scholars in Christendom, from about the eleventh century, were mainly occupied for over two hundred years in translating from Arabic into Latin.
Thus Islam paved the way for the European Renaissance, which in turn led to science’s fourth great development in the modem world. **
(Sarton. 1971, pp. 146-166)
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cestusdei
Guest
Is this the same Prince Charles who told Camilla that he wanted to be reincarnated as her tampon? Yes, a brilliant guy indeed. And I am an American. We kicked out the British monarchy long ago. I am singularly unimpressed.
I suggest the book How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization by Thomas Woods.
I suggest the book How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization by Thomas Woods.
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freedomm
Guest
But that does not mean that each and every other comment/statement of any person is right unless if it is backed up by undeniable evidence.
And the undeniable evidence and unbias scholarship proves the statement made by Prince Charles about Islam in his recent public speech at Oxford University.
Are you saying that even your Holy “infallible” Papacy who is “under direct guidance” of Holy Ghost, makes no mistakes?
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freedomm
Guest
How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization ? very interesting topic. I wish Martin Luther was alive today and you would have suggest him this book.
And also, I wish you were present in Hitler’s period and suggest this book, before he bagan “taking” care of millions of innocent Jews and others of his own Christian civilized country.
And before that I wish you were born in Papacy’s Dark ages and suggest your book to her, when she was on her “holy” compaign to make the life of innocent Jews, miserable. Had she read your book, she would not have to aplogise and amend partially her stance towards the Jews after 1500 years.
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cestusdei
Guest
I do deny it. And Hitler was in fact more a pagan then anything else. But I do read articles where Muslims laud Hitler for killing the Jews and are saddened they he didn’t get all of them. He is a hero in the Arab world.
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freedomm
Guest
LOL.
How do you know Hitler was more a pagan? Did he tell you personally?
The “articles” that you claimed have read can be written by anyone and then falsely attribute them to the Muslims.
It is amazing that Muslims in general are not aware of such articles written by their own Muslim brothers but you somehow know these very well more than what Islam stands for and what actually Muslims believe religiously.
It proves what? It only proves that ignorant people and people like you can very easily be deceived by such deceptive articles/items that are floating on the Net because ignorant people/people like you are already determined not to accept anything good about Islam/Muslims and people like you are indoctrinated so deeply in thier preconceived ideas that they cannot see the ‘beam’ in their own eyes.
By “Arab world”, you probably meant, Arab Christians’ World. Because there are millions of Christians in the Arab world.
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onesimplemind
Guest
So what does Islam stand for?
Is it Jihad against those that hinder Islam? I am not converting or submitting to Islam, does that mean I am hindering Islam, does that mean I am the target of Jihad. Does that mean anyone who doesn’t submit to Islam is the target of Jihad? It sure seems like it.
Is it to endlessly complain about the crusaders mounting a counter campaign to the Islamic invasion of Europe. I bet it hurts many muslims that the height of Islamic power was time spent on recapturing land LIBERATED by the crusaders. Instead of marching on Paris they were busy trying to recapture Jerusalem.
Is it to endlessly complain about a Jewish state existing in the Middle East. I hate to say it but if Muslims can conquer, so can anyone else. The British defeated the Ottomons, the British did what they pleased with the lands they captured, and now you have Isreal, live with it.
I would very much like to know what Islam stands for to prove my views unfounded.
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murtad
Guest
Cyber Knight:
Do I believe that Reuters article published by MSNBC? Of course not as that article is not endorsed by His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI who is a conservative and would not say any such thing.
The Pope is a man of few words and hardly speaks much. He is like the Apostle Paul, the apostle to the Gentiles who spoke little and always when he spoke maintained love for both neighbours and enemies alike. If you find any MSNBC or Reuters newswire quoting the Pope, verify those words allergedly by him with the Bible or CCC and if you find his words contradict the Bible or CCC, you know the Pope did not speak them.
The Pope did not speak those words MSNBC and Reuters claimed he spoke. I think this is yet another attempt by Satan to trick gullible members of the Catholic Church into supporting the Anti-Christ, Islamism invasion of Italy.
The original poster quoted an article from MSNBC that allerges the Pope backed teaching Islamism in public schools in Christian-majority nation, Italy. Before you take MSNBC seriously, remember that it is a Microsoft mouthpiece, and last I heart Bill Gates was the Anti-Christ as he has invested millions of dollars in the Islamist nations (especially Saudi Arabia) that persecute Christians. Bill and Microsoft want U.S. to lift sanctions against Iran, so he can invest in that nation helping them to further use this money to oppress Christians and non-Muslims in general.
Do I believe that Reuters article published by MSNBC? Of course not as that article is not endorsed by His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI who is a conservative and would not say any such thing.
The Pope is a man of few words and hardly speaks much. He is like the Apostle Paul, the apostle to the Gentiles who spoke little and always when he spoke maintained love for both neighbours and enemies alike. If you find any MSNBC or Reuters newswire quoting the Pope, verify those words allergedly by him with the Bible or CCC and if you find his words contradict the Bible or CCC, you know the Pope did not speak them.
The Pope did not speak those words MSNBC and Reuters claimed he spoke. I think this is yet another attempt by Satan to trick gullible members of the Catholic Church into supporting the Anti-Christ, Islamism invasion of Italy.
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freedomm
Guest
Thanks for you interest in knowing Islam. It is better to know it before commenting on it so that even if you don’t embrace it, you can atleast comment on as a knowledgeable person.
I recommend these books (available on line):
Towards Understanding Islam
by Sayyid Abul A’la Maududi
Table of Contents
I. THE MEANING OF ISLAM
Islam: What does it mean?
The Nature of Kufr
The Blessings of Islam.
II. FAITH AND OBDIENCE
Faith: what does it mean?
How to acquire the Knowledge of God?
Faith in the Unknown.
III. THE PROPHETHOOD
Prophethood: Its Nature and Necessity
Brief History of Prophethood The Prophethood of Muhammad
Muhammad’s Prophethood A Rational Vindication
ARABIA - the Abyss of Darkness
The Saviour is Born
Diamond in a Heap of Stones
A Revolution Comes
Why all that Enmity?
A Changed Man at Forty-Why?
His All-embracing Message
His Contribution to Human Thought
The Greatest Revolutionary
The Final Testimony
The Finality of Prophethood
IV. THE ARTICLES OF FAITH
Tawheed: Faith in the Unity of Allah The Meaning of the ‘Kalima’
The Effects of Tawheed on Human Life
Faith in Prophets
Belief in Life after Death The Need of this Belief
Life After Death : A Rational Vindication
V. PRAYER AND WORSHIP
The Spirit of “Ibadat” or Worship salat
Fasting
Zakat
Hajj or Pilgrimage
Defence of Islam
Jihad
VI. DIN AND SHARI’AH
Distinction Between Din and Shari’ah
The Sources of the Shari’ah
Fiqh
Tasawwuf
VII. THE PRINCIPLES OF THE SHARI’AH
The Shari’ah Its Nature and Purport
The Shari’ah Rights and Obligations
The Rights of God
The Rights of the Self
The Rights of other Man
The Rights of all Creatures
Shari’ah The Universal and Eternal Law
witness-pioneer.org/vil/Books/M_tui/index.html
witness-pioneer.org
For Muslim heritage, you can surf this site:
muslimheritage.com/about/default.cfm
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onesimplemind
Guest
How about I know it now from you. I can read all you want me to read but that is not going to change the fact of what I see and what history teaches. It isn’t hard to type a few lines that can dispel my point of view right?
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onesimplemind
Guest
It should add:
The Rights of Women
The Rights of non-Muslims
The Rights of those that want to stay non-Muslim
The Rights of those who aren’t People of The Book who wish to stay non-Muslim
The Rights of Private Citizens in other countries who express their views
The Rights of People around the World who criticize Islam.
That would be a great read.
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