Visual Aids & Homily Photos

[yinekka]

I found the link to these pictures on a Radical Traditional site and so thought that maybe the photos were a fake. sigh they weren’t.

I emailed the photographer and he replied ’ …
‘…Fr likes to use visual aids as part of his homily.’!! I wonder what he does at the Consecration and is the photographer busy taking photos while he does it.

It seems to me that in most churches the Mass today is like a Beethoven symphony played by a High School band.

francisandclare.org/imagegallery/html/page_two1.html

 

[Della]

yinekka:

I found the link to these pictures on a Rad Trad site and so thought that maybe the photos were a fake. sigh they weren’t.

I emailed the photographer and he replied ’ …
‘…Fr likes to use visual aids as part of his homily.’!! I wonder what he does at the Consecration and is the photographer busy taking photos while he does it.

It seems to me that in most churches the Mass today is like a Beethoven symphony played by a High School band.

francisandclare.org/imagegallery/html/page_two1.html

While visual aids are not to be used during the homily, so this priest is doing what he shouldn’t, I don’t think that automatically translates into his doing invalid things during the consecration. We had a very devout priest who liked to use visual aids, too–he even used a full-sized coffin once–but his act of consecration was holy and in every way proper.

 

[Lorrie]

Its against the rules to say rad trad, just giving you a heads up.

 

[Deacon_Ed]

Della:

While visual aids are not to be used during the homily, so this priest is doing what he shouldn’t, I don’t think that automatically translates into his doing invalid things during the consecration. We had a very devout priest who liked to use visual aids, too–he even used a full-sized coffin once–but his act of consecration was holy and in every way proper.

I’d sure like to see some authentic teaching from the Church regarding the use of visial aids during the homily. There’s nothing in the GIRM that prohibits it.

Deacon Ed

 

[Eileen_T]

Is this his way of keeping the kids “on the straight and narrow”? :whacky:

We had a priest who brought in an empty bottle he had found, when walking his dog, to use in his homily. I can’t remember anything he said, just that the bottle was an alcoholic drink named ‘Sex on the Beach’.

I think these gimmicky things at Mass just distract.

 

[netmilsmom]

yinekka:

I found the link to these pictures on a Rad Trad site and so thought that maybe the photos were a fake. sigh they weren’t.

I emailed the photographer and he replied ’ …
‘…Fr likes to use visual aids as part of his homily.’!! I wonder what he does at the Consecration and is the photographer busy taking photos while he does it.

It seems to me that in most churches the Mass today is like a Beethoven symphony played by a High School band.

francisandclare.org/imagegallery/html/page_two1.html

I am as traditional as the next person, but perhaps this is the Children’s Liturgy of the Word.
At least they have a crucifix!

 

[Della]

Deacon Ed:

I’d sure like to see some authentic teaching from the Church regarding the use of visial aids during the homily. There’s nothing in the GIRM that prohibits it.

Deacon Ed

And there’s nothing that mandates it, either. The homily is a time to preach the word not play at Mr. Rogers Neighborhood.

 

[YinYangMom]

I’ll have to look for any restriction in the GIRM about visual aides during the homily, I don’t think it’s forbidden either…

but looking at those pictures, the smiles on the kids’ face, the parents in the pews…

I could actually visualize Jesus walking along a village, adults around him and their kids following along balancing on the stone walls along the path. I don’t picture Jesus frowning on the kids, and I could imagine He might have even spoken to some of the children along the way and they would have been enthralled.

I have an image of Jesus playing with children, acknowledging their presence when they were around, using the moments to teach and encourage at their levels.

And these pictures could very well have been from a special youth mass, or even a lecture/presentation which was being held in the church (though looking at the arials it looks like there was ample room to do something like that in another area of the building)…but this particular part of the event obviously was not the consecration and I agree with the other poster who advised not to assume the consecration would not be handled reverently and properly.

 

[YinYangMom]

Della:

And there’s nothing that mandates it, either. The homily is a time to preach the word not play at Mr. Rogers Neighborhood.

Oh pooh. If it’s a children’s liturgy or a special family mass, then where’s the gripe? If it was at the adult mass, then yeah, I could see being annoyed, but c’mon, you’re acting as though every mass is conducted this way when you don’t know the situation at all.

 

[paramedicgirl]

YinYangMom:

Oh pooh. If it’s a children’s liturgy or a special family mass, then where’s the gripe? If it was at the adult mass, then yeah, I could see being annoyed, but c’mon, you’re acting as though every mass is conducted this way when you don’t know the situation at all.

Well, in response to that, I would have to say that I would much rather have my daughter attend a real Mass than one full of props, acrobatics and games. Let’s keep this for the CCD classes.

 

[YinYangMom]

paramedicgirl:

Well, in response to that, I would have to say that I would much rather have my daughter attend a real Mass than one full of props, acrobatics and games. Let’s keep this for the CCD classes.

I think it all depends on the community. Did you see the arial shots? That parking lot was huge, but the parish is surrounded by farmland. I know nothing about this community but I saw smiles on the kids, the priest and the people in the pews.

Again, we can’t assume this priest doesn’t offer other real Masses for this same community. We can’t assume this is the ONLY version of Mass these kids will ever be exposed to.

Without knowing the topic of the homily, the context under which he used these props - or any props for that matter, how can we come out and say he’s wrong - especially when it isn’t forbidden in the GIRM???

 

[Tantum_ergo]

I agree that there isn’t enough information yet (though I do know that recorded music is verboten, and I think that visual aids would fall under the reason why that is wrong–vis to wit, that they do not constitute authentic actual participation by the people attending the Mass). . .however, the emphasis you place on “the smiles on the faces of people” seems jarring to me.

It’s as though you were saying, “maybe this isn’t exactly right or according to Hoyle, but how can we criticize something the people ENJOY?” You aren’t, though, are you?

I have a parish priest who is very friendly and jovial, full of funny stories during Mass, takes 5 minutes at the sign of peace to go up and down the aisles shaking hands, has the EMHCs hold hands with him during the Our Father–and you should SEE the smiles on the faces of the people. They LOVE it. . .but it is wrong according to the GIRM. The priest is specifically forbidden to hold hands at the Our Father, AND he is forbidden to leave the sanctuary at the sign of peace–but our priest does it anyway, because “The people enjoy it and that is more important than some documentary GUIDELINES”.

Unfortunately given the state of most Catholic parishes today, in the wake of the last 40 years, we face huge battles which really shouldn’t have to exist at all, because so many people want to “feel good” as opposed to “obey the rules”.

P.S. Of course I do not mean this to you personally, and I know that this is not the case EVERYWHERE, but I do truly feel that there is too much of an emphasis today on “we the people and our individual expressions of what WE think is important” as opposed to what the church, the unity of the body of Christ, has universally taught is REALLY important.

 

[Dr.Bombay]

Eileen T:

Is this his way of keeping the kids “on the straight and narrow”? :whacky:

We had a priest who brought in an empty bottle he had found, when walking his dog, to use in his homily. I can’t remember anything he said, just that the bottle was an alcoholic drink named ‘Sex on the Beach’.

I think these gimmicky things at Mass just distract.

Sometimes you people post things like this and I’m just supposed to ignore them, or risk getting suspended.

Y’all ought to be ashamed for putting such temptations in front of me. :tsktsk:

 

[Elzee]

I’m as traditional as the next guy and am not in favor of dumbing down the Mass for kids and believe most kids can be expeced to sit through an hour Mass respectfully and also a rosary before-hand…with that said, without having more information, I don’t know if there is anything wrong with these pictures or not. The reason I say this is there is a very orthodox priest in our area who will sometimes say Mass at the elementary school. He often uses props during his homily. I’ve seen him use kites (the kite/wind analogy in relation to not being able to see God); a suitcase (what do you think you’ll need to take with you when you go to Heaven…not a thing…God is our happiness and has all we need…); children’s books (encourage kids to read the ‘stories’ in the bible much like they read their own ‘story’ books); and at one Mass he even had 4 kids participate in a 1-2 minute Simon Says game (who is the ‘Simon’ in your life? Who are you going to listen to?). All of these were done tastefully, it was not done as ‘entertainment’, and he got the kids to listen respectfully (no yelling out, uncontrolled laughter, etc.) as he related his stories to the readings in a way the kids could understand and remember. Unless the use of visual aids is prohibited, I think they can occasionally help convey the message, especially with young kids. That said, we have to hope our priests will use common sense (I know some won’t…) and will use them as a tool for teaching…not the focus.

 

[YinYangMom]

Tantum ergo:

It’s as though you were saying, “maybe this isn’t exactly right or according to Hoyle, but how can we criticize something the people ENJOY?” You aren’t, though, are you?

No, I’m not. I guess I’m commenting on how nice it is too see smiling interactive faces instead of the zoned out ones I usually see, or the ones nodding off.

You’re absolutely right that ends don’t justify the means if the means are against the GIRM. But if they are within the guidelines, then means to an end are ok, and in this case we just don’t know enough to make that determination.

 

[paramedicgirl]

YinYangMom:

No, I’m not. I guess I’m commenting on how nice it is too see smiling interactive faces instead of the zoned out ones I usually see, or the ones nodding off.

Or the ones deep in payer? Hmmm. I never think to look around at people’s faces while I am attending Mass. I always pay attention to the priest, and can only tell you what his expressions would be.

 

[YinYangMom]

paramedicgirl:

Or the ones deep in payer? Hmmm. I never think to look around at people’s faces while I am attending Mass. I always pay attention to the priest, and can only tell you what his expressions would be.

Hey, what’s with the snide remark?
Why would you think it is ok for you to imply I, personally, do not pay attention at mass or pray reverently during mass just because I commented on observations in my parish?

If you want to know, Mass, for me, is a communal event. It is not about me and the priest as if no one else was around. It’s about fellowship with those around me, all of us united in praying for our country, our world, our personal needs, all of us offering the sacrifice of the Mass with the priest. When I seek alone time with Jesus, I have Eucharistic Adoration or the tabernacle 23 other hours of the day.

Now that’s not to imply that your approach to the Mass is wrong or less than mine or anyone else’s. What works for each of us, especially in bringing us closer to Jesus is commendable. There is not one way to be a faithful practicing Catholic.

 

[paramedicgirl]

YinYangMom:

Hey, what’s with the snide remark?
Why would you think it is ok for you to imply I, personally, do not pay attention at mass or pray reverently during mass just because I commented on observations in my parish?

If you want to know, Mass, for me, is a communal event. It is not about me and the priest as if no one else was around. It’s about fellowship with those around me, all of us united in praying for our country, our world, our personal needs, all of us offering the sacrifice of the Mass with the priest. When I seek alone time with Jesus, I have Eucharistic Adoration or the tabernacle 23 other hours of the day.

Now that’s not to imply that your approach to the Mass is wrong or less than mine or anyone else’s. What works for each of us, especially in bringing us closer to Jesus is commendable. There is not one way to be a faithful practicing Catholic.

You are fortunate that you can have Eucharistic adoration 24 hours a day. We only have it on the First Friday of the month, and then only for 1 hour before Mass.

I guess I’m one of those people who don’t go to Mass to socialize or to chat afterwards with others. I just want to pray and often I can’t because there is so much noise from everyone who thinks it is a social event. I guess that’s why I don’t bother worrying about others at Mass. There are already too many distractions. That’s why I said I never look around at other people in Mass. It wasn’t to offend you. Sorry for coming across that way.

 

[YinYangMom]

paramedicgirl:

You are fortunate that you can have Eucharistic adoration 24 hours a day. We only have it on the First Friday of the month, and then only for 1 hour before Mass.

I guess I’m one of those people who don’t go to Mass to socialize or to chat afterwards with others. I just want to pray and often I can’t because there is so much noise from everyone who thinks it is a social event. I guess that’s why I don’t bother worrying about others at Mass. There are already too many distractions. That’s why I said I never look around at other people in Mass. It wasn’t to offend you. Sorry for coming across that way.

oh, ok. Thanks for taking the time to clear the matter up, I really appreciate it.

We have Adoration every Wednesday from 7am - 7pm, but the tabernacle is accessible from sunrise to about 10pm daily.

The Mass always has been a communal event. We are always able to be alone with God the rest of the day, week, month, year, but it is through the Mass the community of believers gather to rejoice in the Good News and celebrate the Resurrection.

It’s a family gathering, not an private engagement between you and Jesus alone. If you weren’t introduced to the Mass in that light perhaps that’s why you are bothered by the ‘distractions’. Certainly if you were expecting the Mass to be something you observe but don’t participate in you’d be disappointed with all the commotion, but if you were expecting the Mass to be a homecoming of sorts, Jesus inviting all of us to come over to his house for dinner, you’d probably be better able to appreciate that hour with others.

The entire liturgy is designed with this ‘coming over to the feast’ theme…

We gather in song and welcoming prayer.

We then apologize to our host and everyone around us for anything we may have done since we last gathered which may have offended anyone else (not just Jesus, everyone else in His family). All differences are set aside so that we can enjoy this time together.

We sit down to hear stories from our past and of our host so we can remember why we are one family, how we fit into the family tree.

Then before we move into the dining area we offer our petitions and prayers, each member of the family sharing their concerns and asking for our help and support.

And then we come to the table where the host invites us to eat and drink, but we take time out to prepare ourselves (kind of like washing our hands before we sit down at the table).

Afterward, we thank our host for inviting us, for the wonderful meal, we wish him well, he wishes us well - until we meet again.

Our parish has the problem of not having an adequate reception area en route to the church so the socializing does pose a distraction for those trying to prepare themselves for the Mass to begin. We are trying to find a way to get the reverence for the tabernacle and Mass back without losing the spirit of the gathering because our priests want to see the hour before Mass become a silent one of reflection, so I really like the way your church has the exposed Eucharist an hour before Mass. I may suggest that to our liturgy committee next week. It may really make the difference we are seeking.

 

[buffalo]

Deacon Ed:

I’d sure like to see some authentic teaching from the Church regarding the use of visial aids during the homily. There’s nothing in the GIRM that prohibits it.

Deacon Ed

I don’t think there is anything in the GIRM preventing cartwheels during the homily either. Common sense is in order here.