Voting Republican

[dch1983]

A friend recently presented this argument to me when discussing voting and the moral issues that we face today, especially abortion: “The Republican party is the party that is pro-life. But we have had a Republican president for 6 years now, and the Republicans have held the House for many years as well, and STILL nothing definitive has been done to bring an end to abortion. We vote Republican (for some it is for many issues) largely to combat abortion. But is anything actually being done by our Republican politicians to put an end to abortion? Certainly the opportunity is there…”

That was the gist of the statement. Any thoughts on this?

 

[PLAL]

I think you have to think about a few things to consider when voting…

-Always vote for the 100% Pro-Life Candidate in a election. This is the most important issue and there are no other issues or combination of issues more important than saving the lives of 4,000 innocent defenseless human beings every day.

-Voting for the Lessor of Two Evils. Consider the candidates stand on the Pro-Life issues. They key question here is to ask yourself “How much Evil can be reduced by voting for the candidate who supports the least amount of Evil?"

If one candidate is 100% Pro-Abortion and the other is 85-95% Pro-Abortion, then I think voting for either of these candidates is a wasted vote.

If one candidate is 100% Pro-Abortion and the other is 25-35% Pro-Abortion (65-75% Pro-Life). then I think it would be a good idea to vote for the “lessor of two evils” in this case.

Keep in mind if we keep voting for the “lessor of two evils” philosophy then our policy’s in America will inherently become more and more evil. We don’t want this to happen.

-Voting for the 100% Pro-Life Candidate who has no chance of winning. I do think this is another good option. This is the option I am taking this year in the vote for IL Governor. In IL, our Democratic Candidate (Rod Blagojevich) is 100% Pro-Abortion. Our Republican Candidate (Judy Baar Topinka) is 90-95% Pro-Abortion. We have a 3rd Candidate who is 100% Pro-Life (Randy Stufflebeam). He is running for office but will not be on the ballot. I will be writing in the 100% Pro-Life third candidate on the ballot who does not have a chance to win.

My strategy here shows both parties I will only support Pro-Life Candidates in the future. If they want my vote in the future, they MUST have Pro-Life Candidates.

-Not Voting At All. This is a bad option**.** If you don’t vote, the parties will never try to get your vote. A better option is to vote and write in the name of a prominent Pro-Lifer in your state.

-Don’t Look at Labels. Forget about if the candidate is Republican, Democrat, Constitution, Green Party or Independent Candidate. Drop the labels and vote for the Pro-Life Candidate period!

-Pray. Do a lot of praying before you vote. Ask for guidance and go to Eucharistic Adoration.

 

[PLAL]

Here’s another thread which is good…

Catholic & Democrat?

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=84770

 

[Della]

I think you have to think about a few things to consider when voting…

-Always vote for the 100% Pro-Life Candidate in a election. This is the most important issue and there are no other issues or combination of issues more important than saving the lives of 4,000 innocent defenseless human beings every day.

-Voting for the Lessor of Two Evils. Consider the candidates stand on the Pro-Life issues. They key question here is to ask yourself “How much Evil can be reduced by voting for the candidate who supports the least amount of Evil?"

If one candidate is 100% Pro-Abortion and the other is 85-95% Pro-Abortion, then I think voting for either of these candidates is a wasted vote.

If one candidate is 100% Pro-Abortion and the other is 25-35% Pro-Abortion (65-75% Pro-Life). then I think it would be a good idea to vote for the “lessor of two evils” in this case.

Keep in mind if we keep voting for the “lessor of two evils” philosophy then our policy’s in America will inherently become more and more evil. We don’t want this to happen.

I can only agree with the 25-35% option, not because of my own ideas but because the Church supports the idea that voting for the lesser of two evils REDUCES evil not encourages it.

-Voting for the 100% Pro-Life Candidate who has no chance of winning. I do think this is another good option. This is the option I am taking this year in the vote for IL Governor. In IL, our Democratic Candidate (Rod Blagojevich) is 100% Pro-Abortion. Our Republican Candidate (Judy Baar Topinka) is 90-95% Pro-Abortion. We have a 3rd Candidate who is 100% Pro-Life (Randy Stufflebeam). He is running for office but will not be on the ballot. I will be writing in the 100% Pro-Life third candidate on the ballot who does not have a chance to win.

My strategy here shows both parties I will only support Pro-Life Candidates in the future. If they want my vote in the future, they MUST have Pro-Life Candidates.

Writing in candidates means nothing. All it does is negate any vote you might have made for the candidate who might have had a chance of winning who was either a weak pro-life candidate or the one who was the lesser of two evils. You just gave a vote to the candidate who is a strong(er) supporter of pro-death positions.

-Not Voting At All. This is a bad option**.** If you don’t vote, the parties will never try to get your vote. A better option is to vote and write in the name of a prominent Pro-Lifer in your state.

It is a bad option, but not for the reasons you cite. It’s a bad option because it gives your vote to the opposite candidate.

-Don’t Look at Labels. Forget about if the candidate is Republican, Democrat, Constitution, Green Party or Independent Candidate. Drop the labels and vote for the Pro-Life Candidate period!

Nope. It’s just a wasted vote to vote for those who have no chance of winning.

-Pray. Do a lot of praying before you vote. Ask for guidance and go to Eucharistic Adoration.

This is fine advise, but we also ought to take the advise of our bishops and vote wisely–which means voting to make some progress by voting for those who have a chance of being elected instead of throwing our votes away just to assuage (quite wrongly) our consciences (which are improperly formed if we will not listen to what the Church has to say on this or any other issue).

 

[Malcolm_McLean]

A friend recently presented this argument to me when discussing voting and the moral issues that we face today, especially abortion: “The Republican party is the party that is pro-life. But we have had a Republican president for 6 years now, and the Republicans have held the House for many years as well, and STILL nothing definitive has been done to bring an end to abortion. We vote Republican (for some it is for many issues) largely to combat abortion. But is anything actually being done by our Republican politicians to put an end to abortion? Certainly the opportunity is there…”

That was the gist of the statement. Any thoughts on this?

In the last election, both candidates had essentially the same position on abortion. Both were personally opposed to it, but neither was going to try to use the power of the Presidency to force the issue and provoke an constitutional crisis.

However somehow Bush presented his policy convincingly, whilst Kerry came across as insincere.

I do think that, on abortion, the Republicans have the right instincts whilst the Democrats have thw wrong ones. However I’m not an American.

 

[Corki]

But is anything actually being done by our Republican politicians to put an end to abortion? Certainly the opportunity is there…"

I would have to say “yes” there is, even if it hasn’t been as dramtic as we would like.

Two new Supreme Court Justices that are more likely to protect life than any the Democrats would have put forward.

Many more pro-life justices in lower courts.

Numerous states with parental notification laws.

The partial birth abortion ban. Being challenged, yes, but it would have been vetoed outright by a certain Democrat who ran for President or not even made it that far.

Reinstatement of the Mexico City policy limiting foreign aid to be used for abortions and coercive family planning practices.

Numerous states with “Woman’s Right to Know” laws.

The fight is far from over and it seems we take one step back for every two steps forward but I believe we are making progress.

 

[wcknight]

I think we are making progress, but we need to win over popular opinion and that is much tougher than just placing a couple of justices and judges. The popular media is still a big problem. Until folks start thinking of fetuses and embyos as really human babies, and not just some inanimate objects that can easily be cast off, it will remain a huge uphill battle.

The problem with abortionists is that they don’t think babies are babies, until they are out of the womb. The fact that they may be fully functioning at a much earlier age doesn’t faze them. And the fact that they may be independantly moving as early as six weeks, they ignore as irrelevant.

 

[mosher]

The Republicans have tried to stop certain forms of abortion like all the late term and partial birth abortions. They have tried to pass measures that require parental consent. The President has dis-allowed federal funding of embryonic stem-cell research. The President has canceled all foreign AIDS relief that uses contraceptives to fight against AIDS and other STDs. The family protection initiative which states that the federal definition of marriage is exclusively between one man and one woman. There are many other things that I am sure I can’t think of at the moment since Republicans took the house and then the Senate that they have done or at least tried to do since taking power. Some things were blocked by moderates some by filibuster and most by out of control judges.

In short the Republicans have done much that would never have been done if Democrats were in charge. However, most of the time these accomplishments do not make big news because they do not fit the agenda of the news media.

 

[nydas]

I think we are making progress, but we need to win over popular opinion and that is much tougher than just placing a couple of justices and judges. The popular media is still a big problem. Until folks start thinking of fetuses and embyos as really human babies, and not just some inanimate objects that can easily be cast off, it will remain a huge uphill battle.

The problem with abortionists is that they don’t think babies are babies, until they are out of the womb. The fact that they may be fully functioning at a much earlier age doesn’t faze them. And the fact that they may be independantly moving as early as six weeks, they ignore as irrelevant.

Making progress? MAKING PROGRESS? You call a war resulting in the deaths of 2900 Americans and an uncountable number of Iraqis is making progress? You call striping American Civillians of countless freedoms for a “protection” that doesn’t even exist, progress? You call lying to the public over and over again, progress?

And all for what? NOTHING! Great job voting for an idiot simply because he was “pro-life”.I hope your all happy.

 

[mosher]

Making progress? MAKING PROGRESS? You call a war resulting in the deaths of 2900 Americans and an uncountable number of Iraqis is making progress? You call striping American Civillians of countless freedoms for a “protection” that doesn’t even exist, progress? You call lying to the public over and over again, progress?

And all for what? NOTHING! Great job voting for an idiot simply because he was “pro-life”.I hope your all happy.

Yes, we are definitely making progress.

 

[maber43]

Yes, we are definitely making progress.

 

[nydas]

The President has dis-allowed federal funding of embryonic stem-cell research.

Awsome. Now those stem-cells will end up in the trash.

The President has canceled all foreign AIDS relief that uses contraceptives to fight against AIDS and other STDs

GENIUS! Will cure aids and STDs by making sure everyone gets it! I wonder why we didnt think of this before!

The family protection initiative which states that the federal definition of marriage is exclusively between one man and one woman.

Because stoping gay marriage is much more important then cleaning up the war he started.

There are many other things that I am sure I can’t think of at the moment since Republicans took the house and then the Senate that they have done or at least tried to do since taking power.

Like turning America into a Totalitarianism state.

 

[mosher]

But seriously, as a man who at one time trained to lead men into battle I can say that I am very comfortable with the military progress and the very low casualty rate that we have at this point. As far as I am concerned based on my knowledge of war and police actions and my extensive knowledge of pan-Arabic culture this one is being executed well and in the best way possible. So, I don’t complain. 3000 deaths in about 5 years mostly in an Urban Combat situation is a tacticians dream. I doubt anyone thought the casualties would be so low at this point.

 

[nydas]

But seriously, as a man who at one time trained to lead men into battle I can say that I am very comfortable with the military progress and the very low casualty rate that we have at this point. As far as I am concerned based on my knowledge of war and police actions and my extensive knowledge of pan-Arabic culture this one is being executed well and in the best way possible. So, I don’t complain. 3000 deaths in about 5 years mostly in an Urban Combat situation is a tacticians dream. I doubt anyone thought the casualties would be so low at this point.

As someone currently stationed in Iraq, your absolutely right. 3000 dead in a 5 year war is fairly good. Except for one tiny little problem. We have no damn business being here in the first place. Bush used 9/11 to manipulate the country into a war no one wanted, or needed.

 

[mosher]

Sorry for the posting delay it took a while for me to fix your formatting in the post.

Awsome. Now those stem-cells will end up in the trash.

On the contrary they remain in stasis at this point. This is better than killing them.

GENIUS! Will cure aids and STDs by making sure everyone gets it! I wonder why we didnt think of this before!

Actually every place where contraceptives are used to fight against STDs the rate of STDs go up. The only success story in Africa is the one country that is focusing on abstinence.

Because stoping gay marriage is much more important then cleaning up the war he started.

Yes, the moral ramifications are much greater.

Like turning America into a Totalitarianism.

Far from it. Remember we voted them in by our system of government. The people chose who they wanted and so be it. Having many friends who actually did grow up in totalitarian countries and communist countries I can assure you that your perspective is quite off the mark.

 

[mosher]

As someone currently stationed in Iraq, your absolutely right. 3000 dead in a 5 year war is fairly good. Except for one tiny little problem. We have no damn business being here in the first place. Bush used 9/11 to manipulate the country into a war no one wanted, or needed.

On the contrary, according to the war powers given to the President by the Congress the prosecution of the war against Iraq was well within the scope of that power. Further, even if the war was just to liberate the people from a Naziesque government (the Ba’ath party was a National Socialist Party modeled after the Nazi party) I would be fine with this war. I personally could care less about NBCs in the hands of the former government. Further, there have been found Chemical and Biological weapons caches which as you should know are far worse than Nuclear weapons. All that was needed was insert part A into slot B and we have weaponized small pox. The only intelligence that was wrong was that which reported that Iraq either had or was seeking Nuclear Weapons. Other than that it has been spot on (to use the British term).

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Awsome. Now those stem-cells will end up in the trash.

GENIUS! Will cure aids and STDs by making sure everyone gets it! I wonder why we didnt think of this before!

Because stoping gay marriage is much more important then cleaning up the war he started.

Hi,
I noticed you are in the US Army. I was wondering why you joined if you are so against fighting. War is a possibility in your job description. Maybe you need to retire if you cant support your country. I didnt notice your age, but I think most young Americans forget or never learned that unfortunately war is necessary. Freedom is not Free! It does come at a cost. Remember that if it were not for wars we would not have any freedoms.This forum would be null and void Freedom of religion forget it If we did not get involved in WWII we would all be speaking German now. Some wars might seem more just then others, I agree but Bush went on bad info. and we are there and yes we need to do a better job, but we need to stop complaining and whining about it and pray to God that He delivers us out of there ASAP. We also need to pray for the Iraqi’s to step up to the plate and control there country. We cannot, however leave them high and dry. That would potentially KILL more Americans(me, you, our children) in the future.

Let’s face it, the War on Terror is here to stay until Jesus Christ comes back. We need to protect ourselves(America) as well as any other country that needs help.

Wow that was long–sorry. BTW–thank you for serving to protect me and my family and keeping us FREE

Like turning America into a Totalitarianism state.

 

[nydas]

Sorry for the posting delay it took a while for me to fix your formatting in the post.

Ya. Sorry about that. I was in a hurry and didnt notice. I went back and fixed it also.

On the contrary they remain in stasis at this point. This is better than killing them.

And you know whats better then keeping em in stasis? Using them to find cures for disese!

Actually every place where contraceptives are used to fight against STDs the rate of STDs go up. The only success story in Africa is the one country that is focusing on abstinence.

Proof?

Yes, the moral ramifications are much greater.

You know, i think killing innocent Iraqi civillians, and tearing apart there country, ranks a little higher on the list of moral ramifications then gay marriage, but thats just me.

Far from it. Remember we voted them in by our system of government. The people chose who they wanted and so be it. Having many friends who actually did grow up in totalitarian countries and communist countries I can assure you that your perspective is quite off the mark.

You may have, but i didn’t. And i seem to recall quite the controversy over recounts back in 00’ causing me to question the legality over bush’s presidency.

 

[mary_bobo]

Making progress? MAKING PROGRESS? You call a war resulting in the deaths of 2900 Americans and an uncountable number of Iraqis is making progress? You call striping American Civillians of countless freedoms for a “protection” that doesn’t even exist, progress? You call lying to the public over and over again, progress?

And all for what? NOTHING! Great job voting for an idiot simply because he was “pro-life”.I hope your all happy.

Name calling does nothing to advance your opinions. I am sure you can find better ways to express yourself.

 

[nydas]

On the contrary, according to the war powers given to the President by the Congress the prosecution of the war against Iraq was well within the scope of that power. Further, even if the war was just to liberate the people from a Naziesque government (the Ba’ath party was a National Socialist Party modeled after the Nazi party) I would be fine with this war. I personally could care less about NBCs in the hands of the former government. Further, there have been found Chemical and Biological weapons caches which as you should know are far worse than Nuclear weapons. All that was needed was insert part A into slot B and we have weaponized small pox. The only intelligence that was wrong was that which reported that Iraq either had or was seeking Nuclear Weapons. Other than that it has been spot on (to use the British term).

And they were all pre-gulf war era. 99% of them were so old they were unusable.

Hi,
I noticed you are in the US Army. I was wondering why you joined if you are so against fighting. War is a possibility in your job description. Maybe you need to retire if you cant support your country. I didnt notice your age, but I think most young Americans forget or never learned that unfortunately war is necessary. Freedom is not Free! It does come at a cost. Remember that if it were not for wars we would not have any freedoms.This forum would be null and void Freedom of religion forget it If we did not get involved in WWII we would all be speaking German now. Some wars might seem more just then others, I agree but Bush went on bad info. and we are there and yes we need to do a better job, but we need to stop complaining and whining about it and pray to God that He delivers us out of there ASAP. We also need to pray for the Iraqi’s to step up to the plate and control there country. We cannot, however leave them high and dry. That would potentially KILL more Americans(me, you, our children) in the future.

Let’s face it, the War on Terror is here to stay until Jesus Christ comes back. We need to protect ourselves(America) as well as any other country that needs help.

Wow that was long–sorry. BTW–thank you for serving to protect me and my family and keeping us FREE

I love my country and i love being a soldier. Dont get me wrong. Im all for war, when there is a just cause. WW1, WW2, first gulf war, I will stand behind those wars 100%. Not this one. But i will not stand by silently twidiling my tumbs simply because im a soldier. I still have a voice and i will say what i think. Nevermind that fact that i could get tossed into the brigg for saying it.