Vatican, Vietnam sacrifice a holy man

[Ecoclimber]

. After all, in negotiating the Lateran Pacts of 1929 with Fascist Italy he had to sacrifice the Catholic Popular Party and in negotiating the 1933 Reichskoncordat with Nazi Germany which gave legal redress by the Church in case of Nazi persecution of the Church, he had to sacrifice the Catholic Central Party.

Unfortunately, there is a saying: **“History not learned, is often repeated.” **

The concordant signed by the Pope had the opposite effect and a propaganda win for the Nazis. The Nazis very soon began every article in the concordant by arresting Catholic priests, nuns and sending them off to concentration camps, shutting down presses, disbanding and eliminating all Catholic organizations, unions and groups.
catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?id=2857

Catholic priests who incorporated the tenets of liberation theology and supported the revolutionaries of Marxist ideology throughout the Americas’ were themselves executed. Churches were closed, and the faithful persecuted.

Appeasing evil, only perpetuates evil

Whether this article is accurate or not, from a historical perspective, making deals with the devil has never worked.

Unfortunately, this thread seems to have denigrated to personal attacks rather then focusing on the topic at hand.

 

[catharina]

Unfortunately, there is a saying: **“History not learned, is often repeated.” **

The concordant signed by the Pope had the opposite effect and a propaganda win for the Nazis. The Nazis very soon began every article in the concordant by arresting Catholic priests, nuns and sending them off to concentration camps, shutting down presses, disbanding and eliminating all Catholic organizations, unions and groups.
catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?id=2857

Catholic priests who incorporated the tenets of liberation theology and supported the revolutionaries of Marxist ideology throughout the Americas’ were themselves executed. Churches were closed, and the faithful persecuted.

Appeasing evil, only perpetuates evil

Whether this article is accurate or not, from a historical perspective, making deals with the devil has never worked.

Unfortunately, this thread seems to have denigrated to personal attacks rather then focusing on the topic at hand.

The topic at hand is one report of "possibilities’ from the secular media.

Since there is still no substance proved,
any pointed attack on “the Church”
in regard to this story is very premature.

 

[Ecoclimber]

The topic at hand is one report of "possibilities’ from the secular media.

Since there is still no substance proved,
any pointed attack on “the Church”
in regard to this story is very premature.

 

[catharina]

Oh, give me a break! I wasn’t necessarily addressing my comments directly to the article …perhaps indirectly but my main purpose was to clarify statements in a previous post which gave the impression that by signing the concordant, the Pope spared the Catholic Church from persecution. What in fact happened was the opposite. A proproganda win for the Nazi and the church falling into persecutions. The Nazis very soon began breaking every article in the concordant by arresting Catholic priests, nuns and sending them off to concentration camps, shutting down presses, disbanding and eliminating all Catholic organizations, unions and groups.

The Information is all here in this article, if you wish to read it
catholicculture.org/cultu…ew.cfm?id=2857

Remember no :slapfight: on here!

That’s funny.
I thought you said:

“Whether this article is accurate or not, from a historical perspective, making deals with the devil has never worked.
Unfortunately, this thread seems to have denigrated to personal attacks rather then focusing on the topic at hand.”

You know, the thread’s topic? Accurate or not? Then spinnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn…

In fact, the thread’s topic: **Vatican, Vietnam sacrifice a holy man **
(Irrelevant to those who wish to ignore it, huh?)

[forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=2](http://forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=2)

"DISCUSSION FORUMS
1.  Messages posted to threads should be on-topic. 
     If you wish to discuss another topic, start a new thread."

 

[Lujack]

That’s funny.
I thought you said:

"Whether this article is accurate or not, from a historical perspective, making deals with the devil has never worked.
Unfortunately, this thread seems to have denigrated to personal attacks rather then focusing on the topic at hand."

You know, the thread’s topic? Accurate or not? Then spinnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn…

In fact, the thread’s topic: **Vatican, Vietnam sacrifice a holy man **
(Irrelevant to those who wish to ignore it, huh?)

Its perfectly on topic, since KC91 has tried to argue that even if the article was 100% accurate, its okay for the Vatican to make deals with tough dictatorships and sacrifice some principles. The two of us have disputed that.

 

[catharina]

Its perfectly on topic, since KC91 has tried to argue that even if the article was 100% accurate, its okay for the Vatican to make deals with tough dictatorships and sacrifice some principles. The two of us have disputed that.

This thread is devoted to ONE article about ONE Bishop in Vietnam.
The source of the article is the secular media. Nothing quotes the Vatican.
Any pretense that “the Vatican” is at fault is simply that: a pretense.
No matter how many posters move to tangents, there is still no basis in fact for doing so.

 

[Lujack]

This thread is devoted to ONE article about ONE Bishop in Vietnam.
The source of the article is the secular media. Nothing quotes the Vatican.
Any pretense that “the Vatican” is at fault is simply that: a pretense.
No matter how many posters move to tangents, there is still no basis in fact for doing so.

Threads often drift and go into alleys that are connected to the original topic in different ways than people anticipate. If the moderators feel this is off-topic, they’ll stop it.

 

[catharina]

Threads often drift and go into alleys that are connected to the original topic in different ways than people anticipate. If the moderators feel this is off-topic, they’ll stop it.

When the topic is set aside for a drift into Church bashing, I object to the drift.

 

[Lujack]

When the topic is set aside for a drift into Church bashing, I object to the drift.

How am I bashing the Church?

 

[Thomas_Casey]

It is very important that posters stick to the topic. Do not discuss each other, unless your name is in the article.

Thank You,

Thomas Casey
Moderator

 

[catharina]

It is very important that posters stick to the topic. Do not discuss each other, unless your name is in the article.

Thank You,

Thomas Casey
Moderator

Yes. The topic is clearly a secular media report that states it seems possible to
someone that perhaps the Vatican and Vietnam are colluding against a Bishop;
as I’ve said, as others have said, there is no verifiable truth presented to confirm that.

Rather, we can pray for this good Bishop who is retiring in ill health
and for the Catholic Church in Veitnam and its particular needs.