Wedding readings & Sunday obligation question

[ndgonzagagirl]

Hey everyone!

I have a question about the readings of a wedding Mass as they relate to the Sunday obligation. My local priest informed me this morning that my fiance and I could not have the readings we picked out because the ceremony is scheduled for 5:00 pm on a Saturday and any Mass at or after that time MUST have the weekly Mass readings instead.

I thought that if you wanted the Mass to count for the Sunday obligation, then you had to have the weekly readings, but that you could have other readings in place of those and not have it fulfill the obligation. We don’t intend for our wedding Mass to fulfill the Sunday obligation, but our priest says that this is non-negotiable because it is canon law.

I am a bit unsure about this because I have been to at least two Catholic weddings that I can remember that were officiated by priests I know and respect that started at 5:00 pm that had readings that the bride and groom selected.

I will certainly use the weekly readings if it is required, but I would very much like to have the readings my fiance and I have selected if that is at all possible. Any advice/information on the applicable canon law or any other advice would be greatly appreciated!

 

[kage_ar]

You might try the Ask An Apologist. I have heard this answered on Catholic Answers Live -

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Hey everyone!

I have a question about the readings of a wedding Mass as they relate to the Sunday obligation. My local priest informed me this morning that my fiance and I could not have the readings we picked out because the ceremony is scheduled for 5:00 pm on a Saturday and any Mass at or after that time MUST have the weekly Mass readings instead.

I thought that if you wanted the Mass to count for the Sunday obligation, then you had to have the weekly readings, but that you could have other readings in place of those and not have it fulfill the obligation. We don’t intend for our wedding Mass to fulfill the Sunday obligation, but our priest says that this is non-negotiable because it is canon law.

I am a bit unsure about this because I have been to at least two Catholic weddings that I can remember that were officiated by priests I know and respect that started at 5:00 pm that had readings that the bride and groom selected.

I will certainly use the weekly readings if it is required, but I would very much like to have the readings my fiance and I have selected if that is at all possible. Any advice/information on the applicable canon law or any other advice would be greatly appreciated!

I agree with your priest. Although it’s not canon law but liturgical norms that dictate this. If you want your picked readings have the wedding over before 4 pm. Of course some people will disagree with this.

 

[1ke]

I have a question about the readings of a wedding Mass as they relate to the Sunday obligation. My local priest informed me this morning that my fiance and I could not have the readings we picked out because the ceremony is scheduled for 5:00 pm on a Saturday and any Mass at or after that time MUST have the weekly Mass readings instead.

This is completely untrue.

I thought that if you wanted the Mass to count for the Sunday obligation, then you had to have the weekly readings, but that you could have other readings in place of those and not have it fulfill the obligation. We don’t intend for our wedding Mass to fulfill the Sunday obligation, but our priest says that this is non-negotiable because it is canon law.

Since he says it’s in canon law, he should be able to produce the canon that states it.

However, he won’t be able to because there isn’t one.

I am a bit unsure about this because I have been to at least two Catholic weddings that I can remember that were officiated by priests I know and respect that started at 5:00 pm that had readings that the bride and groom selected.

I will certainly use the weekly readings if it is required, but I would very much like to have the readings my fiance and I have selected if that is at all possible. Any advice/information on the applicable canon law or any other advice would be greatly appreciated!

It is not required.

However, ultimately what the priest says goes in his parish. So, you could change the time or if you’ve already set everything and can’t change the time then if you can’t get him to budge you may be stuck with the readings of the day.

 

[Phemie]

I agree with your priest. Although it’s not canon law but liturgical norms that dictate this. If you want your picked readings have the wedding over before 4 pm. Of course some people will disagree with this.

Liturgical norms dictate no such thing. If the time for her wedding is not the usual anticipated Sunday Mass there is nothing in the norm forbidding a nuptial Mass unless it’s a Sunday in Lent, Easter or Advent. A nuptial Mass can be celebrated on Sunday as long as it’s not the parish’s regular Mass time.

 

[benedictgal]

Actually, we get this a lot back home, especially at the Cathedral. Since this is the parish’s Mass and the bride has scheduled her wedding to occur during that time, she must use the Sunday readings. In fact, that has been the practice at the Cathedral for several years now.

Brother Rich is on target for this one.

Furthermore, if the wedding falls during the penitential seasons of Advent and Lent, the liturgical norms need to be followed, but, that’s another post.

Something else that has been done at the Cathedral is most interesting. If the couple has their wedding after the Sunday antiicpated Mass, then, they must have a collection during the offertory.

 

[puzzleannie]

if it is the regular scheduled Sunday Mass, the Sunday readings must be used. If it is say Saturday evening after the regular Mass, any of the readings for nuptial Mass may be used.

 

[benedictgal]

if it is the regular scheduled Sunday Mass, the Sunday readings must be used. If it is say Saturday evening after the regular Mass, any of the readings for nuptial Mass may be used.

However, the rector decided that if the wedding Mass occured after the parish’s vigil, then the Sunday readings would be used. The one concession he made was that the couple could pick either the first or second reading.

Quite a few balked at the idea of a collection, but, since the wedding party and guests weer fulfilling their Sunday obligation, they should at least be able to make some sort of contribution.

 

[Corki]

However, **the rector decided **that if the wedding Mass occured after the parish’s vigil, then the Sunday readings would be used. The one concession he made was that the couple could pick either the first or second reading.

But the rector can only make that decision for his own parish. Same thing for the pastor at the OP’s parish. It is a personal decision, which he has every right to make but that doesn’t make it binding on any other parish and certainly doesn’t make it canon law.

 

[dixieagle]

This question about nuptial Masses on Saturday evenings, whether the readings dictate whether a certain Mass fulfills the Sunday obligation, etc., crops up with predictable regularity.

With regard to whether a Nuptial Mass on Saturday evening (after 4 pm in the US, generally) fulfills the obligation, ANY Mass, of any rite, does: “A person who assists at a Mass celebrated anywhere in a Catholic rite either on the feast day itself or in the evening of the preceding day satisfies the obligation of participating in the Mass [CIC Can. 1248 §1].” There are no restrictions placed on what type of Mass, readings, etc.

For Nuptial Masses taking place on Sundays (this would include Saturday evening Masses after 4 pm, or whatever time is prescribed) of Ordinary Time or during the Christmas season *“If the wedding during Mass is chosen, the Mass of the Sunday is used but one of the readings may be changed. **If the Mass is not a parish Mass, the entire wedding Mass may be used. ***(Rite of Marriage, #11).” As weddings taking place during regular parish Masses are an extreme rarity, this certainly seems to settle the question as to whether a couple can choose the readings for their Nuptial Mass on a Saturday evening that is not the usual parish Mass.

This is in line with the multiple previous answers on this subject provided in the “Ask an Apologist” forum on this site.

For detailed information re: celebration of Nuptial Masses, see: usccb.org/liturgy/q%26a/general/liturgycalendar.shtml

 

[ndgonzagagirl]

Thank you so much for all of your replies. It sounds like the priest was mistaken as to it being canon law, but that he can choose to have this be a parish rule. Thankfully, he called me last night, lectured me on this for about an hour, and finally told me that he would allow us to have the original readings we picked out.

To answer a few questions, the wedding Mass is not replacing or after a vigil Mass. The church is in a town of less than 1000 people, and we don’t typically have a vigil Mass unless it’s for a special reason. Also, I wasn’t concerned about our wedding actually fulfilling the Sunday obligation, although I admit that it would be a convenience for my guests.

I was just really worried about this because the wedding is in less than 2 weeks and yesterday was the first time he brought this up. He approved the date and time of the wedding as well as the readings we selected a month and a half ago, and when we spoke with him yesterday, he had forgotten all of it and told us that we had to have the Sunday readings. I just wanted to get a little more information because the “it’s the law” statement sounded inaccurate and he strongly discouraged me from trying to research it or look it up anywhere because I “wouldn’t be happy with what * found.” You guys and gals helped out with the information-seeking admirably. Thanks again! *

 

[dixieagle]

Thank you so much for all of your replies. It sounds like the priest was mistaken as to it being canon law, but that he can choose to have this be a parish rule. Thankfully, he called me last night, lectured me on this for about an hour, and finally told me that he would allow us to have the original readings we picked out.

To answer a few questions, the wedding Mass is not replacing or after a vigil Mass. The church is in a town of less than 1000 people, and we don’t typically have a vigil Mass unless it’s for a special reason. Also, I wasn’t concerned about our wedding actually fulfilling the Sunday obligation, although I admit that it would be a convenience for my guests.

I was just really worried about this because the wedding is in less than 2 weeks and yesterday was the first time he brought this up. He approved the date and time of the wedding as well as the readings we selected a month and a half ago, and when we spoke with him yesterday, he had forgotten all of it and told us that we had to have the Sunday readings. I just wanted to get a little more information because the “it’s the law” statement sounded inaccurate and he strongly discouraged me from trying to research it or look it up anywhere because I “wouldn’t be happy with what * found.” You guys and gals helped out with the information-seeking admirably. Thanks again! *

To be honest, I don’t understand why he’d want this “parish rule” that flies in the face of church laws. Apparently there is a lot of misunderstanding even among clergy on this readings issue. The post about the collection being taken up at a Nuptial Mass (not a parish Mass) kind of threw me, too!

Relax and enjoy these last two weeks (I know that “relax” is not in your vocabulary right now…our daughter was married last month!) God bless!

 

[benedictgal]

To be honest, I don’t understand why he’d want this “parish rule” that flies in the face of church laws. Apparently there is a lot of misunderstanding even among clergy on this readings issue. The post about the collection being taken up at a Nuptial Mass (not a parish Mass) kind of threw me, too!

Relax and enjoy these last two weeks (I know that “relax” is not in your vocabulary right now…our daughter was married last month!) God bless!

The rationale given regarding the collection is that since Wedding Masses are posted in the bulletin, they aren’t private affairs, per se. You can’t ban someone from attending Mass, even if it just so happens to be a wedding. Taking up a collection shouldn’t shock people. After all, you are satisfying your Sunday obligation if you happen to attend a wedding Mass that occurs either during the normal parish vigil Mass or afterwards.

Furthermore, if the bride chooses to get married during the Parish’s regular Sunday vigil Mass, then she forfeits choosing her own readings. The Sunday Mass overrides the nuptial readings. Granted, we’ve covered that part, but, this is the rationale behind the rector’s decision. The bishop approved it. After all, the bishop is the “pastor” of his Cathedral (as my Ordinary keeps reminding me).

 

[dixieagle]

The rationale given regarding the collection is that since Wedding Masses are posted in the bulletin, they aren’t private affairs, per se. You can’t ban someone from attending Mass, even if it just so happens to be a wedding. Taking up a collection shouldn’t shock people. After all, you are satisfying your Sunday obligation if you happen to attend a wedding Mass that occurs either during the normal parish vigil Mass or afterwards.

Furthermore, if the bride chooses to get married during the Parish’s regular Sunday vigil Mass, then she forfeits choosing her own readings. The Sunday Mass overrides the nuptial readings. Granted, we’ve covered that part, but, this is the rationale behind the rector’s decision. The bishop approved it. After all, the bishop is the “pastor” of his Cathedral (as my Ordinary keeps reminding me).

I could see the rationale for passing the basket during the normal Parish Saturday evening Mass, though I’ve yet to see a bride and groom marry at one -perhaps they do somewhere. (BTW - even in that case, on Sundays in Ordinary time, Sundays during Christmas and some others, the couple can choose ONE of the readings. Rite of Marriage #11)

Although anyone is, indeed, welcome at ANY Mass, Nuptial or not, it is also very unusual for parishioners simply to choose to fulfill their obligation at a wedding Mass. It just seems inhospitable (all right, tacky) to pass the basket among wedding guests, many of whom, even at Nuptial Masses, aren’t even Catholic. I would hope that the Catholic guests are supporting their home parishes already. In most instances, the couple, or bride’s family, has already paid an often hefty fee to use the church/Cathedral (but that’s another thread!)

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

This question about nuptial Masses on Saturday evenings, whether the readings dictate whether a certain Mass fulfills the Sunday obligation, etc., crops up with predictable regularity.

With regard to whether a Nuptial Mass on Saturday evening (after 4 pm in the US, generally) fulfills the obligation, ANY Mass, of any rite, does: "A person who assists at a Mass celebrated anywhere in a Catholic rite either on the feast day itself or in the evening of the preceding day satisfies the obligation of participating in the Mass [CIC Can. 1248 §1]." There are no restrictions placed on what type of Mass, readings, etc.

For Nuptial Masses taking place on Sundays (this would include Saturday evening Masses after 4 pm, or whatever time is prescribed) of Ordinary Time or during the Christmas season *“If the wedding during Mass is chosen, the Mass of the Sunday is used but one of the readings may be changed. **If the Mass is not a parish Mass, the entire wedding Mass may be used. ***(Rite of Marriage, #11).” As weddings taking place during regular parish Masses are an extreme rarity, this certainly seems to settle the question as to whether a couple can choose the readings for their Nuptial Mass on a Saturday evening that is not the usual parish Mass.

This is in line with the multiple previous answers on this subject provided in the “Ask an Apologist” forum on this site.

For detailed information re: celebration of Nuptial Masses, see: usccb.org/liturgy/q%26a/general/liturgycalendar.shtml

The other document I believe said since Sundays are solemnities and a day of obligation the readings specified in the Proper of the seasons must be used for any Mass after 4PM until midnight Sunday. I guess we may (which is not unheard of) have several documents that say different things.

 

[Digitonomy]

he strongly discouraged me from trying to research it or look it up anywhere because I “wouldn’t be happy with what * found.” You guys and gals helped out with the information-seeking admirably. Thanks again! *Unless he was trying to simply quiet your belligerent attitude (which seems unlikely based on how you’ve presented yourself in this thread), his statement sounds like an appeal to ignorance, and encouragement to continuing ignorance. Glad you got this straightened out.

dixieagle:

To be honest, I don’t understand why he’d want this “parish rule” that flies in the face of church laws.

I think it’s a bit strong to characterize it that way. As I read the Rite of Marriage section you cited, there appears to be an allowance for the Rite to be celebrated with the various marriage readings. I don’t however see either a requirement, or a right of the marrying couple to choose the readings. Since you’re obviously more familiar with the rite than I am, I’m sure you can point out if I’m overlooking something from earlier in the document on this issue. Otherwise it sounds like the pastor is free to establish whatever rules he sees fit, although I agree there doesn’t seem to be much sense in prohibiting the couple from choosing the readings in an essentially private mass.

benedictgal:

you are satisfying your Sunday obligation if you happen to attend a wedding Mass that occurs either during the normal parish vigil Mass or afterwards.

What you say is true, but its implication is a bit misleading. One can also satisfy his Sunday obligation by attending a wedding mass before the normal parish vigil mass, so long as it occurs Saturday evening - generally reckoned as 4pm onward in the US.

 

[dixieagle]

I think it’s a bit strong to characterize it that way. As I read the Rite of Marriage section you cited, there appears to be an allowance for the Rite to be celebrated with the various marriage readings. I don’t however see either a requirement, or a right of the marrying couple to choose the readings. Since you’re obviously more familiar with the rite than I am, I’m sure you can point out if I’m overlooking something from earlier in the document on this issue. Otherwise it sounds like the pastor is free to establish whatever rules he sees fit, although I agree there doesn’t seem to be much sense in prohibiting the couple from choosing the readings in an essentially private mass.

I agree that it doesn’t make sense to prohibit a Catholic couple who wants to actively participate in choosing the readings for their Nuptial Mass from doing so, particularly when Church law is on their side. It tells me that either the pastor is unfamiliar with the Church’s rules, or he is a curmudgeon.

The pastor should be delighted to be witnessing the marriage of a couple who takes the sacrament of matrimony and the Nuptial Mass so seriously that they want to do this!

 

[Phemie]

The other document I believe said since Sundays are solemnities and a day of obligation the readings specified in the Proper of the seasons must be used for any Mass after 4PM until midnight Sunday. I guess we may (which is not unheard of) have several documents that say different things.

No, they all pretty much say the same thing: if it’s the parish’s regular Sunday Mass (anticipated or of the day), you only get to chose one of the readings; if it’s on a Sunday in Ordinary Time or Christmas but not the parish’s regular Mass, the Nuptial Mass with any of its readings is perfectly OK.