Was Michelangelo gay?

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PietroPaolo said:
Then we have your definition of the term ‘gay’ - a man with predominant sexual attraction to other men, regardless of whether he acts upon that attraction. I’m not sure I’d agree with you as your definition fails to distinguish between those embracing a lifestyle that celebrates those attractions from those who may struggle with SSA, but who reject those temptations and live chastely. It seems ‘gay’ is more fitting to the former, while another term, perhaps same sex tempted, would be better for the latter. As engaging in homosexual acts is gravely immoral, it seems important to distinguish between these groups, e.g. we wouldn’t group as ‘murders’ both those who unlawfully killed another person and those who are tempted to kill someone.

If we distinguish between the two groups and look at Michelangelo or Newman it is clear that neither was ‘gay’ as neither, from the evidence we have, actively lived a lifestyle which affirmed homosexual acts as good - in fact it is almost certain both men held the exact opposite opinion. If we take your definition without my further distinction, we still have no evidence to label either man with the term, emotional letters notwithstanding. Either way, we cannot conclude that Michelangelo (or Newman) was ‘gay.’
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The term describes sexual and romantic orientation, actions are irrelevant to it. That’s a terrible analogy a) because they are different enough to be a false analogy, b) because it is uncharitable and c) making foolish analogies like that decrease the odds of actually saving some while yielding zero benefit elsewhere.
  1. That’s moving the goal posts,
  2. See my first post in the thread
PietroPaolo said:
Based on the historical evidence we have (Michelangelo’s art and poems, Newman’s letters) we cannot establish that either man had predominant sexual attraction to the same sex, which, as you admit, is a necessary condition for being ‘gay.’ Therefore, neither man can be classed as ‘gay.’
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True, but due to a lack of evidence either way not due to proving the heterosexuality.

Honestly the whole applying anachronistic concepts is often an exercise in futility and in this case is definitely so. If people want a “gay saint” they should be working on a cause for Henri Nouwen.
 
StJudeprayforme said:
No disagreement from me. Like I said, I find historical reconstruction of people’s sexual orientation to largely be pointless. Do I think it is possible that either one of these men to have experienced some of the phenomena that we now associate with “being gay”? Sure, because I don’t think that these are things that just appeared in the 19th and 20th centuries.

I am not claiming that either was “gay” or had a “predominant attraction”. Simply that as people living over a hundred years removed from Newman, and more from Michelangelo, we honestly have no idea of what they felt beyond what is revealed in their writings, and because of this, I find people who make claims either way regarding their orientation to be a bit silly. They both appear to have been exceptionally chaste, beyond that I don’t really know.
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👍

I think we’ve answered the OP’s question, there isn’t enough evidence to say anything beyond Michelangelo lived a chaste life. I never argued for his heterosexuality, simply that it is ridiculous to claim he was ‘gay’ off the evidence we have.
 
Dakota_Roberts said:
Honestly the whole applying anachronistic concepts is often an exercise in futility and in this case is definitely so. If people want a “gay saint” they should be working on a cause for Henri Nouwen.
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It seems to me not only anachronistic but an injustice to try to attribute current sexual ‘orientation’ categories to people long dead. They have no way to respond and would likely not even understand the question. Besides, being “gay” in the modern sense is pretty much a 20th century invention.
 
WildCatholic said:
I’ve heard that Michaelangelo was gay in orientation, but lived with almost “the chastity of a monk” according to one churchmen (I wish I could find the source, but I can’t). So my thought is this. He probably wasn’t, but IF he was it sounds like he followed the church teaching in that he had SSA, but did not engage in homosexual acts.

BTW, I agree that all this historical revisionism on who was gay and who was not is pretty silly. I think its because we oversexualize the culture. For example, there are many writers who never married and because they had close friendships with those of the same sex, they were seen as being “gay”. Sadly I’ve even heard this about Cardinal Newman, the poet and Jesuit Gerard Manley Hopkins, and a few other churchmen. I think its hogwash. People today don’t get that some people just aren’t interested, or in some cases actually give up sex and that if you aren’t you are strange. This even affects middle school aged kids. How many times have people been called “gay” simply because they don’t have a relationship of the opposite sex. What’s sad is now the media pushes this agenda and some otherwise good folks who just aren’t interested in relationships might think they are gay and end up in sin.

Sorry for the rant, but I just hate that people assume that so many historical figures were gay. Seriously, if they were we’d here about in documents at the time.
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About Hopkins…there is substantial credibility for the idea he was attracted to men. There was, for example, a fellow male student he had an intense friendship with at Oxford whom his Anglican confessor at one point forbade him to see. Nevertheless, there is every indication that he never acted on his desires in spite of intense struggle with them. I think that, in this case, God tests those whom he wishes most strongly to draw to himself, and though it was hard going, Hopkins certainly passed the test.
 
Personally I could care less whether or not some historical figure experienced sexual temptations toward the same sex. What I care about is how well they lived a life of virtue.
 
has anyone proposed hosing down the Sistine Chapel if his gayness is confirmed?
 
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