We could learn a lot from Muslims.

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Brendan_64

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With the season of Lent now upon us, and as we fast or give up something, how many of us would do as Muslims do during the month of Ramadan and give up not just food, but also water, during daylight hours? You’ve really got to admire their devotion on this.

Then there is the reverance and respect in which they treat the Qur’an. Do we treat our Bibles with anything even close to this?

On these two issue I can’t but think that Muslims have got the right approach and that we could learn from this.
 
God bless those of them that do these things AND live a life of peace and goodness.

Yes, it’s very inspiring …especially since we catholics have soooo much And God Himself in our midst body, blood soul and divinity!

But lets not forget…there are some amazing catholics out there…some that have even changed the world!
 
The intrinsic duty of Ramadan fasting is fantastic. I take my hat off to that.

However, (yes there is a however ) studies have shown Muslims eat even more in the mornings (before sunrise) and evenings during the fasting than their normal days. So overall they eat more during Ramadan than normal days. One thing we Christians should also learn to avoid…
 
Perhaps that is the case, but that still doesn’t ease the discomfort they feel during the day, going without not just food, but water. I feel that that is the point of the exercise, not the actual quantity of food eaten on the whole. I could handle the going without food, but going without water during daylight hours, now that really is tough.

I once worked in a warehouse where the work was heavy and very manual and during Ramadan (which was at the height of summer that year) Muslim guys were heaving boxes and sacks around, heavy manual laboiur, and didn’t so much as take a sip of water. I’ve also worked in schools where 10 year old kids have voluntarily abstained from food and water during Ramadan. Very admirable in my book and a real sign of their faith and devotion.
 
Brendan_64 said:
Perhaps that is the case, but that still doesn’t ease the discomfort they feel during the day, going without not just food, but water. I feel that that is the point of the exercise, not the actual quantity of food eaten on the whole. I could handle the going without food, but going without water during daylight hours, now that really is tough.

I once worked in a warehouse where the work was heavy and very manual and during Ramadan (which was at the height of summer that year) Muslim guys were heaving boxes and sacks around, heavy manual laboiur, and didn’t so much as take a sip of water. I’ve also worked in schools where 10 year old kids have voluntarily abstained from food and water during Ramadan. Very admirable in my book and a real sign of their faith and devotion.
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I agree with you that it’s still not easy.

Spiritually speaking, what’s the point of giving up food and drink in the day time while excessively indulging it in the mornings and evenings?
 
To be fair to Muslims, the concept behind Ramadan was you fasted to keep in mind the poor and hungry, and to focus on spiritual things. The gorging or having big dinners/breakfasts, to my knowledge, came later, when, in some cultures, it became more of a “holiday” in the same sense that Christmas has become for many people in the west. There are discussion among some Muslim communities of the need for having humble meals, and in some places where big meals are held, it’s treated as more of a community thing where Muslims in the community can gather together and share a feast, similar to pot luck.
 
Augustine3 said:
Spiritually speaking, what’s the point of giving up food and drink in the day time while excessively indulging it in the mornings and evenings?
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What is the point of fasting at all - if you want to do something spiritual then give some money of food to the less fortunate
 
aprilfloyd said:
What is the point of fasting at all - if you want to do something spiritual then give some money of food to the less fortunate
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Nobody said you couldn’t do both. They aren’t mutually exclusive. And there IS a point to fasting.
 
Brendan_64 said:
With the season of Lent now upon us, and as we fast or give up something, how many of us would do as Muslims do during the month of Ramadan and give up not just food, but also water, during daylight hours? You’ve really got to admire their devotion on this.

Then there is the reverance and respect in which they treat the Qur’an. Do we treat our Bibles with anything even close to this?

On these two issue I can’t but think that Muslims have got the right approach and that we could learn from this.
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The Muslim family in our neighborhood has seven children so far. Do they love having children more than many Catholics do?
 
aprilfloyd said:
What is the point of fasting at all - if you want to do something spiritual then give some money of food to the less fortunate
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The point of fasting is to learn some self discipline.
When you’re hungry or give up that favorite thing (let’s say sugar in tea or coffee) then it’s a reminder to raise your mind and heart to God and to offer a sacrifice in union with Christ for the conversion of sinners and peace in this world. Our blessed Mother asked this of the children at Fatima and we would be wise to practice this with a generous heart as well. It is certainly counted as ‘working the Lord’s vineyard’. This is not to discount giving money to the places that are feeding the poor. Do both!

Before thinking that Muslims excessively indulge in the morning and evening to be able to abstain for the day, try to be kind. I have never tried it and I commend their stamina to go the day, to have the resolve. Good for them.
 
There is a point to fasting or else Jesus, and saints would not have done it.
Also, Jesus mentions fasting “When you fast…do not look gloomy”. …He didn’t say, “hey…don’t fast” . He told them the disposition in which to do it. He says “the father who sees in secret will repay you”…so there is something in fasting.

There’s also a passage in which Jesus mentions that certain demons cannot be removed without fasting.

Lastly,

Fasting allows you to gain control and strengthen your will. I use my will to say no to my body as it gets hungry. This helps us fight temptations

It’s very useful!

God bless, Miichael
 
Brendan_64 said:
With the season of Lent now upon us, and as we fast or give up something, how many of us would do as Muslims do during the month of Ramadan and give up not just food, but also water, during daylight hours? You’ve really got to admire their devotion on this.
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You could try to do this for lent, too.
Then there is the reverance and respect in which they treat the Qur’an. Do we treat our Bibles with anything even close to this?
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I do not like this, for me it seems like it would be borderline idolatrous for us to behave in the same way concerning copies of the bible. It is not something for instance to consider more important than a human life if somebody is foolish enough to disrespect it, and while I understand that is a fringe of unpleasant people, I still think moving in that direction is bad.
 
Those Muslims who sincerely believe that the fasting is good for the Soul I commend them. However this external show of discipline should not supercede how one acts in public as if it is an unprecedented sacrifice requested by God nor is because one fears of some sort of reprisal from Him.

Jesus was clear about “showing off”. People should NOT know you are fasting because external show and making people notice is not going to fool God. It is God you are trying to please because you love him with all your heart all your might all your soul. And fasting is not only about food. What are you doing for others on expense of your comfort which you normally enjoy. It could be helping the poor the downtrodden the outcasts. This latter is even harder to do than avoiding meals at stipulated times rigidly which again leads to point of external show.

The Christian life is all about service to others. This is the hardest to keep in mind and deed throughout ones life not just during Lent.

MJ
 
Byzantine_Wolf said:
To be fair to Muslims, the concept behind Ramadan was you fasted to keep in mind the poor and hungry, and to focus on spiritual things. The gorging or having big dinners/breakfasts, to my knowledge, came later, when, in some cultures, it became more of a “holiday” in the same sense that Christmas has become for many people in the west. There are discussion among some Muslim communities of the need for having humble meals, and in some places where big meals are held, it’s treated as more of a community thing where Muslims in the community can gather together and share a feast, similar to pot luck.
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It sounds like the end of fast Muslim holiday “Eid-Al Fitir” is the potluck/feast that you are referencing. They also exchange gifts during that time. The “gorging” is not all that common traditionally for them but may be so for more “Westernized” Muslim Americans. I know quite a few orthodox practicing Muslim American families that consider eating as much as possible during late night & early dawn the same as not fasting at all.

Muslims also traditionally break the fast with a simple date (fruit). Most from what I’ve seen (when fasting) do with one meal in the evening no bigger than what they normally would and a light breakfast before their dawn prayers if they are finding themselves too weak in the day. I have participated twice in this type of fast and found it to be harder than I thought. Afterwards, I found it really difficult to get back to “normal” eating habits- amazing how quickly the body adapts. Pregnant/menstruating women and anyone under 14 are prohibited from participating. The elderly and those that are sickly/ill are also exempt.

Muslim culture as a whole is generally more oriented towards “potluck” meals/pooling of resources, something else that I think most Americans could take note of too (i.e. dying to self serving aspects of our culture and helping others with whatever we have out of our resources). Too many American families have neglected the family/communal dinner and sadly have fallen into “individual grab food + scatter” - usually right in front of the tv.
 
PennyinCanada said:
Before thinking that Muslims excessively indulge in the morning and evening to be able to abstain for the day, try to be kind. I have never tried it and I commend their stamina to go the day, to have the resolve. Good for them.
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The Baha’i Fast (which will begin in a couple of weeks) is much like the Muslim Fast, only we fast only for 19 days rather than 30 and it is the same time every year (just before the Spring Equinox.) I can’t fast anymore as I have kidney problems which preclude me from not drinking water during the day, but I did fast starting when I was about 15. I really had to force myself to eat a fairly big breakfast during the fast as I am not a morning person and don’t have much of an appetite at that hour. Not giving in to the temptation to eat or drink during the day was surprisingly easy. The bigger problem was that my mind tended to turn to mush by mid-afternoon from low blood sugar. I did usually eat a fairly big supper, but it wasn’t that big.
As for Muslims, I would say most Muslims enjoy the fast. Even those who are not so observant that they say their five prayers a day will usually attempt to fast for at least part of Ramadan. When I lived in a Muslim quarter in Mumbai, the children would all rush out at sunset to get popsicles. In the evenings there would be Qur’anic readings which went late into the night. I was living in a Christian girl’s hospice at the time, and when Ramadan ended Muslims would send us mutton.
 
MartinJordan said:
Those Muslims who sincerely believe that the fasting is good for the Soul I commend them. However this external show of discipline should not supercede how one acts in public as if it is an unprecedented sacrifice requested by God nor is because one fears of some sort of reprisal from Him.

Jesus was clear about “showing off”.
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Fasting in the Islamic world is a communal, not merely a personal act. It is not a matter of showing off, rather it reinforces their corporate identity as a community.
 
Brendan_64 said:
With the season of Lent now upon us, and as we fast or give up something, how many of us would do as Muslims do during the month of Ramadan and give up not just food, but also water, during daylight hours? You’ve really got to admire their devotion on this.

Then there is the reverance and respect in which they treat the Qur’an. Do we treat our Bibles with anything even close to this?

On these two issue I can’t but think that Muslims have got the right approach and that we could learn from this.
Click to expand...
Generally what we can get out of this is that Muslims do treat fasting much more seriously than us Catholic perhaps because the way to fast is spelt out to them. Sometimes we may take the advice of not letting others knowing that we fast a bit too far. And also that we do not have to really fast from food. Some may be too casual about fasting during Lent. The Church needs to emphasize fasting a bit more perhaps during the homilies and maybe creates an atmosphere of fasting within the church like doing away with food sale in the parish.

Other than that, Lent is better than the Muslim’s Ramadan in that fasting is voluntary for Catholics. This is where the true spirit of fasting will come about for those who really want to fast. I saw a family covering their TV set with a piece of cloth during Lent and when asked why, the lady said that it is what they would be giving up and covering it is a symbolism that they do not want to be distracted from the true God in the house. The TV in other word has become a god there.

Have a blessed Lent.
 
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