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nancy_dalrymple
Guest
When Christ was concived by the Holy Spirit before he was born,why did he need the Holy Spirit to decend on him at baptism? Thank You Nancy.
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When Christ was concived by the Holy Spirit before he was born,why did he need the Holy Spirit to decend on him at baptism? Thank You Nancy.
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passus
Guest
Where did you get that He “needed” the Holy Spirit to descend upon Him?
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nancy_dalrymple
Guest
Luke:3:21 Luke:4:1
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passus
Guest
Again, where do you get that He “needed” the Holy Spirit to descend upon Him? These verses simply say that the Holy Spirit did descend and in the case of the latter verse, filled Him.
Luke 3:21Now when all the people were baptized, and when Jesus also had been baptized and was praying, the heaven was opened,
Luke 4:1And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan, and was led by the Spirit
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nancy_dalrymple
Guest
Thank You but I still dont see why if he was born of the Spirit why the Holy Spirit decended on him,and that was the start of his ministry wasn’t it?
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passus
Guest
Yes, Jesus’s baptism in the Jordan is considered to be the beginning of His earthly ministry.
As to the significance of the descent of the Holy Spirit upon Jesus, let’s consult Aquinas.
III, Q. 39, art. viSumma Theologiae
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DRIVING_BEAR
Guest
Because One of Jesus functions was that of a priest and according to the law of Moses when a new priest began his duties he had to wash and his father must be present
see
Lev 16:32 And the priest, who shall be anointed and who shall be consecrated to be priest in his father’s stead, shall make the atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, even the holy garments:
so God had to be present with Jesus so he could be consecrated as a priest therefore another member of the trinity had to be present
if not Jesus would have violated the law and as a result could not have been a sinless sacrifice for the sins of the human race
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nancy_dalrymple
Guest
Thank You is that antwhere in scriptures? Nancy
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TOME
Guest
Nancy,
I think a good source to answer your question is Pope Benedict’s “Jesus of Nazareth”. St Thomas is good (great) but he is St Thomas and can be a little difficult to follow.
Using the thoughts of our Holy Father, Christ’s baptism has to be understood the the context of his ministry/mission therefore must be understood in light of his paschal sacrifice and the Resurrection, in other words seen in the light of the Paschal Mystery.
Also, if you study all the gospels you will find that Jesus was very focus on his ministry and its relationship to the Kingdom of God. He would not deviate from this and became almost angry when any of his followers would suggest something that was other than what he was called to do in regards to the Kingdom (“Get behind me Satan…” is an example).
Probably a very good illustration why he never used the powers he had until his baptism was the Wedding Feast at Cana. Even though he did performed a mircle his actions came after he strongly reminded his mother that he was here for one purpose only and any action that she may want if it would somehow cloud the reason of his being and mission was wrong.
So the answer I guess, after all this babbling, is his powers were not limited until his Baptism but were unnecessary.
I think a good source to answer your question is Pope Benedict’s “Jesus of Nazareth”. St Thomas is good (great) but he is St Thomas and can be a little difficult to follow.
Using the thoughts of our Holy Father, Christ’s baptism has to be understood the the context of his ministry/mission therefore must be understood in light of his paschal sacrifice and the Resurrection, in other words seen in the light of the Paschal Mystery.
Also, if you study all the gospels you will find that Jesus was very focus on his ministry and its relationship to the Kingdom of God. He would not deviate from this and became almost angry when any of his followers would suggest something that was other than what he was called to do in regards to the Kingdom (“Get behind me Satan…” is an example).
Probably a very good illustration why he never used the powers he had until his baptism was the Wedding Feast at Cana. Even though he did performed a mircle his actions came after he strongly reminded his mother that he was here for one purpose only and any action that she may want if it would somehow cloud the reason of his being and mission was wrong.
So the answer I guess, after all this babbling, is his powers were not limited until his Baptism but were unnecessary.
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DRIVING_BEAR
Guest
Nancy
maybe this will help I think this is what you wanted
Christ as Priest see
Heb 4:14 Having then a great high priest, who hath passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession.
Heb 4:15 For we have not a high priest that cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but one that hath been in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
Heb 5:5 So Christ also glorified not himself to be made a high priest, but he that spake unto him, Thou art my Son, This day have I begotten thee:
Heb 5:6 as he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever After the order of Melchizedek.
Heb 6:20 whither as a forerunner Jesus entered for us, having become a high priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.
Heb 9:11 But Christ having come a high priest of the good things to come, through the greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this creation,
As for washing see
Exo 30:20 When they go into the tabernacle of the congregation, they shall wash with water, that they die not; or when they come near to the altar to minister, to burn offering made by fire unto the LORD:
Exo 30:21 So they shall wash their hands and their feet, that they die not: and it shall be a statute for ever to them, even to him and to his seed throughout their generations.
I hope this is what you wanted if not reply or PM me
maybe this will help I think this is what you wanted
Christ as Priest see
Heb 4:14 Having then a great high priest, who hath passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession.
Heb 4:15 For we have not a high priest that cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but one that hath been in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
Heb 5:5 So Christ also glorified not himself to be made a high priest, but he that spake unto him, Thou art my Son, This day have I begotten thee:
Heb 5:6 as he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever After the order of Melchizedek.
Heb 6:20 whither as a forerunner Jesus entered for us, having become a high priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.
Heb 9:11 But Christ having come a high priest of the good things to come, through the greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this creation,
As for washing see
Exo 30:20 When they go into the tabernacle of the congregation, they shall wash with water, that they die not; or when they come near to the altar to minister, to burn offering made by fire unto the LORD:
Exo 30:21 So they shall wash their hands and their feet, that they die not: and it shall be a statute for ever to them, even to him and to his seed throughout their generations.
I hope this is what you wanted if not reply or PM me
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Crimson_Seraph
Guest
I think you need to also realize that according to Phillipians 2:5-8
“Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus,
who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.
Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.”
Jesus when he took upon himself flesh, limited his own power and gave up his right to act independantly as God apart from the Father and the Holy Spirit. Thus, in order to do the miracles that he did he had to be filled with the Holy Spirit just like we, as his followers must. That’s how I’ve come to look at it anyway.
“Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus,
who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.
Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.”
Jesus when he took upon himself flesh, limited his own power and gave up his right to act independantly as God apart from the Father and the Holy Spirit. Thus, in order to do the miracles that he did he had to be filled with the Holy Spirit just like we, as his followers must. That’s how I’ve come to look at it anyway.
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NotWorthy
Guest
Jesus and the Holy Spirit are Two of the Three Persons in one. For this reason, They are never apart.
Therefore, Jesus did not NEED the Holy Spirit to descend on Him, nor were His powers ever limited.
All of this was for our benefit, for our mortal little minds cannot grasp the Full Truth of God and His Ways.
Therefore, Jesus did not NEED the Holy Spirit to descend on Him, nor were His powers ever limited.
All of this was for our benefit, for our mortal little minds cannot grasp the Full Truth of God and His Ways.
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puzzleannie
Guest
he needed nothing, he did not need baptism, or confirmation. We, and his followers, needed to see him first humble himself to go to John for baptism, as he would later humble himself on the cross, and to see and hear God’s proclamation about his divinity and understand the trinitarian presence this event is about. It was done for our benefit, not His.
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