Was the Virgin Mary wise?

[tonyrey]

Ecclesiastes 1:9 [NIV] (almost … - green edit mine)

What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the thread.

Cute!

 

[tqualey]

Hi, PRmerger,

Are you out there busting bubbles … again … !!!

Hey, if it is not about Angry … most of the malicious and dubious material on this post would have been for naught!

Ultimately, I think God was very pleased with creating Mary to be the Mother of God. And, I really can not think of any Gift that He would hold back and give to His Dear Mother. Of course, not everyone has warm and pleasant thoughts about their Mother - so lashing out at Mothers in general … including the Mother of God … is just par for the course. Sad.

God bless

I’m not sure why you think it would have anything to do with what you said, Angry.

If you follow the trail of posts you’ll notice that not a single post of yours enters this dialogue:

Sometimes it’s not about you at all.

However, do you have an argument with the fact that someone can be fully human and not have sex, ever?

 

[AngryAtheist8]

I’m not sure why you think it would have anything to do with what you said, Angry.

If you follow the trail of posts you’ll notice that not a single post of yours enters this dialogue:

Sometimes it’s not about you at all.

However, do you have an argument with the fact that someone can be fully human and not have sex, ever?

No:shrug:

 

[PRmerger]

No:shrug:

Excellent.

So now we can address this perverted notion of humanity:

No, I was saying that the Virgin Mary was inhuman (or at least not human) because she was perfect (according to the Catholic definition) and therefore did not have the whole range of normal/sinful human thoughts and emotions.

If you believe this paradigm then baptized babies until the age of reason are also not human, because they also don’t sin.

And those with mental deficiencies and disabilities are also inhuman as they also cannot sin.

And those who are sleeping are inhuman because they are not sinning.

And those who are under the anesthesia are inhuman because they are not sinning.

And I, sitting here typing away without committing a single sin, am also inhuman because I am not sinning.

 

[AngryAtheist8]

Excellent.

So now we can address this perverted notion of humanity:

If you believe this paradigm then baptized babies until the age of reason are also not human, because they also don’t sin.

And those with mental deficiencies and disabilities are also inhuman as they also cannot sin.

And those who are sleeping are inhuman because they are not sinning.

And those who are under the anesthesia are inhuman because they are not sinning.

**And I, sitting here typing away without committing a single sin, am also inhuman because I am not sinning. **

Oh I am sure you’re sinning somehow (in thought or deed)
Even if its just Pride at being so virtuous

 

[AngryAtheist8]

Excellent.

So now we can address this perverted notion of humanity:

If you believe this paradigm then baptized babies until the age of reason are also not human, because they also don’t sin.

And those with mental deficiencies and disabilities are also inhuman as they also cannot sin.

And those who are sleeping are inhuman because they are not sinning.

And those who are under the anesthesia are inhuman because they are not sinning.

And I, sitting here typing away without committing a single sin, am also inhuman because I am not sinning.

The thing is, normal human thoughts and feelings are sinful, because they are not focused on God and/or are relatively selfish* (like anger or the sex drive)

*Although self-centered might be a more accurate term.

 

[PRmerger]

Oh I am sure you’re sinning somehow (in thought or deed)
Even if its just Pride at being so virtuous

Are you sure you weren’t raised a Calvinist or a Puritan?

'Cause you’re certainly clueless about sin as Catholics define it.

(Not your fault, of course, about being ignorant about Catholic teaching, esp. if you’re not Catholic. However, it would improve your credibility if you sounded a bit more educated about the faith of those you’re in dialogue with.)

 

[PRmerger]

The thing is, normal human thoughts and feelings are sinful, because they are not focused on God and/or are relatively selfish* (like hunger or the sex drive)

*Although self-centered might be a more accurate term.

Do you have a statement from the Magisterium that teaches this, Angry?

I’d really like to see something that says “hunger is a sin” from the Church.

Or are you confusing Catholicism with, perhaps, some Calvinist paradigm from some other theological discussion you may have been in?

 

[PRmerger]

The thing is, normal human thoughts and feelings are sinful, because they are not focused on God and/or are relatively selfish* (like hunger or the sex drive)

Actually, Angry, I’m going to give you a moment to retract the above statement.

Otherwise you may be reported for “contempt for Catholicism”.

Saying such an absurdity about the Church (“the Church teaches that being hungry is a sin!”) can be construed as, besides being abysmally ignorant, contemptuous.

Just a friendly warning. No need to get Angry, 'kay?

 

[AngryAtheist8]

Actually, Angry, I’m going to give you a moment to retract the above statement.

Otherwise you may be reported for “contempt for Catholicism”.

Saying such an absurdity about the Church (“the Church teaches that being hungry is a sin!”) can be construed as, besides being abysmally ignorant, contemptuous.

Just a friendly warning. No need to get Angry, 'kay?

That was a typo actually:shrug:

But I thank you for pointing it out.
Since its apparently important, I have done as you suggested.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, PRmerger,

I do not know about you sitting there and not sinning … but, I will say that you did not commit any grammatical errors!

God bless

Excellent.

So now we can address this perverted notion of humanity:

If you believe this paradigm then baptized babies until the age of reason are also not human, because they also don’t sin.

And those with mental deficiencies and disabilities are also inhuman as they also cannot sin.

And those who are sleeping are inhuman because they are not sinning.

And those who are under the anesthesia are inhuman because they are not sinning.

And I, sitting here typing away without committing a single sin, am also inhuman because I am not sinning.

 

[PRmerger]

That was a typo actually:shrug:

But I thank you for pointing it out.
Since its apparently important, I have done as you suggested.

You’re cool. (Typo, though? I don’t think so.)

So now to whether anger is a sin.

Have you ever seen the video of Christian Bale getting angry?

Google it–warning: foul language is abundant.

Watch it and then tell me that anger is not sin.

All the things that the Catholic Church says are sins–I defy you to do them and then tell me you have a joyful, peaceful, love-filled life.

 

[PRmerger]

Hi, PRmerger,

I do not know about you sitting there and not sinning … but, I will say that you did not commit any grammatical errors!

God bless

And to me, that’s akin to being in heaven!

 

[AngryAtheist8]

**You’re cool. (Typo, though? I don’t think so.)**So now to whether anger is a sin.

Have you ever seen the video of Christian Bale getting angry?

Google it–warning: foul language is abundant.

Watch it and then tell me that anger is not sin.

All the things that the Catholic Church says are sins–I defy you to do them and then tell me you have a joyful, peaceful, love-filled life.

I don’t think I meant to write hunger.
I was thinking something less automatic (such as gluttony) but like I said it doesn’t matter that much to me. Nevertheless, if I am going to get banned I want it to be because of something I meant to write.

As for your defiance a life without taking pride in anything seems rather horrible to me.

Lust (i.e. sexual attraction, pleasure, and arousal) has a useful place in a normal person’s life too.
Anger can be useful when it motivates us to change things, and I frankly think that anger is sometimes a reasonable response to a situation.
For instance, plenty of pro-lifers think that people should get angry over abortion.

 

[PRmerger]

As for your defiance a life without taking pride in anything seems rather horrible to me.

That’s very Catholic of you to say, Angry.

You must be reading some Calvinist model of Christianity, eh?

Healthy pride nourishes and thrives in holiness.

(Check out the Catechism, paragraph 132)

(i.e. sexual attraction, pleasure, and arousal) has a useful place in a normal person’s life too.

Again, very Catholic of you to say! Have you read Pope JPII’s Theology of the Body, BTW?

Anger can be useful when it motivates us to change things, and I frankly think that anger is sometimes a reasonable response to a situation.
For instance, plenty of pro-lifers think that people should get angry over abortion.

Again, very Catholic of you to say!

You’re on the right track I think, friend!

 

[NeedImprovement]

Fr. Joseph . apparently, in his own words, was a former Protestant minister who converted to Catholicism and became a priest.

He has a blog called FIAT VOLVNTAS TUA .

He also wrote the most popular reply to the question (*raised at Yahoo!.answers, which was *) **Why is the Virgin Mary important to the Roman Catholic Church? , **

Here are the links to the answer , and to his blog FIAT VOLVNTAS TUA .

Below are several excepts from the answer which appear rather apropos for this thread – especially pertaining to the way it has evolved/degenerated.
Fr. Joseph:

People do not realize that to attack the Blessed Mother is to also attack the atoning work of the Father for mankind who sent His only Son for the sins of the world. He was born of a perfect vessel that was fitting for God and the Savior of the world, which was the Blessed Virgin who remained undefiled by man her whole saintly life. It is to her that we look to pattern our devotion to Christ as it is her that led a perfect life of devotion to Her Son, always pointing humanity to Him as the path to Salvation. She is the Mother of the Church …

… It is sad when one becomes so worldly that they cannot even recognize the heavenly and reject the example of the saints who have gone before who have suffered for their faith. Imagine the Blessed Mother of God at the foot of the cross watching her Son being defiled in the most brutal and humiliating way knowing that He is innocent of the charges against Him and deserving of all praise of mankind. It was such a horrible scene that even the followers, except the ladies who followed our Lord and the blessed St. John, were the only ones present at His sacrifice. No one else could bear it …

The Blessed Mother when referred to by our Lord as “woman” relates to her importance in the salvific plan of our father. It is her act of devotion and obedience that crushed the head of the Serpent (Satan) and defeated his plan for the condemnation of man. Sin entered the world through Eve and Satan and sin was defeated by the blessed Mother of our Lord. If she is not in heaven and saved by our Lord then there is no hope for us for none of us can ever reach the devotion and obedience of the one who is called by the angel of God the most blessed among women and consequently the most blessed of all humanity past, present and future. So do not let those who attack our Mother defeat our hope in her Son and His promise for which His sacrifice has provided. May the Lord have mercy on those who do the work of Satan. God bless!

In Christ
Fr. Joseph

 

[BrunoMaria]

To attack the Blessed Mother Holy Mary - means to attack Jesus Christ Himself, as any of us would be deeply hurt, if one’s mother is insulted!

We all are obliged to pay deepest respect to this human woman, who was so highly honored by God, that she even was worthy enough to give birth to the begotten Son of God and was taken up into heaven after Her death, with her human body and crowned as Queen of heaven by God.

She is the most valuable attorney for us before God, which makes us very rich. Let’s ask the most holy of all Holies in heaven, to guide our ways into the one and only right way, that of Jesus Christ who is the one and only way. As I ask Holy Mary every day to lead my deceased son Björn to God.

Yours
Bruno