Was Baha'u'llah a Saint ?

[Servant19]

What I’m telling you is that if you and Tonyfish left, I doubt another question would come up about the Baha’i in YEARS. :nope:

So, here’s my question: since you have a nice forum of your own, why not devote yourself to explaining and defending your faith there instead of here?

I’m sure you’ll say you do both, but isn’t the REAL reason you are here is to promote your faith on a high-traffic website in the hopes of converting a few (or creating Google links)? :sad_yes:

Dear Randy

My purpose here is to assist Catholics towards removing prejudice from their hearts.

In 2 pages of this thread, never mind the other 50 threads, I have had to clear up judgements made on my Faith which are not true.

Would you not feel you would need to do the same if Bahais were doing that of Catholicism?

The secondary reason I am here is to learn and to engage in philosophical and metaphysical dialogue. Yes I present a Bahai perspective but I strive to avoid mentioning the word Bahai and its derivatives if I possibly can. If questions arise then it is my duty to answer them.

Is what I am doing harmful?

If so I will happily stop all my secondary stuff, and focus on the rare occasions that Bahai misconceptions are raised

I mean no offence to anyone here…

.

 

[eddie_too]

i do not object to those of other faiths taking the time to explain their faiths in these forums.

however, the bahai who post here are not defending their faith. they are attacking the RC faith.

for example, the bahai teach that Jesus is not the Second Person of the Holy Trinity.

they teach that Jesus’ body was not raised from the dead and that His tomb was empty the morning of the third day.

they teach that the faith brought to us by Jesus is inadequate for today’s generation.

they teach that God is NOT Three Persons.

they teach that there is no resurrection of the body.

they teach that the Holy Eucharist is the not Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ.

they teach that the seven sacraments instituted by Jesus Christ are not needed by human beings.

they teach that the pope is NOT infallible in matters of faith and morals.

they teach that Jesus is only a manifestation of God and does not fully possess the Divine Nature as the infinite and eternal Son of God.

they teach that the RCC was only intended to have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit until Bahaullah started writing his tens of thousands of pages.

they teach that Jesus did not offer an infinite sacrifice that atoned for our sins and made it possible for every human being who believed in Jesus to gain eternal life.

they teach that mankind is not born in to the sin of adam.

there are other things they teach that are opposed to the teachings of Jesus.

these teachings are all diametrically opposed to the teachings of Jesus 'Christ and His Church.

they teach that without the writings of Bahaullah something bad will happen to mankind. they do not tell us what that bad might be, but they assure us that the teachings of Bahaullah are essential if mankind is to avoid this undefined bad thing from happening.

they teach that bahuallah changed things but they cannot explain how or why change was needed.

they teach that the bahai religion wants to create a one world government.

based on what adherents have written in these forums, it seems to me that the bahai religion is primarily concerned with this world. that may be because they see no need for human beings to be saved from the sins that enslave them.

on the other hand, they more or less agree with the RC faith that God is infinite and eternal. they also agree with the RC faith on its teaching that people should do good and avoid evil.

but, they do not explain that those are the few instances where the RC and the bahai teachings agree.

instead they repeatedly try to tell RCs that the writers of the new testament did not mean the tomb was empty or that they touched the Risen Christ or that they fed the Risen Christ with ordinary human food.

sometimes they claim that the apostles were fooled in to believing the tomb was empty and that they had touched the Lord and eaten with Him.

 

[eddie_too]

I think the bahai do not understand the RC theology of sanctity. I suspect that the bahai will assure you that Bahaullah was a saint even though they do not agree with the RCC’s teachings on sanctification, eternal life, original sin, personal sin, Christ’s atonement, human salvation and heaven and hell.

since all of the above RC teachings are integral to the RC concept of saint, any assurance from a bahai that Bahaullah was a saint is essentially meaningless.

 

[Marie5890]

I know nothing of Baha’u’llah so I did a very brief and quick search

I read that he taught that that all religion is of God. I stopped there.

If it is true that he taught that, that was enough for me.
I am a former Mormon. Mormonism is not of God. It’s born of the male ego of Joseph Smith.

Many religion are born of human egos (and most often, male). Those religions are not of God

 

[Randy_Carson]

Dear Randy

My purpose here is to assist Catholics towards removing prejudice from their hearts.

In 2 pages of this thread, never mind the other 50 threads, I have had to clear up judgements made on my Faith which are not true.

Would you not feel you would need to do the same if Bahais were doing that of Catholicism?

The secondary reason I am here is to learn and to engage in philosophical and metaphysical dialogue. Yes I present a Bahai perspective but I strive to avoid mentioning the word Bahai and its derivatives if I possibly can. If questions arise then it is my duty to answer them.

Is what I am doing harmful?

Since Baha’i believe in a false idea of God, ANYTHING that leads someone to accept that faith is harmful.

If so I will happily stop all my secondary stuff, and focus on the rare occasions that Bahai misconceptions are raised.

I mean no offence to anyone here…

You have been cordial and polite. By design. You are a missionary, and from what I have read TODAY at your own forum, you know very well that you must be tactful when dialoguing with Catholics (or anyone of another faith).

Clever.

Tell you what. Try NOT posting for a month. Come back and see how many Baha’i threads are still active.

If there are lots of folks inquiring about or posting false ideas of your faith, then feel free to post away.

If there is silence on the subject, do not break it.

Fair enough?

 

[ProdigalSun]

Was Baha’u’llah a Saint ?

Of course he was not. A Saint refers to one who is in Heaven with God. "The one True GOD’

While this man Baha was on earth he was just a regular man with all the failings of any other man touched with original sin.

Who knows where he is now. If he is with The Eternal Father then he could be a saint now. But I guarantee he would be very sad about what he started here on earth.

 

[Techno2000]

But I guarantee he would be very sad about what he started here on earth.

Right, thats whole point of all my post that I have been making, is that a lot of people are being deceived by this Religion.

 

[Sen_McGlinn]

Do the Baha’i have a forum where Catholics can go and post dozens of endless threads about the truth of Catholicism?

Turnabout is fair play, right?

Yes, there is a forum for that: Bahai Forums at
bahaiforums.com/forums.php

for the past couple of years there has not been a well-informed Catholic voice on the forum, so if anyone feels moved to register and participate, that would be most welcome.

If anyone is serious about participating in inter-religious discussion with the Bahais on that forum, I suggest that they “friend” Yeshua and send him an internal message. Yeshua is the well-informed Catholic whose contribution is missed.

 

[Sen_McGlinn]

Of course he was not. A Saint refers to one who is in Heaven with God. "The one True GOD’
… Who knows where he is now. If he is with The Eternal Father then he could be a saint now.

I think the question was aimed at knowing whether Catholics who are interested in inter-religious dialogue, could fit Baha’u’llah (and important figures in other religious communities) into the Catholic conceptual framework as “saints” outside the church. I gather from your answer that this is not possible, as one only knows that someone is a Saint if the Church has made a determination.

The Bahai situation is just the opposite: since we know there are numerous prophets, saints and Manifestations of God whose names and stories are not recorded in scripture, there is a category available in which newly encountered religious figures can be fitted. For example, there are Bahais in North America who treat Dekhandwanda (sp?) as a founder of religion. After all, one could hardly imagine that God would have left all the inhabitants of two continents without spiritual guidance until the arrival of the missions, so there must be some prophets/saints/founders in the new world.

 

[ProdigalSun]

I think the question was aimed at knowing whether Catholics who are interested in inter-religious dialogue, could fit Baha’u’llah (and important figures in other religious communities) into the Catholic conceptual framework as “saints” outside the church. I gather from your answer that this is not possible, as one only knows that someone is a Saint if the Church has made a determination.

The Bahai situation is just the opposite: since we know there are numerous prophets, saints and Manifestations of God whose names and stories are not recorded in scripture, there is a category available in which newly encountered religious figures can be fitted. For example, there are Bahais in North America who treat Dekhandwanda (sp?) as a founder of religion. After all, one could hardly imagine that God would have left all the inhabitants of two continents without spiritual guidance until the arrival of the missions, so there must be some prophets/saints/founders in the new world.

Oh! Why is that? Christ told us to go evangelize the world and that is what the “Church” has done. As there is no other God than the one Triune God then it goes without saying that the truth of God was not really apparent in most of the world until after Christ was encountered there though the church. This of course does not mean that all is lost for these souls as the mercy of God extends to them also. If they were to follow the natural law placed on their hearts by the Father it is indeed possible that they could also make it to heaven through the on great sacrifice. This is up to God however and I nor anyone else can say what happens to anygiven soul after death. With the caveat of the Church able to discern and name Saints.

God Bless:thumbsup:

 

[Servant19]

Since Baha’i believe in a false idea of God, ANYTHING that leads someone to accept that faith is harmful.

You have been cordial and polite. By design. You are a missionary, and from what I have read TODAY at your own forum, you know very well that you must be tactful when dialoguing with Catholics (or anyone of another faith).

Clever.

Tell you what. Try NOT posting for a month. Come back and see how many Baha’i threads are still active.

If there are lots of folks inquiring about or posting false ideas of your faith, then feel free to post away.

If there is silence on the subject, do not break it.

Fair enough?

Sounds fair, but let me first clear up all the hundreds of prejudiced comments on this Baha’i thread, which I did not start, nor the other one about Ishmael which seems to be filled with school ground kids mocking the African guy in 1950’s America

.

 

[Servant19]

I know nothing of Baha’u’llah so I did a very brief and quick search

I read that he taught that that all religion is of God. I stopped there.

If it is true that he taught that, that was enough for me.
I am a former Mormon. Mormonism is not of God. It’s born of the male ego of Joseph Smith.

Many religion are born of human egos (and most often, male). Those religions are not of God

No Baha’is do not consider Joseph Smith as a Prophet or a Manifestation of God.

The Baha’i Faith does not state that ALL religions are of God, it points to the major global religions founded by Krishna, Zoroaster, Buddha, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah as all being from God.

I would like you show me where the human ego exists in the Baha’i religion please…

.

 

[Darryl_B]

Right, thats whole point of all my post that I have been making, is that a lot of people are being deceived by this Religion.

Statistically it is a very minor insignificant group, though if you were to read the “non-catholic religions” forum you would think they were quite substantial though not formidable.

 

[Servant19]

Of course he was not. A Saint refers to one who is in Heaven with God. "The one True GOD’

While this man Baha was on earth he was just a regular man with all the failings of any other man touched with original sin.

Who knows where he is now. If he is with The Eternal Father then he could be a saint now. But I guarantee he would be very sad about what he started here on earth.

Can you point out some of the failings of Baha’u’llah which were not shared by Jesus too?

Thankyou.

.

 

[Servant19]

Statistically it is a very minor insignificant group, though if you were to read the “non-catholic religions” forum you would think they were quite substantial though not formidable.

This indeed is true

The Holy Spirit is only one, statistically insignificant, yet boy is it substantial

.

 

[Darryl_B]

This indeed is true

The Holy Spirit is only one, statistically insignificant, yet boy is it substantial

.

Throw a legitimate statement into a washing machine switch it on to maxi wash and what comes out the end of the cycle is this wishy washy type statement.

 

[Darryl_B]

Can you point out some of the failings of Baha’u’llah which were not shared by Jesus too?

Thankyou.

.

Did Bahaullah bait argument as you are doing. Jesus Christ didn’t, He was always the subject of baiting.

 

[Servant19]

Did Bahaullah bait argument as you are doing. Jesus Christ didn’t, He was always the subject of baiting.

Could you please show me where I have been “baiting” argument?

The question was “Was Baha’u’llah a Saint?”, did He live in poverty like Jesus"

I answered yes, He did, and gave an example.

This was then followed with the post

The only problem is that nobody has ever heard of Bab and Baha’u’llah and the few followers that do only write their spin about them.

Please show me where I baited argument?
Then please show me how the popularity of Baha’u’llah has anything to do with his saintly character…

Unless you yourself are trying to bait here now?

God bless you

.

 

[Linusthe2nd]

Yes dear friend, just as Christ is the founder of a heretical sect of Judaism which itself is a heretical sect of the ancient Egyptian religions.



.

You have been duped, just read the Bible.

Linus2nd

 

[Servant19]

You have been duped, just read the Bible.

Linus2nd

If you’re referring to my reference to ancient Egyptian religions I know judaism didn’t spring from them.

It was added to maintain sentence synergy.

But there is no doubt that Christianity was considered a heretical sect of Judaism.

.