Virginity and marriage.

[AdamP88]

My last post in this thread, as there is little else to say. Having our sins loosed in Heaven is a wonderful thing, but there still may be consequences whilst we are attached to this mortal coil.

If I get drunk, hop in the car and kill someone in a crash, I can be forgiven if I repent of my ways and make a good confession. That is wonderful for my soul. But down here on Earth, someone is still dead, and their surviving loved ones may not be anxious to break bread with me. A porn star might turn away from that life and become a picture of what a practicing Catholic woman should be. I’m still not putting a ring on her finger. Others are free to do so if they wish.

That’s your choice. But if you get to know someone, grow to love them and then they tell you they “have a past”…my thinking would be that this revelation doesn’t change the person that they are now. I’m curious to know why you would reject someone who currently practices chastity because of this. I’m assuming that they have no STDs that could be passed on etc.
I can’t help thinking that an element of pride and immaturity plays a part in this often. Yeah, it’s ideal to be a virgin at the altar…but that doesn’t mean a virgin will automatically be a better spouse than a non-virgin.

 

[Maximilan_Kolbe]

That’s your choice. But if you get to know someone, grow to love them and then they tell you they “have a past”…my thinking would be that this revelation doesn’t change the person that they are now. I’m curious to know why you would reject someone who currently practices chastity because of this. I’m assuming that they have no STDs that could be passed on etc.
I can’t help thinking that an element of pride and immaturity plays a part in this often. Yeah, it’s ideal to be a virgin at the altar…but that doesn’t mean a virgin will automatically be a better spouse than a non-virgin.

I agree, but bear in mind, we can try to adjust what attracts us, but often, it may be futile in the time we have. Some people cannot get by looks, or weight, a chosen career, or something else. Do those really matter if the person has the proper “heart?” Likely not. But how much time should a person spend trying to “get beyond” something that may in the long run be inconsequential to the relationship, like physical attraction or a past relationship? Introspection is good, but people are often wired how they are.

I’d say time is better spent outside a relationship why certain things matter to us than doing so whilst in one. Otherwise, it comes off as “I really wanna love you, but…”

 

[pensmama87]

I agree, but bear in mind, we can try to adjust what attracts us, but often, it may be futile in the time we have. Some people cannot get by looks, or weight, a chosen career, or something else. Do those really matter if the person has the proper “heart?” Likely not. But how much time should a person spend trying to “get beyond” something that may in the long run be inconsequential to the relationship, like physical attraction or a past relationship? Introspection is good, but people are often wired how they are.

I’d say time is better spent outside a relationship why certain things matter to us than doing so whilst in one. Otherwise, it comes off as “I really wanna love you, but…”

But several of those things are immediately apparent in a way that virginity is not. I don’t know, I’m not the OP but I don’t even know how you could politely bring it up in conversation until the relationship is progressed to a certain point, at which point it’s unlikely to matter unless something really earth shattering is revealed.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

But several of those things are immediately apparent in a way that virginity is not. I don’t know, I’m not the OP but I don’t even know how you could politely bring it up in conversation until the relationship is progressed to a certain point, at which point it’s unlikely to matter unless something really earth shattering is revealed.

You’re telling me sexual history isn’t typical first date small talk???

 

[Rau]

I dare to ask this kind of questions here because it is a religious thread since elsewhere it will cause controversy over women’s rights and freedom but hopefully here it won’t because abstinence is preached around here.

Is it unreasonable for a guy who is above thirty and still a virgin to ask that his wife be that too and more importantly how can he approaches her with the topic, at which point in their relationship, at which date and most importantly how since normally his date will be above twenty-five and someone who holds that long should have some solid Christian background.
I ask about that because a person with psychological disorders will obsess over the fact that if she didn’t have problems having premarital sex in the past she could cheat on him and that will be the end of the relationship fully knowing that a girl who remained virgin until the marriage could stray too.

I am also very interested in girls and women (name removed by moderator)ut here.

Many good people would find that such a condition imposed by you renders you yourself a questionable marriage candidate, for it suggests a potential lack of understanding and capacity to forgive; an inability to see the good in a person.

 

[Rau]

If you love someone enough to want to marry them, it shouldn’t matter if they, or if you are a virgin or have had 100 previous partners, as long as you are honest and committed to each other from that point forward, that is what matters. Not their sexual past, or lack thereof.

I confess it would be difficult to know whether a person can be 100% committed if their history includes 100 partners, some of whom likely anticipated 100% commitment…

 

[Xantippe]

But several of those things are immediately apparent in a way that virginity is not. I don’t know, I’m not the OP but I don’t even know how you could politely bring it up in conversation until the relationship is progressed to a certain point, at which point it’s unlikely to matter unless something really earth shattering is revealed.

Right.

 

[ctb95]

I confess it would be difficult to know whether a person can be 100% committed if their history includes 100 partners, some of whom likely anticipated 100% commitment…

It would depend on the circumstances.

If someone had 100 sexual partners and eventually saw that they were wrong and repented (and perhaps converted/reverted to Catholicism), that’s one thing.

If someone has had many recent sexual partners and is continuously living a life of sin without any sign of repentance, that’s something completely different.

I feel like it would be pretty easy to tell those two situations apart.

 

[Rau]

It would depend on the circumstances.

If someone had 100 sexual partners and eventually saw that they were wrong and repented (and perhaps converted/reverted to Catholicism), that’s one thing.

If someone has had many recent sexual partners and is continuously living a life of sin without any sign of repentance, that’s something completely different.

I feel like it would be pretty easy to tell those two situations apart.

Perhaps. It is not always easy to say with certainty that the addict is truly reformed, no matter how genuine they seem (or are). It is not just sincerity of will that is a guide to future behaviour, but also strength of will. Both can be difficult to assess, but the latter especially so. What drives the person with a history of 100 partners MAY be akin to what drives the addict.

 

[AdamP88]

Perhaps. It is not always easy to say with certainty that the addict is truly reformed, no matter how genuine they seem (or are). It is not just sincerity of will that is a guide to future behaviour, but also strength of will. Both can be difficult to assess, but the latter especially so. What drives the person with a history of 100 partners MAY be akin to what drives the addict.

I assume that the OP is talking about any woman who had a sexual partner before marriage. 1 or 100.

 

[Rau]

I assume that the OP is talking about any woman who had a sexual partner before marriage. 1 or 100.

Sure. But my post that you quote was not directed to the OP. I did respond directly to the OP in a prior post.

 

[Xantippe]

I assume that the OP is talking about any woman who had a sexual partner before marriage. 1 or 100.

There’s a bit of a difference–qualitative as much as quantitative.

I agree with what Rau was saying about addiction–at some point it starts looking like certain behaviors are compulsive.

 

[AdamP88]

There’s a bit of a difference–qualitative as much as quantitative.

I agree with what Rau was saying about addiction–at some point it starts looking like certain behaviors are compulsive.

I agree with that. But I tend to think that when people say they “want to marry a virgin” they don’t have in mind a reformed prostitute, rather the woman who maybe fell once or twice and they believe they would be better to rule that person out.
Maybe I’m wrong but just my thoughts.

 

[Rau]

I agree with that. But I tend to think that when people say they “want to marry a virgin” they don’t have in mind a reformed prostitute, rather the woman who maybe fell once or twice and they believe they would be better to rule that person out.
Maybe I’m wrong but just my thoughts.

I don’t think anyone disputes that and I’m sure that was the meaning of the OP. It seems to me that ruling out the person who “maybe fell once or twice”, for no more than the fact that she fell once or twice, is somewhat arbitrary. Probably a few more adjectives would be applicable too. [Superior, snobbish, lacking in compassion or empathy, etc. come to mind.] Ruling out the person who can point to 100 prior partners is arguably arrived at based on a more prudent consideration.

 

[AdamP88]

I don’t think anyone disputes that and I’m sure that was the meaning of the OP. It seems to me that ruling out the person who “maybe fell once or twice”, for no more than the fact that she fell once or twice, is somewhat arbitrary. Probably a few more adjectives would be applicable too. [Superior, snobbish, lacking in compassion or empathy, etc. come to mind.] Ruling out the person who can point to 100 prior partners is arguably arrived at based on a more prudent consideration.

Yes. I totally agree.

 

[Lea101]

Just gonna chime in.

It’s okay to have standards. So for example, the ideal is that you want a virgin.

So you go to places to find her. You don’t really find a virgin wife at a club etc.

You meet someone who you click with. You don’t and shouldn’t ask about her sexual life in the beginning

Ok but then lets say that maybe you find out that she had sex with her previous 3 boyfriends, or if she was raped, or idk basically not a virgin.

You leave her because of that- that’s quite…judgmental of you. Obviously she would be better off with someone else. But you don’t look so great.

You don’t have to feel forced to date someone who isn’t a virgin. But if it is the only factor that makes her not what you want…you should evaluate yourself.

If she has a bunch of qualities, or you don’t seem to connect (even if she was a virgin) , nobody should judge you.

So basically what other posters are saying that someone’s virginity status should not be the dealbreaker if she is perfect in the other aspects you look for in a wife.

You wouldn’t feel great if someone didn’t want you because of a sin you have done in the past.

I guess many posters and I included, feel a bit uneasy because this way of thinking was kind of responsible for girls who aren’t virgins feeling like they are no longer pure, that they are damaged goods etc. Maybe it was not your intention, but yeah, kind of explains why not everyone agrees with you

 

[oldrover]

So basically what other posters are saying that someone’s virginity status should not be the dealbreaker if she is perfect in the other aspects you look for in a wife.

You wouldn’t feel great if someone didn’t want you because of a sin you have done in the past.

I guess many posters and I included, feel a bit uneasy because this way of thinking was kind of responsible for girls who aren’t virgins feeling like they are no longer pure, that they are damaged goods etc. Maybe it was not your intention, but yeah, kind of explains why not everyone agrees with you

Agree. And as for a girl with indiscretions in her past, if she has humbly and penitently confessed them to a priest and received absolution, then God has forgiven her, and we should too.

 

[Xantippe]

I agree with that. But I tend to think that when people say they “want to marry a virgin” they don’t have in mind a reformed prostitute, rather the woman who maybe fell once or twice and they believe they would be better to rule that person out.
Maybe I’m wrong but just my thoughts.

I think that’s right.

Also, it’s automatically ruling out either widows or victims of assault, which starts to make it look like the virginity preference is some sort of fetish-y thing rather than produced by an abstract love of chastity.

 

[JosephHope]

Thank you all for the extremely elaborate reply.

I didn’t write it in my first post but obviously widowed, divorced and sexually assaulted girls do not count, no one choose to be sexually assaulted, and I will add to that list porn stars and girls forced into prostitution, I was thinking about the more cool, “hot” girls that have no problem doing it and the “modern” ladies who consider having premarital sex is a right, it might be true in their perspective and on the opposite end, the same rule applies to men.

I really thought about why I want that, and it came to me that it is the very reason I started viewing nudity and later porn, what do girls have down there, what it looks like before and after, and will I regret it if I don’t find that answer because more than a decade of porn hasn’t brought me an answer.

 

[LightBound]

Thank you all for the extremely elaborate reply.

I didn’t write it in my first post but obviously widowed, divorced and sexually assaulted girls do not count, no one choose to be sexually assaulted, and I will add to that list porn stars and girls forced into prostitution, I was thinking about the more cool, “hot” girls that have no problem doing it and the “modern” ladies who consider having premarital sex is a right, it might be true in their perspective and on the opposite end, the same rule applies to men.

I really thought about why I want that, and it came to me that it is the very reason I started viewing nudity and later porn, what do girls have down there, what it looks like before and after, and will I regret it if I don’t find that answer because more than a decade of porn hasn’t brought me an answer.

Unless you are a physician with your bride up in stirrups, I’m not sure you are going to be able to get your answer. Besides, not all hymens look the same. Some are thicker than others, some only go half way around the diameter of the vaginal opening, and in many cases, they don’t exist…even on a women who has never had penetration. Sorry bud, this sounds like some serious fetish or trolling if I’m reading your post as wanting to see a hymenal vagina versus one without. I don’t know about anyone else’s sex life, but I don’t recall ever having my husband take a flash light and look at my pubic area…which is essentially what would be going on for you to see what a “before and after” look like. I can’t see this being a good idea on your wedding night!