Was Adam with Eve during her interaction with the serpent?

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Isaiah45_9

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Gen 3:6

Revised Standard Version (RSV) New International Version (NIV)
6 So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate; and she also gave some to her husband, and he ate.

This entire chapter is very intriguing.

From the entire story, I gather:

God creates Adam.
God tells Adam to not eat from the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
God creates Eve.
It doesn’t say if God or Adam told Eve about the tree.

The serpent approaches Eve and talks only to her (There is no indication he talks to Adam). Also the serpent is addressed as he, not it.

The serpent brings the issue of eating from the forbidden tree. Eve demonstrates knowledge that she is not supposed to eat from the tree. We still don’t know how exactly she knows.

She eats from the tree first and her eyes did not open. Only when she brings Adam fruit to eat and after Adam eats, then her eyes open.

God rebukes the serpent for deceiving Eve.
God rebukes Eve for bringing the fruit to Adam, not for eating from it.
God rebukes Adam for eating from the fruit.

Eve didn’t say, the serpent deceived us.
There is no indication of the serpent talking to Adam.
There is no indication that Adam knew what fruit he was eating before he actually ate form it. Only after he eats.

Many modern translations include this phrase:

She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

I don’t see where they get that from.

Genesis 3:6 In the Hebrew:

ותרא האשה כי טוב העץ למאכל וכי תאוה הוא לעינים ונחמד העץ להשׁכיל ותקח מפריו ותאכל ותתן גם לאישה עמה ויאכל

I am yet to find something as explicit that translates Adam being with Eve during the interaction with the serpent.

en.wikisource.org/wiki/Tanakh/Torah/Bereishit/Chapter_3
biblos.com/genesis/3-6.htm

Would also like to hear from our Jewish friends and know their interpretation of the fall.

Thanks and God Bless,

Jose
 
I have always gotten the impression that in history, both Jews and Christians have almost always interpreted these Scriptures as indicating that Adam was NOT present during Eve’s conversation with the serpent.

This has always been used as part of the justification for keeping women out of positions of responsibility in the Church and in Society in general. Right or wrong, this has always been used to show that women are less able to resist temptations, and so must be kept out of positions of leadership over men.

1 Peter 3 has the famous phrase: “Likewise you husbands, live considerately with your wives, bestowing honor on the woman as the weaker sex.”

1 Corinthians 14:34 has a famous prohibition: “Let your women keep silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak; but** they are to be submissive**, as the law also says.”

Colossians 3:18: “Wives, submit to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord.”

Traditionally, those verses above were justified in large part because it was EVE who was the initial sole instrument of the serpent in bringing about the Fall. Somehow the Fall was MORE Eve’s fault than Adam’s, in the traditional view.

This was also involved in the witch trials and burning in the Middle Ages and right up to the age of the Salem Witch Trials.
 
Bartolome_Casas said:
I have always gotten the impression that in history, both Jews and Christians have almost always interpreted these Scriptures as indicating that Adam was NOT present during Eve’s conversation with the serpent.

This has always been used as part of the justification for keeping women out of positions of responsibility in the Church and in Society in general. Right or wrong, this has always been used to show that women are less able to resist temptations, and so must be kept out of positions of leadership over men.

1 Peter 3 has the famous phrase: “Likewise you husbands, live considerately with your wives, bestowing honor on the woman as the weaker sex.”

1 Corinthians 14:34 has a famous prohibition: “Let your women keep silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak; but** they are to be submissive**, as the law also says.”

Colossians 3:18: “Wives, submit to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord.”

Traditionally, those verses above were justified in large part because it was EVE who was the initial sole instrument of the serpent in bringing about the Fall. Somehow the Fall was MORE Eve’s fault than Adam’s, in the traditional view.

This was also involved in the witch trials and burning in the Middle Ages and right up to the age of the Salem Witch Trials.
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If I understand Catholicism rightly, it is Adam who was responsible for the human race which would follow as his descendents. The whole human race is in Adam “as one body of one man.” Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition, paragraphs 404 - 411. One can enter the Catechism at this link. scborromeo.org/ccc/para/404.htm Christ is referred to as the “New Adam” because He became obedient unto death on a cross to make amends superabundantly for the disobedience of Adam.

In other words, Eve personally could sin; however, it was Adam who preferred himself over God and thus scorned his Creator. Adam’s direct disobedience broke the relationship with God for himself and his future descendents.

By the way, all men should read Colossians 3:19 and Ephesians 5: 28-31. 😉
 
Isaiah45_9 said:
Gen 3:6

Genesis 3:6 In the Hebrew:

ותרא האשה כי טוב העץ למאכל וכי תאוה הוא לעינים ונחמד העץ להשׁכיל ותקח מפריו ותאכל ותתן גם לאישה עמה ויאכל
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i think they get it from the red above, a prep. 3-person Fem sing. > ‘with her’> עִמָּהּ
some translations, not all, throw in a relative plus ‘was’ > ‘who was with her’.

The 18 other times that form (with those vowels) occurs in OT its always just ‘with her’.

i don’t know though if it means:
  1. ‘gave to Adam right there with her at the moment she ate at the tree’. -or-
  2. ‘gave to Adam at a later time when with her’?? 🤷
    meaning, is there a space of time between when she ate and when she gave…
    i’ve always understood it to read like 2.
All that’s really there is: 3.6 ‘and gave also unto her husband with her.’

here’s some translations

KJV Genesis 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.1

ASV Genesis 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat; and she gave also unto her husband with her, and he did eat.

ESV Genesis 3:6 So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise,1 she took of its fruit aand ate, and she also gave some to her husband who was with her, band he ate.

NAU Genesis 3:6 aWhen the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was desirable to make one wise, she took from its fruit and ate; and she gave also to her husband with her, and he ate.

NET Genesis 3:6 When15 the woman saw that the tree produced fruit that was good for food,16 was attractive17 to the eye, and was desirable for making one wise,18 she took some of its fruit and ate it.19 She also gave some of it to her husband who was with her, and he ate it.20

NIVO Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirablea for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband,b who was with her, and he ate it.c

NRS Genesis 3:6 So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate; and she also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate.

RSV Genesis 3:6 So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate; and she also gave some to her husband, and he ate.

YLT Genesis 3:6 And the woman seeth that the tree is good for food, and that it is pleasant to the eyes, and the tree is desirable to make one wise, and she taketh of its fruit and eateth, and giveth also to her husband with her, and he doth eat;

NAB Genesis 3:6 The woman saw that the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eyes, and the tree was desirable for gaining wisdom. So she took some of its fruit and ate it; and she also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.c

DRA Genesis 3:6 And the woman saw that the tree was good to eat, and fair to the eyes, and delightful to behold: and she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave to her husband who did eat.

NOV Genesis 3:6 Vidit igitur mulier quod bonum esset lignum ad vescendum et pulchrum oculis et desiderabile esset lignum ad intellegendum; et tulit de fructu illius et comedit deditque etiam viro suo secum, qui comedit.

VUClem Genesis 3:6 Vidit igitur mulier quod bonum esset lignum ad vescendum, et pulchrum oculis, aspectuque delectabile: et tulit de fructu illius, et comedit: deditque viro suo, qui comedit.
 
In Jeff Cavins “Great Adventure” series he interprets the stain of original sin as belonging to Adam as God charged him with tending and protecting the Garden- he didn’t by allowing the serpent in to tempt Eve- he didn’t by taking a bite of the fruit- it was he that commited the sin- he was supposed to be in charge and to follow God’s command.
 
I haven’t read the Jewish Genesis commentaries recently. I’d only add to the conversation that the Jews know how at least some Christians make a big deal of “original sin” but the Jews don’t seem to buy into it. They also don’t seem to react to the vague reference to the Saviour being promised.

But, I’ll check around. There are comments about Adam and Eve that show up unexpectedly all over the place.

The Jews do make special note that it was a dietary regulation that was broken.
 
John7 said:
i think they get it from the red above, a prep. 3-person Fem sing. > ‘with her’> עִמָּהּ
some translations, not all, throw in a relative plus ‘was’ > ‘who was with her’.

The 18 other times that form (with those vowels) occurs in OT its always just ‘with her’.

i don’t know though if it means:
  1. ‘gave to Adam right there with her at the moment she ate at the tree’. -or-
  2. ‘gave to Adam at a later time when with her’?? 🤷
    meaning, is there a space of time between when she ate and when she gave…
    i’ve always understood it to read like 2.
All that’s really there is: 3.6 ‘and gave also unto her husband with her.’
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Thanks all for your replies.

John 7:
I agree with your option 2. The way the conversation is narrated leads me to believe that as well.

I didn’t look at the amount of instances for that word :o

Will need to do that 🙂

Thank you!
 
rdscheirer said:
In Jeff Cavins “Great Adventure” series he interprets the stain of original sin as belonging to Adam as God charged him with tending and protecting the Garden- he didn’t by allowing the serpent in to tempt Eve- he didn’t by taking a bite of the fruit- it was he that commited the sin- he was supposed to be in charge and to follow God’s command.
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Right there.

While we are not clear on who told Eve about the forbidden tree, we are left to assume (or interpret) that it was Adam. Eve obviously showed knowledge of the prohibition but was not strong enough in her stance. We are also left to assume (or interpret) that the serpent chose to talk to Eve, instead of Adam, because he was aware of her weakness. Big maybe here, because we really don’t know: but the serpent probably knew that the same argument would not have been as successful with Adam, since he heard the command from God.

Eve also stated: “God who said”, not “God told me…”. Still very vague and not really convincing one way or the other.

Also God told Adam to not eat from the tree. God never said anything about touching it.

Eve stated that God said “you shall not eat from it and not touch it”.

Thanks.
 
Father Stan Fortunate gave a talk in California at a spiritual renewal conference. His tape was recorded live, not that it matters, but I just happened to be there and see him in person. Some folks don’t care for his charisma or Brooklyn accent. I love his style.
The tape that you can probably still buy is entitled
In Memory of Me.
I always thought we were to understand that Adam should have protected Eve from her sin.
Fr. Stan’s two points of the sins in the garden are:
  1. The fact that Eve actually had a CONVERSATION with the serpent Genesis 3:4 was her sin. Her mouth and conscience should have stopped her 3:3 “we are not to eat of the fruit of this tree or even touch it” but 3:4 represents us when we have a conversation with the Evil One and justify why WE are about to commit a sin. We all do it. We need to learn to follow our conscience, that first thought…
  2. God asked Adam in Genesis 3:8 “Where are you?” God knew where Adam was but he wanted Adam to examine his conscience, not actually asking where Adam is physically, but where do you stand with Me spiritually?
 
In addition to Gen 3:6 telling us that Adam was with Eve the entire time, the serpents words indicate that he was talking to both of them. In Hebrew, the serpent is speaking in a tense that something like “second-person-plural” (which doesn’t show up in the English translation). When he says “you” he is effectively saying “you guys” or "y"all .

The implication is that Adam was frozen with fear when faced with the dragon.
 
ryanoneil said:
In addition to Gen 3:6 telling us that Adam was with Eve the entire time, the serpents words indicate that he was talking to both of them. In Hebrew, the serpent is speaking in a tense that something like “second-person-plural” (which doesn’t show up in the English translation). When he says “you” he is effectively saying “you guys” or "y"all .

The implication is that Adam was frozen with fear when faced with the dragon.
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Scott Hahn has this in one of his books, but I can’t think of which one it is right now. Maybe someone else knows?
 
Isaiah45_9 said:
Gen 3:6
Would also like to hear from our Jewish friends and know their interpretation of the fall.
Jose
Click to expand...
**For an explanation of the Jewish interpretation, suggest reading the great, (late), Jewish philosopher, Martin Buber’s work, “Good and Evil”. I promise, you’ll never look at it tha same, again.
While you’re at it, his “I and Thou” isn’t bad either.

Blessed Lent, Glorious Easter.
Jason**
 
babygirl6152 said:
Father Stan Fortunate gave a talk in California at a spiritual renewal conference. His tape was recorded live, not that it matters, but I just happened to be there and see him in person. Some folks don’t care for his charisma or Brooklyn accent. I love his style.
The tape that you can probably still buy is entitled
In Memory of Me.
I always thought we were to understand that Adam should have protected Eve from her sin.
Fr. Stan’s two points of the sins in the garden are:
  1. The fact that Eve actually had a CONVERSATION with the serpent Genesis 3:4 was her sin. Her mouth and conscience should have stopped her 3:3 “we are not to eat of the fruit of this tree or even touch it” but 3:4 represents us when we have a conversation with the Evil One and justify why WE are about to commit a sin. We all do it. We need to learn to follow our conscience, that first thought…
  2. God asked Adam in Genesis 3:8 “Where are you?” God knew where Adam was but he wanted Adam to examine his conscience, not actually asking where Adam is physically, but where do you stand with Me spiritually?
Click to expand...
I really appreciate your number 2. “God knew where Adam was but He wanted Adam to examine his conscience, not actually asking where Adam is physically, but where do you stand with Me spiritually.”

I always thought that God’s question had something more to do with Adam’s sin than playing hide-and-seek. Adam’s spiritual relationship, where he stood with God, is the foundation.
 
Thanks for your responses, will definitely check your references. Also please understand that I am not making an excuse for Adam.

I am cross referencing translations. And I just don’t feel comfortable “assuming” a meaning.

God Bless,

Jose
 
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