Weird Genesis' passages?

[Vasilis92]

Today,while I was walking with my friends,some “Christians” stopped us and started preaching.They were something like “Mother Goddess”.Their doctrine is that there’s not only one God.There is the Father and the Mother.This is supposedly based on a passage which says:
Then God said "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth." Genesis 1:27
Focus on the bold words.
And I freaked out when they continued by saying that Jesus had a wife.This is (supposedly) based on this passage:
The Spirit and the Bride say, “Come.” And let him who hears say, “Come.” And let him who is thirsty come, let him who desires take the water of life without price.
This really draw my attention.Who’s the Bride?

Anyway,these are my questions.They were also saying that pictures are idolatry but I confronted that with success.
God Bless,
Vasilis

 

[mymamamary]

I do not know what kind of Bible they were using. Perhaps the Gnostic gospels?

thats a load of horsepoo, I recommend you telling them to buy an actual Bible, not some new age, mother earth altered garbage.

 

[TeenageConvert]

Today,while I was walking with my friends,some “Christians” stopped us and started preaching.They were something like “Mother Goddess”.Their doctrine is that there’s not only one God.There is the Father and the Mother.This is supposedly based on a passage which says:
Then God said "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth." Genesis 1:27
Us= The Father, The Son, The Holy Spirit.
Focus on the bold words.
And I freaked out when they continued by saying that Jesus had a wife.This is (supposedly) based on this passage:
The Spirit and the Bride say, “Come.” And let him who hears say, “Come.” And let him who is thirsty come, let him who desires take the water of life without price.
This really draw my attention.Who’s the Bride?
Umm…I’ve never heard that verse…
Anyway,these are my questions.They were also saying that pictures are idolatry but I confronted that with success.
God Bless,
Vasilis

Wait, pictures are idolatry but worshipping a mother goddess isn’t? “I am the LORD thy God who has brought you out of the land of Egypt…Have no other gods before me” !!!

 

[StLudmilla]

Today,while I was walking with my friends,some “Christians” stopped us and started preaching.They were something like “Mother Goddess”.Their doctrine is that there’s not only one God.There is the Father and the Mother.This is supposedly based on a passage which says:
Then God said "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth." Genesis 1:27
Focus on the bold words.
And I freaked out when they continued by saying that Jesus had a wife.This is (supposedly) based on this passage:
The Spirit and the Bride say, “Come.” And let him who hears say, “Come.” And let him who is thirsty come, let him who desires take the water of life without price.
This really draw my attention.Who’s the Bride?
Anyway,these are my questions.They were also saying that pictures are idolatry but I confronted that with success.
God Bless,
Vasilis

The “bride” is the Church and in “our” image is referring to the Holy Trinity, the triune God. I agree with the horse poo coment. This is the ultimate result of sola scriptura.

 

[Usagi]

The “us” in Genesis has been explained in various ways. Some Christians call it a prefigurement of the Trinity, but the most likely answer seems to be that it is a “plural of majesty,” using a plural pronoun to emphasize the awesomeness of the single being under discussion. Similarly, one of the common names for God in the early OT is the word “Elohim,” which is properly plural.

The Bride in Revelation is the Church. There is a continuing marriage metaphor throughout Scripture, pairing God and Israel in the OT and Christ and the Church in the NT.

There is a theory that, during some periods of Israelite history, Asherah or another local mother goddess was worshipped as Yahweh’s wife. This is actually not denied by the Old Testament, which repeatedly describes Israel falling into false worship of deities like Asherah for decades at a time before God would raise up a new judge, prophet, or king to reassert the form of worship He had commanded. Jews and Christians disagree with this claim not in that it never happened, but in that it is proposed as being equally or even more “correct” than orthodox worship. (Similarly, we cannot disagree that there were multiple sects and forms of “Christianity” even in the earliest centuries – the NT books already mention heresies and false teachers – but we insist that they were not equal competitors with a winner determined by luck or strength, but an original orthodoxy and various deviations therefrom.)

Usagi

 

[Huiou_Theou]

Today,while I was walking with my friends,some “Christians” stopped us and started preaching.They were something like “Mother Goddess”.Their doctrine is that there’s not only one God.There is the Father and the Mother.This is supposedly based on a passage which says:
Then God said "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth." Genesis 1:27
Focus on the bold words.
And I freaked out when they continued by saying that Jesus had a wife.This is (supposedly) based on this passage:
The Spirit and the Bride say, “Come.” And let him who hears say, “Come.” And let him who is thirsty come, let him who desires take the water of life without price.
This really draw my attention.Who’s the Bride?

Anyway,these are my questions.They were also saying that pictures are idolatry but I confronted that with success.
God Bless,
Vasilis

For others: Vasilis is quoting an obscure wording from the KJV.

Revel 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
Revel 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

In the RKV, it translates:

Revel 22:16 I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you the assurance of this in your churches; I, the root, I, the offspring of David’s race, I, the bright start the brings in the day. The Spirit and my bride bid me come; let everyone who hears this read out say, Come. Come, you who are thirsty, take, you who will, the water of life; it is my free gift.

Vasilis,
Note: The reference to water of life shows up in the NT with passages such as the “woman at the well”, and just before the crucifixion where Jesus says:

John 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
John 7:38 He that believes in me, as the scripture has said, out of his belly (AKA Womb) shall flow rivers of living water.
John 7:39 (But this he said of the Spirit, …

At the cross, notice, out of Jesus’ side two things flow – water and blood. These are the signs of life, although their loss or misuse is also death.

Recall that Adam had a wife formed out of his side. She is Adam’s because she is bone of his bone, and flesh of his flesh.

Likewise, on the cross, Jesus gives us (all) a surprising opportunity to be his “bride”; through a sharing of his flesh and blood. (eg: via the Eucharist which is Life itself).

The cross is a “tree” and it was the means for us to gain this life; Look carefully at the in Revelation 22:14.

Now, a simple bride is not yet a consummated wife.

BUT: The whole passage in Revelation is about when Jesus (the bridegroom) will “come” to her;

So you might think of a “wedding” night – but: don’t think that Jesus will marry, in the sense of sexual union, with all the members of his church.
Eg: polygamst? and what of same-sex unions…?

However, just as Eve was Adam’s flesh before sexual intercourse, and because of this those two were already one flesh – IN that same way, Jesus can be(come) one flesh with all of us; without sexual union, or confusion, or amalgamation. AND BTW: There’s no sex in heaven…

 

[The_Scott]

For future reference, the “Bride” passage is Revelation 22:17:

[BIBLEDRB]Revelation 22:17[/BIBLEDRB]

EDIT: And I see Huiou Theou beat me to the reference.

 

[Huiou_Theou]

For future reference, the “Bride” passage is Revelation 22:17:

[bibledrb]Revelation 22:17[/bibledrb]

EDIT: And I see Huiou Theou beat me to the reference.

Great, SCOTT!


I don’t think we’ve met, though you sure have enough posts that I ought to have bumped into you before this

Your brother in Christ, Jesus.
–Andrew.

 

[The_Scott]

Great, SCOTT!


I don’t think we’ve met, though you sure have enough posts that I ought to have bumped into you before this

Your brother in Christ, Jesus.
–Andrew.

I’m sure we were on a thread together once upon a time. I post all over the place, more or less. But that’s not necessarily relevant to the thread at hand.

 

[Crumpy]

The “elohim” and “us” in Genesis are usually accompanied by singular verb forms, as I am told. So, that deepens the mystery.

I don’t think that there’s any doubt or scandal about these words in Genesis. There is no mistaking that there is one God and only one God.

I won’t deny that “us” may be a “majestic” form of expression, but I won’t accept it as fact, either. There’s plenty of middle east writing from the early biblical days, and I haven’t heard either way if there is a majestic usage of pronouns.

In English, the royal “we” is a much later development – I assume. I don’t know where the precedents for “we” and “us” originate.

 

[Gorgias]

For future reference, the “Bride” passage is Revelation 22:17:

[BIBLEDRB]Revelation 22:17[/BIBLEDRB]

EDIT: And I see Huiou Theou beat me to the reference.

Well, while we’re at it, let’s point to the cross-reference found at that point in Revelations – it points back to Rev 21:2 … “I also saw the holy city, a new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.” In other words, this isn’t just Catholics making up an explanation to fit their ideas – the ideas come from Scripture itself! The Church, the new Jerusalem, is the bride of Christ, who cries, “Come!” to all those who long for Jesus!

 

[Huiou_Theou]

The “elohim” and “us” in Genesis are usually accompanied by singular verb forms, as I am told. So, that deepens the mystery.

The “ym” or “im” ending on “elohym” is masculine plural.

The Greek, reads, for example:
In Genesis 1:26, God [singular] said [singular], let us-make [plural] man [singular] according to our ???] image.

Hmmm… here the verb clearly is in the plural; But the word for “our” is not written in the common way, eg: “Emwn” (ημων) – rather a longer and very unusual form is used: ημετε-ρ-αν;

I’m not sure what the subtle nuance is; The longer spelling of “our” appears to be used either in very formal settings, or as a way to use “our” like a pronoun rather than as a possessive…

Eg: I am thinking Genesis might be saying: “let us make man agreeably image us” rather than the less precise “our image” ?

I’m not quite sure… Sometimes, however, the longer spelling is definitely used in a way which means “MY”, instead of “our”

Psalm 35:14 I behaved myself as though he had been my friend or brother: I bowed down heavily, as one that mourns for his mother.

The word “my” in the psalm, actually is the longer spelling of “our” in the Greek. Perhaps God really meant, “my” image – but somehow he meant it indirectly – in that passage in Genesis?


I get the distinct impression that the longer spelling of “our” (in Greek) has a distinct ethnic connotation… I just checked it exhaustively.

eg: It is concerned with items of inheritance/heritage (legal proclamation) and not of happenstance crowds or traveling partners.

I don’t think that there’s any doubt or scandal about these words in Genesis. There is no mistaking that there is one God and only one God.

I won’t deny that “us” may be a “majestic” form of expression, but I won’t accept it as fact, either. There’s plenty of middle east writing from the early biblical days, and I haven’t heard either way if there is a majestic usage of pronouns.

That’s fair enough.
Personally, I think the closest I have seen to that idea is the usage by king Ataraxes in the book of Ezra. I think about Ezra 7:13; Where the king is making a decree himself, but it reads “our” in the Greek rather than “my” as is found in English translation.

In English, the royal “we” is a much later development – I assume. I don’t know where the precedents for “we” and “us” originate.

I can’t point to it either… however, even if we set that aside for a moment…

The passage in Genesis has the possible connotation that God is speaking to servants (counselors or more likely, Angels) that he wishes to carry out his design. The Angels, being Spirit, image the Father already – and so, God can say “our image”, without referencing other “Gods” who are his equal – or even implying that the Angels own the image intrinsically without reference to an origin.

In ancient times, rulers, kings, and princes were commonly called Gods; and this usage is even recorded in the Scriptures themselves – see: John 10:34-36.

Angels, then, would clearly qualify as both being princes / rulers of the word before man was made – and ones who already posses the image of God.
Since God uses them as messengers to speak to man, I don’t think it strange that God would use them in the process of forming man.

 

[farpinho]

The “us” in Genesis has been explained in various ways. Some Christians call it a prefigurement of the Trinity, but the most likely answer seems to be that it is a “plural of majesty,” using a plural pronoun to emphasize the awesomeness of the single being under discussion. Similarly, one of the common names for God in the early OT is the word “Elohim,” which is properly plural.

The Bride in Revelation is the Church. There is a continuing marriage metaphor throughout Scripture, pairing God and Israel in the OT and Christ and the Church in the NT.

There is a theory that, during some periods of Israelite history, Asherah or another local mother goddess was worshipped as Yahweh’s wife. This is actually not denied by the Old Testament, which repeatedly describes Israel falling into false worship of deities like Asherah for decades at a time before God would raise up a new judge, prophet, or king to reassert the form of worship He had commanded. Jews and Christians disagree with this claim not in that it never happened, but in that it is proposed as being equally or even more “correct” than orthodox worship. (Similarly, we cannot disagree that there were multiple sects and forms of “Christianity” even in the earliest centuries – the NT books already mention heresies and false teachers – but we insist that they were not equal competitors with a winner determined by luck or strength, but an original orthodoxy and various deviations therefrom.)

Usagi

Asherah was considered by some as the “wife” of YHWH when they used to worship several idols. Funny thing is that Asherah was also linked as the wife of one of the deities commonly referenced as “Baal”… We can see Asherah referenced in Jeremiah 7 and 44 as “Queen of Heaven”. As we can see in Jeremiah 44 the worship of Asherah and other fake gods provoked God’s anger, bringing great disasters in Jerusalem and on all towns of Judah.

 

[Huiou_Theou]

Asherah was considered by some as the “wife” of YHWH when they used to worship several idols. Funny thing is that Asherah was also linked as the wife of one of the deities commonly referenced as “Baal”… We can see Asherah referenced in Jeremiah 7 and 44 as “Queen of Heaven”.

The name itself is Greek, the starting part of the name is “asterion” from which we get the words Astral, Ateroid, etc. So, her name is literally a reference to the night sky itself and what is found in it.

As we can see in Jeremiah 44 the worship of Asherah and other fake gods provoked God’s anger, bringing great disasters in Jerusalem and on all towns of Judah.

As did any worship which confused nature with God himself. Pagan people would naturally make the connection that if the Hebrew God were the God of the “sky” – that his consort would be the female deity of the night. Loose connections like these were often exploited to ensnare the unlearned of the Hebrews as well…

 

[tabycat]

The “us” in Genesis has been explained in various ways. Some Christians call it a prefigurement of the Trinity, but the most likely answer seems to be that it is a “plural of majesty,” using a plural pronoun to emphasize the awesomeness of the single being under discussion. Similarly, one of the common names for God in the early OT is the word “Elohim,” which is properly plural.

The Bride in Revelation is the Church. There is a continuing marriage metaphor throughout Scripture, pairing God and Israel in the OT and Christ and the Church in the NT.

There is a theory that, during some periods of Israelite history, Asherah or another local mother goddess was worshipped as Yahweh’s wife. This is actually not denied by the Old Testament, which repeatedly describes Israel falling into false worship of deities like Asherah for decades at a time before God would raise up a new judge, prophet, or king to reassert the form of worship He had commanded. Jews and Christians disagree with this claim not in that it never happened, but in that it is proposed as being equally or even more “correct” than orthodox worship. (Similarly, we cannot disagree that there were multiple sects and forms of “Christianity” even in the earliest centuries – the NT books already mention heresies and false teachers – but we insist that they were not equal competitors with a winner determined by luck or strength, but an original orthodoxy and various deviations therefrom.)

Usagi

:

 

[Huiou_Theou]

I don’t think that there’s any doubt or scandal about these words in Genesis. There is no mistaking that there is one God and only one God.

Tell me, what do you think? Didn’t the devil attempt to re-make man in his own image?

 

[farpinho]

Tell me, what do you think? Didn’t the devil attempt to re-make man in his own image?

No, but lots of people try to discredit the Bible by arguing that it’s nothing but a repackaged canaanite polytheism…

 

[Huiou_Theou]

No, but lots of people try to discredit the Bible by arguing that it’s nothing but a repackaged canaanite polytheism…

So, In like manner – what does this people’s other argument have to do with the price of Canaanite Doritos on the moon?

 

[farpinho]

So, In like manner – what does this people’s other argument have to do with the price of Canaanite Doritos on the moon?