Weekday Mass Questions

[grandeorgue]

I have a couple questions regarding Feast Days and Memorial Day with Weekday Masses:

1.) In example, today is the Memorial of St. Aloysius Gonzaga. During the regular weekday Mass for today, do we use the readings for his feast day or the readings for Monday of the Twelfth Week in Ordinary Time.

2.) Also, tomorrow is the optional memorial of three saints: St. Paulinus of Nola, St. John Fisher, and St. Thomas More. Which saint do we direct the prayers of the Mass to (Opening prayer, prayer after communion), since one is a bishop, one’s a bishop and martyr, and the other ones just a martyr. Do we use the readings for the optional memorial or the readings for the Tuesday of the Twelfth Week in Ordinary Time? Since two are martyrs and one’s a bishop, does the priest wear Red, White, or Green?

Thanks!!

 

[MarkThompson]

I have a couple questions regarding Feast Days and Memorial Day with Weekday Masses:

1.) In example, today is the Memorial of St. Aloysius Gonzaga. During the regular weekday Mass for today, do we use the readings for his feast day or the readings for Monday of the Twelfth Week in Ordinary Time.

It’s an obligatory memorial, so if there are dedicated readings for it (usually there aren’t, though, right?) then you would use those.

2.) Also, tomorrow is the optional memorial of three saints: St. Paulinus of Nola, St. John Fisher, and St. Thomas More. Which saint do we direct the prayers of the Mass to (Opening prayer, prayer after communion), since one is a bishop, one’s a bishop and martyr, and the other ones just a martyr. Do we use the readings for the optional memorial or the readings for the Tuesday of the Twelfth Week in Ordinary Time? Since two are martyrs and one’s a bishop, does the priest wear Red, White, or Green?

Thanks!!

The answer to that is 100% contained in the word “optional.”

 

[T_Hope]

Since two are martyrs and one’s a bishop, does the priest wear Red, White, or Green?

We just talked about the liturgical colors in RCIA last week.
Green is worn during ordinary time.
White, if I remember right, is worn during Easter.
and that would leave red for the Christmas season, although I am sure our priest wore red one afternoon recently!

In any event, the colors generally have to do with the liturgical calendar.

Hope

 

[grandeorgue]

It’s an obligatory memorial, so if there are dedicated readings for it (usually there aren’t, though, right?) then you would use those.

Would it be normal to celebrate the memorial of just one saint (i.e. St Thomas More) or would you have to celebrate all of the saints at the same time?

The answer to that is 100% contained in the word “optional.”

 

[MarkThompson]

We just talked about the liturgical colors in RCIA last week.
Green is worn during ordinary time.
White, if I remember right, is worn during Easter.
and that would leave red for the Christmas season, although I am sure our priest wore red one afternoon recently!

In any event, the colors generally have to do with the liturgical calendar.

Hope

That’s generally true, however different colors are used for particular feasts and memorials. (Martyrs’ feasts, for instance, call for red.)

In case my answer above was less helpful than it could have been, I should have just said that it is in the nature of an optional memorial that you (i.e., the priest) can choose whether or not to celebrate it, and, if there’s more than one, which to celebrate.

A proper liturgical calender (e.g., this one from the USCCB) will tell you the day’s liturgical color, along with the colors appropriate for the celebration of any optional memorial. In this case:
St. Paulinus of Nola → Green
St. John Fisher → White
St. Thomas More → Red

 

[T_Hope]

We just talked about the liturgical colors in RCIA last week.
Green is worn during ordinary time.
White, if I remember right, is worn during Easter.
and that would leave red for the Christmas season, although I am sure our priest wore red one afternoon recently!

In any event, the colors generally have to do with the liturgical calendar.

Hope

OOOOOPS, I was wrong.

Christmas is white and/or gold.

Easter is white and/or gold.

Pentecost is red.

Ordinary time is green.

Is that right?

 

[grandeorgue]

Would it be normal to celebrate the memorial of just one saint (i.e. St Thomas More) or would you have to celebrate all of the saints at the same time?

 

[MarkThompson]

OOOOOPS, I was wrong.

Christmas is white and/or gold.

Easter is white and/or gold.

Pentecost is red.

Ordinary time is green.

Is that right?

According to the GIRM:
346. As to the color of sacred vestments, the traditional usage is to be retained: namely,

1. White is used in the Offices and Masses during the Easter and Christmas seasons; also on celebrations of the Lord other than of his Passion, of the Blessed Virgin Mary, of the Holy Angels, and of Saints who were not Martyrs; on the Solemnities of All Saints (1 November) and of the Nativity of Saint John the Baptist (24 June); and on the Feasts of Saint John the Evangelist (27 December), of the Chair of Saint Peter (22 February), and of the Conversion of Saint Paul (25 January).
2. Red is used on Palm Sunday of the Lord’s Passion and on Good Friday, on Pentecost Sunday, on celebrations of the Lord’s Passion, on the feasts of the Apostles and Evangelists, and on celebrations of Martyr Saints.
3. Green is used in the Offices and Masses of Ordinary Time.
4. Violet or purple is used in Advent and of Lent. It may also be worn in Offices and Masses for the Dead (cf. below).
5. Besides violet, white or black vestments may be worn at funeral services and at other Offices and Masses for the Dead in the Dioceses of the United States of America.
6. Rose may be used, where it is the practice, on Gaudete Sunday (Third Sunday of Advent) and on Laetare Sunday (Fourth Sunday of Lent).
7. On more solemn days, sacred vestments may be used that are festive, that is, more precious, even if not of the color of the day.
8. Gold or silver colored vestments may be worn on more solemn occasions in the dioceses of the United States of America.
347. Ritual Masses are celebrated in their proper color, in white, or in a festive color; Masses for Various Needs, on the other hand, are celebrated in the color proper to the day or the season or in violet if they are of a penitential character, for example, no. 31 (in Time of War or Conflict), no. 33 (in Time of Famine), or no. 38 (for the Forgiveness of Sins); Votive Masses are celebrated in the color suited to the Mass itself or even in the color proper to the day or the season.​

 

[MarkThompson]

Would it be normal to celebrate the memorial of just one saint (i.e. St Thomas More) or would you have to celebrate all of the saints at the same time?

You would pick one. By the way, as to the readings, the GIRM contains the following directives:
357. For Sundays and solemnities, three readings are assigned: that is, from a Prophet, an Apostle, and a Gospel. By these the Christian people are brought to know the continuity of the work of salvation according to the God’s wonderful plan. These readings should be followed strictly. During the Easter Season, according to the tradition of the Church, instead of the reading from the Old Testament, the reading is taken from the Acts of the Apostles.

For Feasts, on the other hand, two readings are assigned. If, however, according to the norms a feast is raised to the rank of a solemnity, a third reading is added, taken from the Common.

For memorials of Saints, unless strictly proper readings are given, the readings assigned for the weekday are customarily used. In certain cases, readings are provided that highlight some particular aspect of the spiritual life or activity of the Saint. The use of such readings is not to be insisted upon, unless a pastoral reason suggests it.

1. In the Lectionary for weekdays, readings are provided for each day of every week throughout the entire year; as a result, these readings are for the most part to be used on the days to which they are assigned, unless there occurs a solemnity, feast, or memorial that has its own proper New Testament readings, that is to say, readings in which mention is made of the Saint being celebrated.

If, however, the continuous reading during the week is interrupted by the occurrence of some solemnity or feast, or some particular celebration, then the priest, taking into consideration the entire week’s scheme of readings, is allowed either to combine parts omitted with other readings or to decide which readings are to be preferred over others.

In Masses with special groups, the priest is allowed to choose texts more suited to the particular celebration, provided they are taken from the texts of an approved lectionary.

 

[MarkThompson]

By the way, if you want a reference for the statement “you would pick one,” here you go: from the General Norms for the Liturgical Year and the Calendar, no. 14, “Should more than one optional memorial fall on the same day, only one may be celebrated; the others are omitted.” I know that the rubrics have been altered since 1969, and I’m sure if you look somewhere else you’d be able to find whatever’s currently in force, but that principle, for one, is still standing.

 

[VetA]

OOOOOPS, I was wrong.

Christmas is white and/or gold.

Easter is white and/or gold.

Pentecost is red.

Ordinary time is green.

Is that right?

you forgot violet and black… advent is violet, funerals (Masses for the dead) are black

 

[MarkThompson]

you forgot violet and black… advent is violet, funerals (Masses for the dead) are black

Black is rare at funerals these days. Within the context of the OF, “Violet or purple is used in Advent and of Lent. It may also be worn in Offices and Masses for the Dead . . . Besides violet, white or black vestments may be worn at funeral services and at other Offices and Masses for the Dead in the Dioceses of the United States of America.”

 

[Bbigam]

A proper liturgical calender (e.g., this one from the USCCB) will tell you the day’s liturgical color, along with the colors appropriate for the celebration of any optional memorial. In this case:
St. Paulinus of Nola → Green
St. John Fisher → White
St. Thomas More → Red

I don’t think that’s quite right. Green is only for ordinary time, so it would be used for a Mass if the priest elected not to celebrate either of the optional memorials today and just celebrate the Tuesday of week 12 of ordinary time. White is for St. Paulinus of Nola, as the feast day of a non-martyr; Red is the color for the feast day of Sts. John Fisher and Thomas More together as a feast of martyrs.

It is kind of confusing but I think that’s how it works. Note in the PDF from the USCCB a semicolon separating St. Paulinus from Sts. John & Thomas. The Mass I went to today was celebrated as the memorial of Sts. John Fisher and Thomas More.

What would not be permitted (I think) would be to, in a single Mass, join together these two separate memorials and commemorate all three saints.

 

[MarkThompson]

I don’t think that’s quite right. Green is only for ordinary time, so it would be used for a Mass if the priest elected not to celebrate either of the optional memorials today and just celebrate the Tuesday of week 12 of ordinary time. White is for St. Paulinus of Nola, as the feast day of a non-martyr; Red is the color for the feast day of Sts. John Fisher and Thomas More together as a feast of martyrs.

It is kind of confusing but I think that’s how it works. Note in the PDF from the USCCB a semicolon separating St. Paulinus from Sts. John & Thomas. The Mass I went to today was celebrated as the memorial of Sts. John Fisher and Thomas More.

What would not be permitted (I think) would be to, in a single Mass, join together these two separate memorials and commemorate all three saints.

D’oh, yes, good catch! I’ll have to try to work on my reading comprehension skills for the future.

 

[marytk]

For part of the OP questions for most memorials the priest can use either the readings of the day (eg. Wednesday of the 12th week of ordinary time) Or the readings for the saint. There are some memorials that have an obligatory first reading or gospel.(The examples that come right to mind are that Mary Magdalene has a gospel that must be used and The feast of Timothy and Titus has a first reading that must be used (actually in this case a choice from the letter to Titus or one from 2Timothy)