What About Bruno? Did He Get What He Deserve?

[OrdinaryMelkite]

The only thing that saddens me about Blaise Pascal is that there isn’t acutally a hell for him to burn in.

As for the old quote mining of Einstein strawman, I’m not going to rise to the bait.

Pardon my asking, but what did Ole Blaise ever do to you?

Is it because he was also a devout Christian who wrote on religion?

In that case, then Newton and Pasteur should also burn in that Hell.

And as to you “not rising to the bait”-----Einstein DID engage in philosophical investigations as well as scientific ones, whether you accept that or not. He was actually somewhat of a mystic. That is the only point I was making. The “quotes” you’re talking about you probably already know about and have decided to ignore. That’s fine----but they ARE there.

Newton engaged in Alchemy, Biblical Timelines and other things as well. Horror of Horrors. Kepler happened to be a Master Astrologer. Ye Gads!!!
That idea that Philosophy and Science should be kept separate came with the 17th century. The Pre-Socratics were nothing if not Scientists/Philosophers.
Newton would have actually called himself a “Philosopher” instead of a “Scientist.”
Kepler also would have used the same term. So your idea that Scientists should never be Philosophers has been largely ignored by History.

 

[JohnDamian]

Newton engaged in Alchemy, Biblical Timelines and other things as well. Horror of Horrors.

Yes, but Newton was naff at Biblical Timelines… He was four years out… Thinking the world was created in 4000 BC rather than 4004 BC… Ridiculous

Not to mention Kepler… But where did he get the figure 3992?.. Patently absurd.

 

[Spirithound]

And do you approve of anyone who disagrees with Church Doctrine being declared a heretic and punished?

A heretic is one who obstinately disagrees with Church doctrine. It is not necessarily everyone who disagrees with Church doctrine. I support heretics being punished.

 

[Moonstruck888]

Yes, but Newton was naff at Biblical Timelines… He was four years out… Thinking the world was created in 4000 BC rather than 4004 BC… Ridiculous

Not to mention Kepler… But where did he get the figure 3992?.. Patently absurd.

Am I to understand that because Newton and Kepler were a pair of bampots who indulged in all manner bizarre weird pursuits when they weren’t working that I should accept a 6010 year old Universe?

Please tell me that you didn’t for a second think that?

Newton, for all he was highly intelligent, had sanity that hung on pretty shakey nail. That’s common knowledge.

 

[Moonstruck888]

Pardon my asking, but what did Ole Blaise ever do to you?

Is it because he was also a devout Christian who wrote on religion?

In that case, then Newton and Pasteur should also burn in that Hell.

And as to you “not rising to the bait”-----Einstein DID engage in philosophical investigations as well as scientific ones, whether you accept that or not. He was actually somewhat of a mystic. That is the only point I was making. The “quotes” you’re talking about you probably already know about and have decided to ignore. That’s fine----but they ARE there.

Newton engaged in Alchemy, Biblical Timelines and other things as well. Horror of Horrors. Kepler happened to be a Master Astrologer. Ye Gads!!!
That idea that Philosophy and Science should be kept separate came with the 17th century. The Pre-Socratics were nothing if not Scientists/Philosophers.
Newton would have actually called himself a “Philosopher” instead of a “Scientist.”
Kepler also would have used the same term. So your idea that Scientists should never be Philosophers has been largely ignored by History.

Do you think I have ever for a second believed that being a scientist renders you immune to being a nut case?

Hell, I’m an eccentric who engages in mystical pursuits. My interests outside science include being in a rock band, making a short film about a coven of vampires, a long term infatuation with Miriam Simos, travelling around the world in a flight simulator and studying Crowleyanity.

It doesn’t mean I still can’t practice science competently and use it to seperate objective truth from subjective fancies.

 

[JohnDamian]

Moonstruck888:

Am I to understand that because Newton and Kepler were a pair of bampots who indulged in all manner bizarre weird pursuits when they weren’t working that I should accept a 6010 year old Universe?

Please tell me that you didn’t for a second think that?

I don’t think that; and even if I did; I’d believe it was 6013 years and 11 months exactly… But that’s besides the point.

If people are going to hold a particular belief; the least they can do is hold one that is internally congruent. The early errors of calculus from Bede are understandable for the times; but Kepler and Newton were noteably poor at applied mathematics.

Moonstruck888:

It doesn’t mean I still can’t practice science competently and use it to seperate objective truth from subjective fancies.

People should have congruous beliefs; otherwise one; or all of their beliefs are meaningless; and all of them are at the very least questionable.

 

[Moonstruck888]

I don’t think that; and even if I did; I’d believe it was 6013 years and 11 months exactly… But that’s besides the point.

If people are going to hold a particular belief; the least they can do is hold one that is internally congruent. The early errors of calculus from Bede are understandable for the times; but Kepler and Newton were noteably poor at applied mathematics.

The same Newton who invented differential calculus practically on a whim so he could solve two body motions? Newton wasn’t good at Maths.

ROFL!!!

You should read more.

People should have congruous beliefs; otherwise one; or all of their beliefs are meaningless; and all of them are at the very least questionable.

Agreed. Newton and Kepler were poor critical thinkers, intelligent as they were.

Or is it me you’re talking about? I only dabble in these things as a fancy, purely for fun.

 

[JohnDamian]

The same Newton who invented differential calculus practically on a whim so he could solve two body motions? Newton wasn’t good at Maths.

I was joking; because he calculated new earth creation date wrong, I mean, if one really must be a new earth creationist; at least get the date right!!!

Moonstruck888:

Agreed. Newton and Kepler were poor critical thinkers, intelligent as they were.

Or is it me you’re talking about? I only dabble in these things as a fancy, purely for fun.

I was mainly talking about Kepler and Newton. I have no reason to believe that you sincerely apply a standard of belief to your non-scientific activities or opinions; I have many subjective beliefs which I don’t subject to critical thinking in the same way as others; such as believing Berlioz is superior to Bach, or knowing Arnes operas are superior to Mozarts.

It is only when we apply different standards of belief to the same form of question that we have a problem. Newton; for example applied diametrically opposed methods for understanding the world; from Biblical Redaction on one hand; to Scientific Method on the other – this is incongruent.

 

[Moonstruck888]

It is only when we apply different standards of belief to the same form of question that we have a problem. Newton; for example applied diametrically opposed methods for understanding the world; from Biblical Redaction on one hand; to Scientific Method on the other – this is incongruent.

I’ll drink to that.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

Yes, but Newton was naff at Biblical Timelines… He was four years out… Thinking the world was created in 4000 BC rather than 4004 BC… Ridiculous

Not to mention Kepler… But where did he get the figure 3992?.. Patently absurd.

Yeah, you’re right…he also thought that certain metals would be turned into the fabled “philosopher’s stone” if they were allowed to “ferment.” Staunch alchemist to the end. Boyle was of the same persuasion. In fact, when Boyle thought he had discovered the Secret Of The Philosopher’s Stone, Newton actually wrote to him. warning him about not divulging the secret to the world because of the harm it would cause Humanity. He actually wrote that.

I was simply pointing out the pursuits of these and other Great Men to bolster my case that Philosophy and Science were not mutually exclusive until the 17th century, where a lot of “distinctions” began to be made and “separations” began to be implemented.
Remember, the man who most people now accept inaugurated the “scientific method” of today, Francis Bacon, was a Philosopher was well as a Scientist.

Let’s not forget that Mathematics (Calculus, Algebra, etc) is a type of Philosophy. Some of the greatest Philosophers of all time have been Mathematicians. Pascal, Pythagoras, Bertrand Russell, etc. But you’re right about Newton and Kepler, John Damian.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

I was joking; because he calculated new earth creation date wrong, I mean, if one really must be a new earth creationist; at least get the date right!!!

I was mainly talking about Kepler and Newton. I have no reason to believe that you sincerely apply a standard of belief to your non-scientific activities or opinions; I have many subjective beliefs which I don’t subject to critical thinking in the same way as others; such as believing Berlioz is superior to Bach, or knowing Arnes operas are superior to Mozarts.

It is only when we apply different standards of belief to the same form of question that we have a problem. Newton; for example applied diametrically opposed methods for understanding the world; from Biblical Redaction on one hand; to Scientific Method on the other – this is incongruent.

I agree too about Newton’s Biblical dating, John. You know what people say was the problem with Newton’s timeline? Particularly the “World History” one. It used the date of the start of the voyage of Jason and his Argonauts (!!!) as its starting point. Hmmmmm. Who knows. Maybe Ole Newtie knew something about World History we don’t know. Genuises live in worlds not of the ordinary variety…

Does not take away from Newton’s or Kepler’s or other Scientists’s Titanic Greatness. I consider Newton, in fact, as one of the top 10 Greatest Persons in History. And many History people agree with me. We can forgive him his “eccentricities.”

 

[Apollos]

until and unless you document bruno’s fate, I will ignore you.

 

[Apollos]

'm done.

 

[Leela]

Originally Posted by JDaniel
The Pope was trying to stop the death penalty throughout that part of the realm he could get to.

Can you support your assertion with any evidence?

No?

That’s what I thought.

 

[JohnDamian]

No?

That’s what I thought.

The Pope at the time; Pope Clement VIII was strongly in favor of the Death Penalty.

 

[Moonstruck888]

until and unless you document bruno’s fate, I will ignore you.

Ignore who?

 

[Leela]

The Pope at the time; Pope Clement VIII was strongly in favor of the Death Penalty.

Thanks. I guess that’s why I beaver heard back from JD on the issue.