Was the Catholic Church involved with the Nazis?

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The answer to the question is a YES. Anyone willing to examine this unholy chapter of church history can start with the volume by Karlheinz Deschner titled God and the Fascists, the Vatican alliance with Mussolini, Franco and Hitler. Available online. For those who like to think of the church as the pure creation of Christ, it makes unpleasant reading!
 
The answer to the question is a YES. Anyone willing to examine this unholy chapter of church history can start with the volume by Karlheinz Deschner titled God and the Fascists, the Vatican alliance with Mussolini, Franco and Hitler. Available online. For those who like to think of the church as the pure creation of Christ, it makes unpleasant reading!
Yes, unpleasant reading, as is “Hitler’s Pope”; but fortunately not the ONLY reading on the subject. Several other, recent books concerning the topic reject the notion that the Church, particularly the Pope and certain bishops, were negatively implicated with Hitler and the Nazi regime. In fact, it has been found to be just the opposite, and some of the writers are Jewish historians.
 
Yes, unpleasant reading, as is “Hitler’s Pope”; but fortunately not the ONLY reading on the subject. Several other, recent books concerning the topic reject the notion that the Church, particularly the Pope and certain bishops, were negatively implicated with Hitler and the Nazi regime. In fact, it has been found to be just the opposite, and some of the writers are Jewish historians.
Hence, as I always say, reading must be done in the round - from all perspectives. To create a well rounded and informed opinion.
 
A good place to start in seeking information is here. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rescue_of_Jews_by_Catholics_during_the_Holocaust
Rescue of Jews by Catholics during the Holocaust.

I notice down the page there is a mention of Monsignor Hugh O’Flaherty. who bravely rescued so many Jews. Anyone who has seen the film “The Scarlet and the Black” will remember Gregory Peck’s portrayal of him.

It also briefly refers to Edith Stein, the Catholic saint who was of Jewish heritage.
 
The issue is specifics. The Church had to deal with the fact that the National Socialist, or Nazi, government existed. It sought to protect the rights of Catholics and it sought to learn about humanitarian abuses concerning everyone, not just Catholics. The Pope spoke when he had the facts. In the United States, for example, Hitler was viewed in a benign way for a while. What eventually occurred as time passed is not as simple as some think. Eugenics, which started in America, was adopted by the Nazis. I watched a newsreel where German doctors measured the skull of a seated untermensch or sub-human. In the United States, it became legal to sterilize those with certain “defects” without their consent.

Ed
 
Hence, as I always say, reading must be done in the round - from all perspectives. To create a well rounded and informed opinion.
Out of the 130 million books written, how do you know that what you have chosen to read is “from all perspectives”?
 
Out of the 130 million books written, how do you know that what you have chosen to read is “from all perspectives”?
Don’t. But I read, in the areas that interest me, from all perspectives I can locate, garnering clues from the sources and bibliographies in the books I do collect. And that’s what I recommend. I spent 4 years working in the rare/OP book business, (and 10+ in the shiny new book business) and, of course, dealt with such folks in my 60 years of book collecting, esp. starting in 1964. But I don’t do that much any more. I deal with in print books, or from used book sources that don’t require me to shop on line, which limits the selection. I hate to shop on line. So, in theory I could chase down more of them. But I rarely do that these days.Which is probably for the best, given the lack of shelf/floor space still available to me.

Only 130 million? I’m doing better than I thought. Will order 2 more tomorrow. Which brings the total holdings to (best guess) around 30,000.
 
Don’t. But I read, in the areas that interest me, from all perspectives I can locate, garnering clues from the sources and bibliographies in the books I do collect. And that’s what I recommend. I spent 4 years working in the rare/OP book business, (and 10+ in the shiny new book business) and, of course, dealt with such folks in my 60 years of book collecting, esp. starting in 1964. But I don’t do that much any more. I deal with in print books, or from used book sources that don’t require me to shop on line, which limits the selection. I hate to shop on line. So, in theory I could chase down more of them. But I rarely do that these days.Which is probably for the best, given the lack of shelf/floor space still available to me.

Only 130 million? I’m doing better than I thought. Will order 2 more tomorrow. Which brings the total holdings to (best guess) around 30,000.
Yes, paper books with real names and published by reputable companies. As a professional researcher, I can only thank God for the ability to find books quickly and to sort the good from the useless.

A former book dealer filled his home and converted his garage to hold the overflow. I bought items I still treasure from him.

Ed
 
Yes, unpleasant reading, as is “Hitler’s Pope”; but fortunately not the ONLY reading on the subject. Several other, recent books concerning the topic reject the notion that the Church, particularly the Pope and certain bishops, were negatively implicated with Hitler and the Nazi regime. In fact, it has been found to be just the opposite, and some of the writers are Jewish historians.
In common with all large institutions, we have seen recently how the church acted in typical ‘institutional form’ with the ongoing sexual abuse scandals by putting the institutions reputation before all the values, morals and ideals it is meant to represent. Such is the nature of corruption. Similarly, during the war years, in the attempt to maintain its properties, cashflow and institutional framework, compromised itself across a broad front. All other considerations pale to insignificance.
 
In common with all large institutions, we have seen recently how the church acted in typical ‘institutional form’ with the ongoing sexual abuse scandals by putting the institutions reputation before all the values, morals and ideals it is meant to represent. Such is the nature of corruption. Similarly, during the war years, in the attempt to maintain its properties, cashflow and institutional framework, compromised itself across a broad front. All other considerations pale to insignificance.
No, they don’t.

Just as the Church’s handling of the sexual abuse scandal has overcome the initial human reticence to take definitive action until the full extent of the problem was understood, so, too, the Church responded “during the war years” with proper moral outrage and definitive action after the initial need to get her bearings on the extent of the problem.

The problem with your “account” of both is that it seems fixed on first impressions and you can’t seem to muster the intellectual rigor or sense of justice to get past those.
 
In common with all large institutions, we have seen recently how the church acted in typical ‘institutional form’ with the ongoing sexual abuse scandals by putting the institutions reputation before all the values, morals and ideals it is meant to represent. Such is the nature of corruption. Similarly, during the war years, in the attempt to maintain its properties, cashflow and institutional framework, compromised itself across a broad front. All other considerations pale to insignificance.
Some of what you say about the nature of large institutions has the ring of truth. But there is one consideration that does NOT “pale to insignificance” with regard to the Church’s role vis-a-vis the Nazi regime, and that is what actually took place within the Church, both during Hitler’s rise to power and during his heyday. With regard to this period, several historians have recently claimed, based on documented evidence, that the Pope and other members of the Church were NOT simply Nazi co-conspirators as previous accounts had labeled them. Likewise, the situation regarding the role of the Church has been found to be much more complex than initially conceived.
 
Yes, paper books with real names and published by reputable companies. As a professional researcher, I can only thank God for the ability to find books quickly and to sort the good from the useless.

A former book dealer filled his home and converted his garage to hold the overflow. I bought items I still treasure from him.

Ed
That former book dealer sound like me. Plus, of course, the garage-sized storage unit.
 
As I was cleaning out my mother’s library I found a book called, “Unholy Trinity” by Mark Aarons and John Loftus. It is about the Vatican, the Nazis, and the Swiss banks. There is mention of Croatia. I am guessing this is a book with a small amount of truth but a lot of falsehood. Certainly around Pius XII. Any thoughts about these authors?
Thank you. Carol
 
As I was cleaning out my mother’s library I found a book called, “Unholy Trinity” by Mark Aarons and John Loftus. It is about the Vatican, the Nazis, and the Swiss banks. There is mention of Croatia. I am guessing this is a book with a small amount of truth but a lot of falsehood. Certainly around Pius XII. Any thoughts about these authors?
Thank you. Carol
There was a big problem with Croatia and the Ustase leadership during WWII. Many Serbian Orthodox were unfairly targeted and placed in brutal concentration camps under the command of a former Catholic clergyman Miroslav Filopovic.
 
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