We are not "children of God" unless born again?

[ibkc]

Elsewhere on the forum, there is a fundamentalist making the argument that only those who are born again can be counted as children of God. He cites as proof:

Romans 8:10-16. Notice that verse 15 tells us that we are children of God only after we were adopted by Him.

Romans 9:8. Notice that paul specifically says “they are not the children of God”

Galatians 3:26. How does this verse say that people become children of God? By faith. The unsaved do not have this faith.

Colosians 3:6. Again, Paul clearly seperates the unsaved, who are not children of God, from those who are saved, who are the children of God.

1 John 3:10. This is the most clear of all of them: the wicked are not children of God, but children of the Devil, while those who are born again are children of God

John 1:12. Who are the sons of God? Those who have received Christ. The unsaved have not received Christ. They reject Him.

Romans 8:24. Who are those who are the sons of God? Those who are led by the Holy Spirit. The unsaved do not have the Holy Spirit

1 John 3:2. Notice that he says “Now that we are sons of God”, thus implying that there was a time (in this case, before they were born again) that they were not children of God.

My feeling on this is that taking a strictly literal interpretation of this leads to all sorts of weird places. In the first place, if God made the world and everyone in it, then we all are His children, right? Some of us may be lost and wandering, like the Prodigal Son, and some of us may be in outright rebellion against God, but that is because we have free will. It seems to me that saying that those who are not born again are literally the Devil’s children, makes the Devil co-equal with God, which is of course incorrect.

Can someone give me a Catholic perspective on this?

 

[rwoehmke]

Yes, we are created by the cooperation of our parents with God. We become adopted children of God and receive the Holy Spirit in Baptism. If one reads the rite used in Baptism in the Catholic Church one learns that we partake, through Baptism, in the three fold mission of Jesus Christ as priest, prophet, and king. In other words we become brothers and sisters of Jesus Christ and have claim to the same inheritance. Before Baptism we are creatures of God, but not adopted children worthy of the Kingdom. We become through Baptism members of the mystical body of Christ and temples of the Holy Spirit. That is what being born again means for a Catholic I think if you ponder this in conjunction with those scripture quoted above you will understand what they actually mean. !

 

[porthos11]

Elsewhere on the forum, there is a fundamentalist making the argument that only those who are born again can be counted as children of God. He cites as proof:

My feeling on this is that taking a strictly literal interpretation of this leads to all sorts of weird places. In the first place, if God made the world and everyone in it, then we all are His children, right? Some of us may be lost and wandering, like the Prodigal Son, and some of us may be in outright rebellion against God, but that is because we have free will. It seems to me that saying that those who are not born again are literally the Devil’s children, makes the Devil co-equal with God, which is of course incorrect.

Can someone give me a Catholic perspective on this?

It is indeed Catholic teaching that we become children of God by adoption through Baptism.

That God made us does not make us his children. It merely makes us his creatures. As we are farther from God than fleas are from us, we cannot be children of God unless we share in his divine life, which is what baptism does.

 

[Static]

Context,context, context.

 Nicodemus used the words 'born again' to Jesus and what did Jesus say ? Nicodemus, you are right on the money ? Nope. Jesus said you have to be born from above, not born again. I don't know why people say they are born again ( entering their mother's womb for a second time ) when Jesus clearly states that we are to be born from above. ( Jn 3:5 ) ...Baptism ! We become a member of the body of Christ through... Baptism ! ( 1 Cor 12:13 ) as some have already stated. We are all born subject to the devil, Jesus showed us the way, as stated in ( Mt 3:15f )... Baptism !

I read through some of the verses your friend stated to you.

Rom 8:24 says we are saved by hope. Kinda puzzled on what he was quoting this verse to say. But, there you have it ! We are saved by hope alone ! Nothing about belief.

Gal 3:26 says we become children of God through faith, how ? vs. 27 tells us, …Baptism ! Over and over again we will see that baptism is how we become children of God, members of the body of Christ.

I wonder how your friend would interpret ( Mt 5:9 ) which states that by being a peacemaker you are a child of God ?

May God Bless, Static ( 1 Tim 1:15 )

 

[tobinatorstark]

But we can be born again in several different ways. Baptism, Reconcillation, Penance, giving yourself to God. There are ways to be born again. Protestants sometimes will get the idea that you must, receive God for the first time, like in between conversions. Well they are half right. God calls us all to be his children, but yes there are mulitple ways to be born again.

 

[ERose]

But we can be born again in several different ways. Baptism, Reconcillation, Penance, giving yourself to God. There are ways to be born again. Protestants sometimes will get the idea that you must, receive God for the first time, like in between conversions. Well they are half right. God calls us all to be his children, but yes there are mulitple ways to be born again.

No there is only one way to become a child of God and that is through Baptism. Baptism brings us into the Body of Christ gives us the spirit of adoption. Mortal sin does not take away that adoptive status, just the sanctifying grace necessary for passage to heaven/purgatory after death. Reconcillation does just what it says. It reconciles us with God and gives us back that sanctifying grace. There is no rebirth in confession.

 

[joeybaggz]

All human beings are children of God at the moment of the conception. Every individual is made in the image and likeness of God. Whether we live with God now, and in a world to come is our choice. Christ made that choice easier and clearer.

Fundamentalists that make statements like that are ignorant. A supposition that unless you know Christ you are not saved and will perish eternally presupposes an evil and unloving God, something Christ categorically denied. From the first humans to today there are untold millions, probably billions, who have never heard of Jesus Christ. (An instance, the American Indian in the year 1,100 A.D.) A loving God cannot and will not abandon those people.

Fundamentalists need to think a little harder about the “doctrine” of love they spew.

 

[fhansen]

The CC teaches that we must be born again and that faith, for an adult, is the beginning, not the end, of our rebirth. This faith leads to Baptism which God uses to grant the initial grace of our justification. But that’s not all -there’s a spiritual element which must be realized. Depending on ourselves and Gods’ plan for us, the gestation period may be longer or shorter but it’s never all-at-once as per “born-again Christian” belief. Conversion or transformation into the likeness of Jesus whereby we become permanently adopted sons of God is a process of perfecting, requiring time, which must be accomplished before we can enter heaven.

 

[Todd_Easton]

Adam is styled a son of God in Luke 3:38.

Angels are styled sons of God in Job 1:6.

The Israelites are styled God’s first-born son in Exodus 4:22.

The judges in Israel are styled sons of the Most High in Psalm 82:6.

The verses mentioned above seem to contradict the idea that only those who are “born again” are “children of God.”

 

[porthos11]

Adam is styled a son of God in Luke 3:38.

Angels are styled sons of God in Job 1:6.

The Israelites are styled God’s first-born son in Exodus 4:22.

The judges in Israel are styled sons of the Most High in Psalm 82:6.

The verses mentioned above seem to contradict the idea that only those who are “born again” are “children of God.”

But the New Testament gives out a different type of sonship, wherein those adopted are actually partakers of the divine nature, by virtue of Jesus’ coming as a man.

The OT sonship was indeed covenant sonship but of a lesser kind, not as deep or real as the divine sonship of the baptized. They are foreshadowings if you will.