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ajpirc
Guest
As the Mass changed after Vatican II, was the way that the Sacraments were celebrated changed also?
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Chatter163
Guest
Yes, to varying degrees. A quick google will assist in identifying the changes.
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ajpirc
Guest
What should be entered into the box?
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ajpirc
Guest
Could someone help me identify these changes, such as giving me a website? I couldn’t really find anything when I Googled it.
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puzzleannie
Guest
google rite for baptism roman catholic
for instance
for instance
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ajpirc
Guest
Is there a specific website to click on?
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Paxvobis
Guest
Following Vatican II, all of the rites for the sacraments in the Roman Rite of the Church changed.
Fish Eaters: Being Catholic has the text of each sacrament in English and Latin before the changes.
I’ll give you a summery:
Baptism: The old rite of Baptism was rather lengthy compared to the new one (promulgated in 1969). You can see for yourself the differences here: Comparison of Rites of Baptism
Eucharist: I assume you know about the changes in the Mass (promulgated in 1969). (If you don’t, you can spend hours on this forum reading people argue about them
)
Penance: The new rite of penance (promulgated in 1973) and the old rite begin the same way. In both, the penitent signs himself and says “Father, bless me, for I have sinned. It has been X (days, weeks, months) since my last confession. Since then, I have…” before listing his sins in kind and number. The Priest than asks the penitent to say the Act of Contrition. This is where things start to change from the new rite. In the new rite, the penitent says the Act of Contrition before the Priest says, in English, “God, the Father of mercies, through the death and resurrection of his son has reconciled the world to himself and sent the Holy Spirit among us to forgive sins; through the ministry of the Church, may God grant you pardon and peace, and I absolve you of your sins in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Amen.” In the old rite, the priest says the absolution during the penitents Act of Contrition. The priest says, in Latin, “May our Lord Jesus Christ absolve you; and by His authority I absolve you from every bond of excommunication and interdict, so far as my power allows and your needs require. Thereupon, I absolve you of your sins in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost. Amen.” Then, after the penitent leaves, the priest says a prayer (again in Latin) for him: “May the Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ, the merits of the Blessed Virgin Mary and of all the saints obtain for you that whatever good you do or whatever evil you bear might merit for you the remission of your sins, the increase of grace and the reward of everlasting life.”
Confirmation: In the old rite of confirmation, the priest or bishop anoints the person about to be confirmed and says in Latin “I sign you with the Sign of the Cross, and I confirm you with the chrism of salvation. In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.” In the new rite (promulgated in 1971), the priest or bishop anoints the person about to be confirmed saying “N, receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.”
Matrimony: Some people have been kind enough to put their Extraordinary Form Mass Weddings on Youtube. Here, you can see the old rite of Matrimony for yourself:
youtube.com/watch?v=sa3F1C7FskQ&feature=related
youtube.com/watch?v=AgSYLo7Tq8Q&feature=related
There weren’t that many changes in the Rite of Matrimony (the new one was promulgated in 1969), but it now takes place in the middle of the Mass, after the Gospel, rather than before the Mass.
The actual words that the priest says upon the conferring of the sacrament have changed too. In the new rite, the priest says:
“You have declared your consent before the Church. May the Lord in his goodness strengthen your consent and fill you with his blessings. What God has joined, man must not divide. Amen.”
In the old rite, the priest says:
“I join you together in marriage, in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.”
Holy Orders: The Holy Orders rite hasn’t changed much. The Old Rite’s text says (the parts that were taken out I put in italics):
"Grant, we beseech You, Almighty Father, to these Your servants, the dignity of the
Priesthood; renew the spirit of holiness within them, so that they
may hold from You, O God, the office of the second rank in Your service and by the
example of their behavior afford a pattern of holy living.
The New Rite (promulgated in 1968), says:
“Grant, we beseech You, Almighty Father, to these Your servants, the dignity of the
Priesthood; renew within them the spirit of holiness. May they hold from You, the office
of the second rank in Your service and by the example of their behavior afford a pattern
of holy living.”
I’ve heard it stated that because “so that” was eliminated, the new rite is invalid. However, the sacrament is conferred by the laying on of hands, not by the above prayer.
Some of the surrounding ceremonies have been eliminated.
Anointing of the Sick: The Anointing of the Sick was called Extreme Unction in the pre-Vatican II days. The old rite of Extreme Unction there are six anointings and the priest says, again in Latin, “May the Lord forgive you by this holy anointing and His most loving
mercy whatever sins you have committed.” In the new rite (promulgated in 1972), there are two anointings and the priest says “Through this holy anointing and His most loving mercy, may the Lord help you by the grace of the Holy Spirit so that when you have been freed from your sins, He may save you and in His goodness raise you up.”
I hope I’ve been of service.
Fish Eaters: Being Catholic has the text of each sacrament in English and Latin before the changes.
I’ll give you a summery:
Baptism: The old rite of Baptism was rather lengthy compared to the new one (promulgated in 1969). You can see for yourself the differences here: Comparison of Rites of Baptism
Eucharist: I assume you know about the changes in the Mass (promulgated in 1969). (If you don’t, you can spend hours on this forum reading people argue about them
)Penance: The new rite of penance (promulgated in 1973) and the old rite begin the same way. In both, the penitent signs himself and says “Father, bless me, for I have sinned. It has been X (days, weeks, months) since my last confession. Since then, I have…” before listing his sins in kind and number. The Priest than asks the penitent to say the Act of Contrition. This is where things start to change from the new rite. In the new rite, the penitent says the Act of Contrition before the Priest says, in English, “God, the Father of mercies, through the death and resurrection of his son has reconciled the world to himself and sent the Holy Spirit among us to forgive sins; through the ministry of the Church, may God grant you pardon and peace, and I absolve you of your sins in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Amen.” In the old rite, the priest says the absolution during the penitents Act of Contrition. The priest says, in Latin, “May our Lord Jesus Christ absolve you; and by His authority I absolve you from every bond of excommunication and interdict, so far as my power allows and your needs require. Thereupon, I absolve you of your sins in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost. Amen.” Then, after the penitent leaves, the priest says a prayer (again in Latin) for him: “May the Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ, the merits of the Blessed Virgin Mary and of all the saints obtain for you that whatever good you do or whatever evil you bear might merit for you the remission of your sins, the increase of grace and the reward of everlasting life.”
Confirmation: In the old rite of confirmation, the priest or bishop anoints the person about to be confirmed and says in Latin “I sign you with the Sign of the Cross, and I confirm you with the chrism of salvation. In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.” In the new rite (promulgated in 1971), the priest or bishop anoints the person about to be confirmed saying “N, receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.”
Matrimony: Some people have been kind enough to put their Extraordinary Form Mass Weddings on Youtube. Here, you can see the old rite of Matrimony for yourself:
youtube.com/watch?v=sa3F1C7FskQ&feature=related
youtube.com/watch?v=AgSYLo7Tq8Q&feature=related
There weren’t that many changes in the Rite of Matrimony (the new one was promulgated in 1969), but it now takes place in the middle of the Mass, after the Gospel, rather than before the Mass.
The actual words that the priest says upon the conferring of the sacrament have changed too. In the new rite, the priest says:
“You have declared your consent before the Church. May the Lord in his goodness strengthen your consent and fill you with his blessings. What God has joined, man must not divide. Amen.”
In the old rite, the priest says:
“I join you together in marriage, in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.”
Holy Orders: The Holy Orders rite hasn’t changed much. The Old Rite’s text says (the parts that were taken out I put in italics):
"Grant, we beseech You, Almighty Father, to these Your servants, the dignity of the
Priesthood; renew the spirit of holiness within them, so that they
may hold from You, O God, the office of the second rank in Your service and by the
example of their behavior afford a pattern of holy living.
The New Rite (promulgated in 1968), says:
“Grant, we beseech You, Almighty Father, to these Your servants, the dignity of the
Priesthood; renew within them the spirit of holiness. May they hold from You, the office
of the second rank in Your service and by the example of their behavior afford a pattern
of holy living.”
I’ve heard it stated that because “so that” was eliminated, the new rite is invalid. However, the sacrament is conferred by the laying on of hands, not by the above prayer.
Some of the surrounding ceremonies have been eliminated.
Anointing of the Sick: The Anointing of the Sick was called Extreme Unction in the pre-Vatican II days. The old rite of Extreme Unction there are six anointings and the priest says, again in Latin, “May the Lord forgive you by this holy anointing and His most loving
mercy whatever sins you have committed.” In the new rite (promulgated in 1972), there are two anointings and the priest says “Through this holy anointing and His most loving mercy, may the Lord help you by the grace of the Holy Spirit so that when you have been freed from your sins, He may save you and in His goodness raise you up.”
I hope I’ve been of service.
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ajpirc
Guest
Thank you, Paxvobis, for the summary.
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AJV
Guest
The sacrament is conferred by the above prayer - sacraments cannot be conferred with gestures only. The reason it can be held as valid is that oldest manuscripts also omit the “ut” so if that is invalid, then it doesn’t matter even if an “ut” was added later – the whole generations of clerical priestly ordinations were invalid.
To the OP: you can see the texts of most of the traditional rites here:
traditio.com/off.htm
I don’t recommend the site, but it gives the most of the rites with an accompanying English translation. Other rites are available, but in Latin only - though if you would like an English translation of a particular rite, you can mention it, and I will post one from files I have.
For comparison purposes, a good number of the new rites (though not always in their entirety, with all options) can be seen here:
ibreviary.com/m/preghiere.php?tipo=Rito
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ajpirc
Guest
Thank You AJV
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Corki
Guest
Also, the old rite of Confirmation included a slap on the cheek.
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ajpirc
Guest
My dad said he remembers that!
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5Loaves
Guest
When I was confirmed as an Anglican in 1962 the bishop “slapped” us, more like a pat, on the cheek. I know there were some RC Bishops also still doing that gesture at that time, no longer included. The sign for “confirmation” in American Sign Language is that gesture.
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Paxvobis
Guest
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