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Lepanto
Guest
We’re not talking about babies and toddlers…although I have a hard time believing that babies and toddlers can’t go for an hour without food.
Water bottles, cups of coffee, juice boxes at Mass. What's next...beer?
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Bubble
Guest
Oh, there is no question that they can go an hour without food. But, the problem is that babies and toddlers often think that they cannot go an hour without food or drink.
Babies and toddlers want what they want when they want it and don’t care where they are or who they bother in order to get it.
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Catholic90
Guest
I can certainly tell you don’t have children!!
Babies are hungry NOW. Toddlers wind up and get hungry. Neither has a concept of time, so you can’t tell them to WAIT! Especially babies! You can maybe stall for a bit with a pacifier IF they will take one, but as soon as they realize that no food is coming from that, all you get is a mad, hungry baby instead of a hungry baby! Feed the poor kid!
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Leopard
Guest
I don’t know whether that’s correct, but even if it is the celebrant can dispense the deacon of this obligation whenever he chooses.JmCrae wrote,
jmcrae;2871994:
one.
That made sense until THurifer2 said that this doesn’t hold true for deacons.
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OneAugustKnight
Guest
Some people struggle with parenting more than others. The kids can go an hour without food, but won’t tolerate sitting through Mass for an hour without being entertained by food or toys or whatever.
I struggle to have charity toward parents with ill-mannered children. My priest said sometimes things that are easy for me are not easy for other people. That helps with my lack of charity a lot.
I want to apologize for all the years I spent snacking in Mass. I didn’t know anything about being Catholic, wasn’t raised with a religion and didn’t understand what was actually happening at Mass until about a year and a half ago.
For the first 11 years of going Mass, none of the parishoners actually talked to me. For the first half of that I was a very shy teenager, and for the second half was pregnant most of the time. Even last week I slipped and brought a soda to a church meeting because I am pregnant again. And I haven’t received Communion in 3 months because of a combination of morning sickness and inability to restrain my appetite.
Even if I am excused for not knowing, and my sins have been washed away by my Baptism, I still take responsibility for offending or distracting anyone during Mass. It was at best ignorant of me, and at the worst disrespectful. My most sincere apologies, thank you, OP, for giving me something to think about. What would be a good penance for this?
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Lepanto
Guest
This thread was never meant to be about children (as I suggested in the opening post). Obviously, they have special needs that their parents must address, as do the elderly or the sick. That tangent would be getting off-topic, however.
I’m talking about healthy adults who should know better than to snack during Mass. If out of innocent ignorance they are unaware that it is inappropriate, then something else is wrong.
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OneAugustKnight
Guest
Right, I thought you were talking about older children and adults.
I think adults can be kind of oblivious on how to act in church because they grew up hardly going to church services, if at all. We can bring drinks and snacks into our classrooms, stores, movie theaters, meetings, etc. It never occurs to us that we shouldn’t bring our food into a church because there isn’t a “no food and drinks” sign posted on the doors.
So we go in with our frappucino and donut to find out what church is all about, and think it is a good idea because then people won’t wonder why you aren’t saying the Nicene Creed. You have an excuse, your mouth is full.
That about covers my opinion of anyone under 40 snacking during Mass. In the over 40 range it seems bizarre to me when some that age exhibits an extreme lack of morality or manners. At that point I assume they must be hippies who used lots of drugs when they were young.
I agree there is something wrong when so many people don’t know you shouldn’t eat or drink anything during Mass. I understand stuff like that now of course, but it is very frustrating to converts when we do things that stupidly and obviously out of place, and nobody tells us. We find out years later when we read a book or another Catholic complains about someone else doing it.
ETA: I guess it is clear I still am seriously out of place in the Catholic Church:blush:
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LISA_Annette
Guest
You have to be kidding me on the Starbucks coffee, right??? During mass???:tsktsk: I thought the gum chewing I see is bad enough, but now you have just beat that.Am I the only one who sees these things at Mass? (And I’m not talking about milk bottles for the babies.)
This is another abuse that was UNTHINKABLE just a few years ago, but now it’s almost commonplace.
I saw a woman just this morning with a large Starbucks cup (Grande Mocha?) sitting in the fourth pew just slirping away like she was at the theater or something. And forget about the whole communion fast thing…Perhaps she used it to wash the host down too…I don’t know.
I’m all for downing a cold one myself, but can’t it wait? Sheesh!
I love coffee—I need it to get through my day, but if I miss it an hour before mass, then OH WELL, I suffer until I can hit the 7-11 AFTER mass because I don’t want to miss communion because of it.:nope:
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Joannm
Guest
Might I add make sure they go to the bathroom before you leave the house. It is like an epidemic in our church that all these kids have to go to the bathroom during mass. I don’t remember ever getting up out of my seat when I was a kid…except for the few times I felt faint and the usher had to help me outside. (I used to feel faint a lot but that was when we fasted for 3 hours and it was very hot in the church). Also we didn’t go to mass with our parents, we had to go to the school mass without them, and the nuns wouldn’t stand for us moving from our seat for anything except going to communion.
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b_justb
Guest
http://www.zymetrical.com/images/products/beerhelmet.jpg
Man, this homily just keeps getting better and better
Man, this homily just keeps getting better and better
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WanderAimlessly
Guest
I know a number of people would love to do this :whacky:
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Jennifer_J
Guest
Okay, I know it’s not the topic of this thread, I know, I know, however I can’t let it go by without comment (bad me)…I have SIX children (ages 10, 7, 6, 4, 2 and 3 months), and they can all make it through Mass without food or drink. Now the 3 month old occasionally needs to nurse, but if I time it right, he can make it just fine (not so when he was younger, he had to nurse a lot more then). When you give children food/drink at Mass they grow to expect it–thus you get people bringing food/drink into Mass. We don’t even bring toys or books. They are expected to pay as much attention as possible, participate or at least sit relativly quietly. Are they 100% good all the time, NO, but they are learning what being at Mass is about and how to behave. They are not entertained with food and drink because they are bored. Boredom is the WORST reason to eat.
Anyway, that’s been my personal experience. I’m sure having a special needs child would change the dynamic a bit, but I think no food and drink is the optimal way to go for EVERYONE
just my opinion of course.Jennifer
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lizaanne
Guest
Jennifer - that is awesome!!Okay, I know it’s not the topic of this thread, I know, I know, however I can’t let it go by without comment (bad me)…I have SIX children (ages 10, 7, 6, 4, 2 and 3 months), and they can all make it through Mass without food or drink. Now the 3 month old occasionally needs to nurse, but if I time it right, he can make it just fine (not so when he was younger, he had to nurse a lot more then). When you give children food/drink at Mass they grow to expect it–thus you get people bringing food/drink into Mass. We don’t even bring toys or books. They are expected to pay as much attention as possible, participate or at least sit relativly quietly. Are they 100% good all the time, NO, but they are learning what being at Mass is about and how to behave. They are not entertained with food and drink because they are bored. Boredom is the WORST reason to eat.
Anyway, that’s been my personal experience. I’m sure having a special needs child would change the dynamic a bit, but I think no food and drink is the optimal way to go for EVERYONE
Jennifer
I always knew it was possible!I have to wonder - what did people do 30+ years ago? When I was a kid I don’t remember anyone, even the elderly, bringing anything to drink with them to Mass, it would have been an outrage to do such a thing! My Grandfather would have had a fit if it were even suggested!
How has all this changed? What made it suddenly acceptable for adults to find ways to make this suddenly acceptable? It never was before, so why now? Are we just so careless that we make excuses for our own comfort level?
~Liza
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jmcrae
Guest
I’m in my 40s, and when I was growing up, we weren’t allowed to chew gum in school - it would not have even occurred to us to bring food or drink into the classroom. We went home to eat - people didn’t stay at school for lunch.
The only sort of concerts that allowed food and drink were cabarets, where people would sit at tables and listen to amateur musicians - I don’t think it would have occurred to anyone I knew at the time that you can eat standing up, or sitting on a bench - people laid out napkins and cutlery on a proper table before they sat down to eat.
I don’t know what changed - maybe the faster pace of society had something to do with it, but when I was in about my mid-20s, I noticed that people were eating lunch at their desks at work instead of going to the cafeteria, and when I was taking some courses to upgrade recently, I noticed that the college schedule for the full-time students didn’t allow time for a lunch or dinner break - people brought their lunch or their dinner to their noon and evening classes, and ate while they were listening to the lectures - they would run to the cafeteria between classes, buy a sandwich and a drink, and then eat and drink in class. Some of the professors were bothered by this - they felt that people were being rude to them by doing this, but it was reasonable to ask, when are we going to eat, if we don’t eat in class?
I think they still throw you out on your head if you try to bring food and drink into a classical concert, though.
The only sort of concerts that allowed food and drink were cabarets, where people would sit at tables and listen to amateur musicians - I don’t think it would have occurred to anyone I knew at the time that you can eat standing up, or sitting on a bench - people laid out napkins and cutlery on a proper table before they sat down to eat.
I don’t know what changed - maybe the faster pace of society had something to do with it, but when I was in about my mid-20s, I noticed that people were eating lunch at their desks at work instead of going to the cafeteria, and when I was taking some courses to upgrade recently, I noticed that the college schedule for the full-time students didn’t allow time for a lunch or dinner break - people brought their lunch or their dinner to their noon and evening classes, and ate while they were listening to the lectures - they would run to the cafeteria between classes, buy a sandwich and a drink, and then eat and drink in class. Some of the professors were bothered by this - they felt that people were being rude to them by doing this, but it was reasonable to ask, when are we going to eat, if we don’t eat in class?
I think they still throw you out on your head if you try to bring food and drink into a classical concert, though.
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Sarabande
Guest
I don’t see it during mass on Sundays, but last week at a funeral that I was a musician for, a woman got up prior to the funeral mass to say a few words about the deaceased. She brought her water bottle up there with her and took swigs in between paragraphs. The priest or the deacon was not out there yet and I was in the choir loft with the organist. It was before the mass and perhaps she could have had some sort of medical condition or perhaps got nervous and dry mouth when she had to be up there speaking. I know that sometimes priests will keep a glass of water with them for before the homily, especially if they have a cold, and once when I had to cantor for a special mass that literally lasted 3 hours, the priest/sacristans provided a glass of water for me to discreetly take sips if I needed it. I guess it was the water bottle and sucking it down that took me off-guard.Am I the only one who sees these things at Mass? (And I’m not talking about milk bottles for the babies.)
This is another abuse that was UNTHINKABLE just a few years ago, but now it’s almost commonplace.
I saw a woman just this morning with a large Starbucks cup (Grande Mocha?) sitting in the fourth pew just slirping away like she was at the theater or something. And forget about the whole communion fast thing…
The above didn’t really bother me, but this did. I worked at a Catholic church where the new pastor had a lot of “different” ideas about the mass and how it should be celebrated. Masses celebrated by the previous pastor always had a humility and a reverence about them. The new pastor brought with him a very casual atmosphere to the mass, which he implemented by his “entourage”. These were people who were sort of like his groupies and followed him to every new parish he was ever at. They would lector during the mass and ran other things that the real parishioners originally would do. These new lectors would actually show up with a Starbucks coffee in their hands, bring it up with them to the ambo for the readings and take sips while they read. Next thing you know, when the parishioners began to lector as well, you’d see the same kind of behaviour. It wasn’t every week, but you never saw it prior to the new pastor. Then, I started hearing things from some of the female parishioners, who were totally enamored by this pastor, as he was relatively young (40s), attractive and very fit as he was apt to be seen around the area in his muscle shirt and running shorts working out. It was actually a little disturbing hearing this middle-aged women be so googly-eyed about him. These parishioners thought it would be great if this pastor could get the parish “rocking” like a Baptist church. Suddenly everything “old” was bad. I knew I had to leave, as I definitely did not see eye to eye with the new direction. So I fortunately only had to deal with this for about 3 or 4 horrid months.
It just feels that this type of behaviour trickles from the top down. If the priest is allowing it to occur, of course people will think there is nothing wrong with bringing in their food or coffee, etc. In terms of priority, I realize that this is very low on the list and I am fortunate that I rarely if ever have to witness that, but since it was brought up I thought I’d relate a couple stories that I’ve experienced.
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Sarabande
Guest
Well, not on your head, but you’re definitely not allowed to bring it into the concert hall, unless you are attending an outdoor summer festival. Many people will bring their picnic blankets and coolers and will eat and watch. My family loves attending my outdoor opera performances in the summer because they can bring their wine, beer and sandwiches - eating and drinking while enjoying the opera. (The ones who aren’t into opera will get just a little tipsy to actually enjoy it. hahahah!!!
)
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Teelynn
Guest
Not too long ago, I was talking to a Deacon from another Parish. We were discussing this same problem. He was telling me that at many of their masses people (adults) are bringing in all kinds of goodies to mass. His comment was: " What in the world happened to the 1 hour fast before receiving the Eucharist with these people?" When I was growing up we fasted for 3 hours before mass if we were going to communion. That meant water only, and if you were required to take meds at a certain time, of course, that was permissible. When they changed it to the one hour fast, people were under the misconception that it was one hour before receiving communion, not one hour before mass began. Well that mean that you could practically walk out the door to mass and still be eating or drinking something because COMMUNION did not occur until about a half hour into the mass. Shortly after that we learned that in fact you need to fast for one hour BEFORE MASS BEGINS. Now I take nothing but water, (no coffee) AT LEAST one hour before mass ever begins.
Bringing in water bottles is one thing, some probably need them for certain reasons, but STARBUCKS COFFEE?
Would be nice for the celebrant to set people straight, right from the pulpit. I think it goes along with the lax attitude and not enough reverence for the Mass or for receiving OUR LORD into one’s body. The Church has eased the requirements enough throughout the ages. My mom used to tell me when she was young, it used to be a 12 hour fast! That meant you could not eat or drink anything but water from the night before for mass the next morning, no matter what time mass was!
Bringing in water bottles is one thing, some probably need them for certain reasons, but STARBUCKS COFFEE?
Would be nice for the celebrant to set people straight, right from the pulpit. I think it goes along with the lax attitude and not enough reverence for the Mass or for receiving OUR LORD into one’s body. The Church has eased the requirements enough throughout the ages. My mom used to tell me when she was young, it used to be a 12 hour fast! That meant you could not eat or drink anything but water from the night before for mass the next morning, no matter what time mass was!
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kage_ar
Guest
Does your Parish not have Ushers? The Ushers would be the logical people to advise the person that coffee is not to be brought into Mass.
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Sarabande
Guest
At the parish that I mentioned above, the pastor (who was the only priest at the parish) was allowing it. So, an usher probably wouldn’t have had any say as to not bringing their Starbucks to Mass.
But in other circumstances where the priests are not ok with bringing coffee and other things, the ushers could do some gentle advising as to what is permitted during the Mass.
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Lepanto
Guest
Actually, it’s more absurd than you think. Per Canon Law 919 paragraph 1, the one hour communion fast in fact does mean before communion, not before the start of Mass. So, if communion is 45 minutes into a Mass, you could technically enjoy a tailgate party in the church parking lot up to 15 minutes before Mass.
“Can. 919 §1. A person who is to receive the Most Holy Eucharist is to abstain for at least one hour before holy communion from any food and drink, except for only water and medicine.”
Please see:
vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P39.HTM
cuf.org/faithfacts/details_view.asp?ffID=234
(For whatever its worth, I can not recall one instance of my parents bringing food/drinks or even toys in to Mass when I and my siblings were kids, nor do I recall other parents doing so for their kids, either.)
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