Waiting til marriage

[RobBahoura]

Peace be with you. Jesus wants every one to be a Virgina but look what the bible tells us Paul was a Virgina and lived a celibacy life he said not all men can be like me each has his own gift 1 Corinthians 7:7-9. Jesus also said who does not marry and stays a Virgina does it for the Kingdom of Heaven BUT NOT ALL CAN EXCEPT THIS Matthew 19:10.

Of course the Jesus wants us to be Virgins and not marry we each have are own gift do pray for what your calling is.

 

[HolyInnocent]

JackieM… Both my husband and I were married before and had children, but when we started dating we agreed that it didn’t matter and that we should NOT have sex before marriage… it was a matter of moral belief, setting a good example for our children and wanting to do things right… it worked for us!

 

[BrokenFortress]

My fiance and I have both and still are waiting for marriage to have sex. So there are guys out there who are virgins and who take the Church teachings seriously. And not all those guys are virgins because no one would want them My fiance is a hockey player, and growing up in that type of environment it’s quite common for girls to throw themselves at the guys (quite attractive don’t you think? note the sarcasm) But for some guys chastity and following Jesus is more important than a bit of instant gratification.

Do I worry that he has no sexual experience? No, quite the opposite. I’ve actually had other girls as me that. I haven’t had any experience either. I think it’s wonderful that we’ll learn together. But for us, having been together so far for 5 years, our relationship is built on so much more than sex. What if he’s not good or I’m not good? Pft, why worry about that? When there’s more to our relationship than sex we can work through it. It’s sad that some worry about a guy lasting or whatnot. I feel bad for those who see that as a deal breaker. Someone’s faith, values and intellect mean more than some minutes of sex.

Anyways… that was a bit of a tangent, but I get sick of seeing people acting like not waiting for sex is so grand. I’m waiting and I feel like we’re better off.

Back on track, I don’t think you should set your standards low. But, if for whatever reason God puts a man in your life that has recommitted himself to chastity then I think you should discern why God put him into your life. I think the key here is trusting in God. It can be hard, I know it can, but if you trust in God it will work out. Perhaps you aren’t meant to meet someone until later in life. Really only God knows. Perhaps you’ll meet another virgin, which is great. Or perhaps God will call you to meet someone who has had a less than desirable past. But it’s how they act now that matters.

Hang in there, I’m a firm believer that God brings good to those who listen to Him.

 

[phil8888]

I’m interested in what people’s definition of virginity is. Some people believe it is only applicable to vaginal intercourse, while others believe the definition can be stretched to include anal and oral. I think most people on these boards would believe any of those categories would count as sex.

But what about pornography? What if there’s a guy who hasn’t had sex with a girl (including anal and oral), but he has watched a lot of porn and maybe is even addicted. Would you consider him a virgin?

 

[cmscms]

Hi Jackie,

I am now 40 and never married. When I was your age, I use to think ‘Since virgins are rare to find, I guess I can’t hold that as a criteria’. I admit I dated some men who were not virgins, had no problems with premarital yet since they knew I was going to wait, they respected me. Things didn’t work out for other reasons (topic for a different post).

So, the bad news about my post. No encouraging words here. There is such a thing as not meeting your prince charming.

However, I have no regrets about sticking to my beliefs. I am proud of it. And the reality is, the longer I wait, the more I want a man who is a virgin. I know the struggles I have had to face to remain pure. I also know the teasing I have gone through. It would be hard for me to respect a man who did not have my strenght. I still think men should be stronger than woman. (topic for another post again)

So for now my take on it is

If the man is NOT a virgin, he has gone to confession and decided never to have sex again BEFORE he met me. I don’t think it is up to me to point the importance of purity to a man.

Also, the main reason I would HIGHLY recommend marrying a man who does NOT want premarital sex is : How can you teach your kids to wait until marriage if their father is not on your side?

CM

 

[phil8888]

Hi Jackie,

I am now 40 and never married. When I was your age, I use to think ‘Since virgins are rare to find, I guess I can’t hold that as a criteria’. I admit I dated some men who were not virgins, had no problems with premarital yet since they knew I was going to wait, they respected me. Things didn’t work out for other reasons (topic for a different post).

So, the bad news about my post. No encouraging words here. There is such a thing as not meeting your prince charming.

However, I have no regrets about sticking to my beliefs. I am proud of it. And the reality is, the longer I wait, the more I want a man who is a virgin. I know the struggles I have had to face to remain pure. I also know the teasing I have gone through. It would be hard for me to respect a man who did not have my strenght. I still think men should be stronger than woman. (topic for another post again)

So for now my take on it is

If the man is NOT a virgin, he has gone to confession and decided never to have sex again BEFORE he met me. I don’t think it is up to me to point the importance of purity to a man.

Also, the main reason I would HIGHLY recommend marrying a man who does NOT want premarital sex is : How can you teach your kids to wait until marriage if their father is not on your side?

CM

I hear Steve Carell is a 40 year old virgin. Maybe give him a call.

 

[frindro]

I think it’s more important that the person you are dating is committed to waiting to marriage, rather than their sexual past. I would be worried that someone who does not mind premarital sex would try to pressure you into it.

 

[flyingfish]

I’m interested in what people’s definition of virginity is. Some people believe it is only applicable to vaginal intercourse, while others believe the definition can be stretched to include anal and oral. I think most people on these boards would believe any of those categories would count as sex.

But what about pornography? What if there’s a guy who hasn’t had sex with a girl (including anal and oral), but he has watched a lot of porn and maybe is even addicted. Would you consider him a virgin?

Personally I think it’s laughable to call someone who has had anal or oral sex a virgin. The intercourse definition wouldn’t even apply to a man, because he doesn’t have a hymen.

And I’d consider a man who had plain intercourse more of a virgin than a man who watched hundreds of hours of creepy porn.

 

[Jay82]

I’m not a virgin, but I do think you’re making it unnecessarily difficult for yourself to find a spouse. There are benefits to a sexually experienced man too, he’ll be better at sex. It wouldn’t be impossible for you to find a virgin, but it would be difficult. Even more difficult to find a man who’s a virgin by choice rather than because no one would have him.

I am a virgin by choice (at age 27). But I do agree with *flyingfish *in that you probably are making it unnecessarily difficult to find someone if you insist they be a virgin. Finding someone around your age that has waited and is compatible with you will be very tough, but still possible. I know from a personal standpoint I don’t care if the girl I date/marry is a virgin or not as long as she is now committed to waiting until marriage.

I think most people would be pretty shocked to find out I’m a virgin still. I never talk about it with my friends and I think based on the attention I have and still receive from women on a regular basis, I think they just assume I have done it at some point.

It’s not hard to learn if the guy is willing to learn and is adventurous. And it is a benefit to be with a man who is good at sex. It would make you want to have sex with him, and benefit the relationship. A guy who is done in a few minutes and then rolls over and falls asleep would be a chore and unenjoyable. For me that kind of thing would be a deal breaker in a relationship.

Yeah, I think it is very important for both the man and woman to be committed to pleasing one another and being open minded. When I ‘learn’ I have the mindset of doing everything I can to make it enjoyable for my future wife. That is just how I am. I would put her before me without a doubt. I would think if both people think this way, it will be pretty good once you get the ‘hang of things’ for lack of a better term. I’m not too worried about it not being good.

And I’d consider a man who had plain intercourse more of a virgin than a man who watched hundreds of hours of creepy porn.

Not sure I agree with that, but hundreds of hours is a lot.

 

[Dtmccameron]

Personally I think it’s laughable to call someone who has had anal or oral sex a virgin. The intercourse definition wouldn’t even apply to a man, because he doesn’t have a hymen.

And I’d consider a man who had plain intercourse more of a virgin than a man who watched hundreds of hours of creepy porn.

Agreed. Well, sorta. Let’s imagine Dante’s Inferno, and simply place the latter at a lower level.

Considering both the, “lusting with his eyes/commited adultery in his heart” business and the ultimately depraved and exploitive aspect of pornography, he’s far worse off. To my thinking.

And 100 hours aren’t many, given that they’re spaced out. 2 hours a night, and we’d have reached the “creepy” level just starting from March.

Considering many are first exposed early in life, and we’ve gone well past the creepy point several times over. One imagines pasting a skull-and-crossbones “Toxic!” sticker on the him, but given the nature of his disease, that would seem cruel.

===========================

Back to the OP, the male in question brings a bitter taste to my mouth. He doesn’t seem like the respectful sort, or the sort that is in the least penitant about past indiscresions. Essentially what findro said.

 

[MtnDwellar]

I have been slapped before because they think its rude to decline being offered because hey, sex just has to be had!

It is harder for men to be chaste. When women express a willingness and a desire to engage in sex, they are insulted when the offer is declined. Women seem to think that every man is a dog just waiting for a “cookie”.

Thanks for the responses. It is good to know that this thought has crossed others minds. As I get older, turning 25 this year I guess it becomes more of an issue. Right now I just want to grow in holiness and if the right guy comes around than he does. In the end it would be nice for the guy to be a virgin but I do understand that people make mistakes and would hope that at least he believes in waiting until marriage from this point on.

That’s a great attitude.
You have put God first, before a husband. That should work out. I have to add my opinion that many people put too high of a priority on marriage. They seem to think that finding a spouse is the key to happiness. Happiness comes from within.

 

[Jay82]

It is harder for men to be chaste. When women express a willingness and a desire to engage in sex, they are insulted when the offer is declined. Women seem to think that every man is a dog just waiting for a “cookie”.

That is true, I’ve had some women get pretty mad at me in the past for turning them down.

They seem to think that finding a spouse is the key to happiness. Happiness comes from within.

I agree 100%

 

[Rascalking]

Well said Mtn Dwellar and Jay82! That summed up my thoughts as well.

 

[flyingfish]

Not sure I agree with that, but hundreds of hours is a lot.

The reason I think this is that a lot of porn is very hostile to women and degrading to women. And I say this as someone who doesn’t consider porn wrong in general, and who occasionally watches (quality) porn.

I would not have any problem with a guy who enjoyed watching couples have sex. However, a lot of the porn that’s out there is just horrible. Some of the most popular porn involves teen girls (!), using the words b**** s*** w**** to refer to them, it’s very male centered in terms of the kind of sex act that is performed. And not uncommon for porn to include more than a couple having sex, or have rape themes (such as Japanese porn).

Would you consider someone who is into that more of a virgin than a guy who had sex with a girlfriend he loved?

(If the guy were into that, I wouldn’t care as long as I didn’t know about it and he didn’t want to try to behave like that with me. If I knew my boyfriend enjoyed watching teen girls get raped or something, it would be very, very hard to want to be with him.)

 

[marialouisa17]

I agree. Hence I say what I said about the whole thing… I just wouldn’t get past it if she had multiple partners, because that is more than a mistake. Know what I mean? I am willing to take responsibility for what I did and say I wasn’t a victim, I chose what I did and I had my reasons at the time but in retrospect they were absolutely childish and silly reasons (and what else can you expect). Now, I have learnt.

I also wouldn’t fall for the victim thing, though it may sound harsh. But I also don’t fall for the whole “in the moment it was right we were in love” trash that my ex spewed. It drives me nuts thinking that some man is gonna get that same argument and I will be one of those whom she was speaking about. It’s never right until you are in a sacremental marriage - end of story. Realise that and realise it with good theology and psychology and not only will you regret (…despise…) every sexual sin of the past, but you will WANT to stay pure.

I think on many levels you are right, only point I would make is that we can be forgiven for any sins, no matter how sinful our past life, if we truly repent. Maybe you haven’t met women who have had a colourful past sex life and are truly repentant, but they exist. It’s totally fair enough if you don’t think you could deal with it, but surely as Catholics, we are supposed to accept those who come to (or back to) the faith without judgement of their past? I think that it’s unfair to imply that those who made more than one mistake (or rather bad choice) cannot every be pure and chaste again, and I don’t think it coincides with the Church’s teachings or the gospels. Christ forgave inveterate sinners, and (although difficult) so should we.

 

[jackiem]

I have been reading these books on dating and I still have my same beliefs BUT after reading TOB stuff it makes me realize God’s plan of sexual intimacy. I guess after reading these I feel that I would want a guy who is a virgin. I feel this way because the marital embrace is something so personal, so intimate and I feel that I would be hurt to share this with someone once I am married and to know my husband had shared this experience with x number of people. I realize finding a guy who is a virgin is extremely rare. Then I thought at least he has to maybe be reviginized, meaning he isn’t a virgin but now believes in waiting until marriage.

For those who are virgins has this crossed your mind?

No one seemed to address the underlined part. I’m wondering if this actually happens or not really.

 

[flyingfish]

No one seemed to address the underlined part. I’m wondering if this actually happens or not really.

It seems to me like you are needlessly working yourself up.
Imagine you were marrying a widdower, would it still bother you?

 

[mjs1987]

No one seemed to address the underlined part. I’m wondering if this actually happens or not really.

Yes it does happen. I ended a relationship because she had more partners than I could accept in a future spouse and I doubted her ability to commit to a single man. I know from family and friends that past relationships frequently hurt people and it causes wedges between them. This feeling of not being important to the other person because you are just one of many is understandable and it does happen often. There is a reason why men love taking the virginity of a girl. It is because they know it will be something she remembers for her whole life and she will always have some attachment or feelings for you. I was talking to one girl and she told me that she might not be able to turn down sex with the man that took her virginity even if she was married to someone else. If past relationships didnt matter to people then women and men wouldnt compare their relationship to their past ones and wonder if they stack up or are really loyal to one person.

 

[flyingfish]

Yes it does happen. I ended a relationship because she had more partners than I could accept in a future spouse and I doubted her ability to commit to a single man. I know from family and friends that past relationships frequently hurt people and it causes wedges between them. This feeling of not being important to the other person because you are just one of many is understandable and it does happen often. There is a reason why men love taking the virginity of a girl. It is because they know it will be something she remembers for her whole life and she will always have some attachment or feelings for you. I was talking to one girl and she told me that she might not be able to turn down sex with the man that took her virginity even if she was married to someone else. If past relationships didnt matter to people then women and men wouldnt compare their relationship to their past ones and wonder if they stack up or are really loyal to one person.

Keep in mind that the OP is a woman, and women are far less likely to feel sexual jealousy with respect to past relationships than men.

Men definitely suffer from this, some cultures even consider it a good thing to murder women who’ve had premarital sex. It’s really rare to see this in women however. Doesn’t make much biological sense either, not like a man can be carrying another woman’s child and have the woman be stuck thinking it’s hers.

A past relationship could create a problem if the person is not over it regardless of whether there was sex.

My advice to the OP would be to work on her self esteem.

 

[Jay82]

No one seemed to address the underlined part. I’m wondering if this actually happens or not really.

It is possible that it could be in the back of your mind, but ultimately if you decide to marry someone, you both are devoted to one another. It is about you two, not some old boyfriend/girlfriend from the past or someone they may have slept with at one time. Experiences shape people and if you meet a wonderful guy that ‘made a mistake’ in the past and is re-committed to being abstinent until marriage…why would you hold that against him? His past experiences help make him who is he and in this case those experiences would have helped him become the man you like (hypothetically speaking).

If I insisted I marry a girl who is a virgin then I would have to find someone about 10 years younger than me or not get married. So chances are I’ll end up marrying a girl that has had sex at some point in the past. If she waits for me, it would show me that she cares and loves me. I would not be bothered by her past and I think its unfair to hold anything like that against her.