What about the bloody Bible?

[TheBreak]

English is not my first language, so I apologize for any misspellings.

I wish and many others do the same, that the old testament is not part of the bible, I know I do. I’m pretty sure that so many people would convert to Christianity but the old testament standing in their way as it does to me now.

I need someone to understand me, to understand what I’m going through.

When I read the old testament with all the wars and the blood and the hard bloody rules that in it, I CAN NOT believe that this old testament God had anything to do with Jesus Christ, it just does not add up.

Some people say to me, that is the old testament, it was different time, but why God need to do all that wars and blood rivers?! When I think of God, I think of someone who would say no more slavery, no more killing, men and women are equal, spread peace to the world my people. No go and kill this and that, destroy this city and that city…etc

When I look to Jesus, I see someone different than the God in the old testament.

For example (This just an example,to make you understand me more, just example, no body get worked up) , Nazi guy come now and said I love the Jews, Gays and Black people. I come to you today with new nazi beliefs, yet, I do agree with what Hitler did by killing the Jews and gays. It doesn’t work, right? So, why does it work with the bible??

 

[latingirl]

I think you have alot of misconceptions about the Old Testament. However let me start off by saying that every single ideology, belief or religion in the world has had bloody moments. Even atheism, which doesn’t believe in any religion, has had bloody things. You can’t blame this on religion but only on humanity which is inclined to do wicked and evil.

Second thing, Hitler wasn’t following the Bible or the Christian religion but a religion he made up that came from German paganism and white supremacy.

 

[Steve_Jay]

English is not my first language, so I apologize for any misspellings.

I wish and many others do the same, that the old testament is not part of the bible, I know I do. I’m pretty sure that so many people would convert to Christianity but the old testament standing in their way as it does to me now.

I need someone to understand me, to understand what I’m going through.

When I read the old testament with all the wars and the blood and the hard bloody rules that in it, I CAN NOT believe that this old testament God had anything to do with Jesus Christ, it just does not add up.

Some people say to me, that is the old testament, it was different time, but why God need to do all that wars and blood rivers?! When I think of God, I think of someone who would say no more slavery, no more killing, men and women are equal, spread peace to the world my people. No go and kill this and that, destroy this city and that city…etc

When I look to Jesus, I see someone different than the God in the old testament.

For example (This just an example,to make you understand me more, just example, no body get worked up) , Nazi guy come now and said I love the Jews, Gays and Black people. I come to you today with new nazi beliefs, yet, I do agree with what Hitler did by killing the Jews and gays. It doesn’t work, right? So, why does it work with the bible??

Hello TheBreak
the title of the thread might need toning down but I can understand where you are coming from.
God gave Abraham a promise that was for the whole of mankind. For It was to come about by making Abraham’s children a holy nation. The world was lost and condemned and God was going to rescue it. The nation flirted with unholy nations and that kept the nation from becoming holy. God was at times ruthless in his determination to save mankind. So even in those parts we don’t like God was loving mankind. Jesus had to born for the sake of mankind. He was born to a woman who was holy.

Jesus has come now so the situation is very different.

That’s the short of it but I hope it helps.

God bless you.

 

[TheBreak]

I think you have alot of misconceptions about the Old Testament. However let me start off by saying that every single ideology, belief or religion in the world has had bloody moments. Even atheism, which doesn’t believe in any religion, has had bloody things. You can’t blame this on religion but only on humanity which is inclined to do wicked and evil.

Second thing, Hitler wasn’t following the Bible or the Christian religion but a religion he made up that came from German paganism and white supremacy.

I understand what you’re saying, but why does God need to do that too? Why did he ask his people to go and kill others, not just killing men, not just women, but kids. killing KIDS, picture little boy baby month old was killed by Israeli people which God asked them to do so? What reason could be that justify such thing???

I’m talking here about the Bible, Christianity, I’m not talking about Islam or atheism, so let’s focus of that please.

 

[mountee]

Clearly during your confession the priest thought your lenten sacrifice was enough of a penance. Since I take most things at their face value I would just continue on the path I would have followed for Lent and be satisfied that I was doing what was asked of me.

 

[fhansen]

English is not my first language, so I apologize for any misspellings.

I wish and many others do the same, that the old testament is not part of the bible, I know I do. I’m pretty sure that so many people would convert to Christianity but the old testament standing in their way as it does to me now.

I need someone to understand me, to understand what I’m going through.

When I read the old testament with all the wars and the blood and the hard bloody rules that in it, I CAN NOT believe that this old testament God had anything to do with Jesus Christ, it just does not add up.

Some people say to me, that is the old testament, it was different time, but why God need to do all that wars and blood rivers?! When I think of God, I think of someone who would say no more slavery, no more killing, men and women are equal, spread peace to the world my people. No go and kill this and that, destroy this city and that city…etc

When I look to Jesus, I see someone different than the God in the old testament.

For example (This just an example,to make you understand me more, just example, no body get worked up) , Nazi guy come now and said I love the Jews, Gays and Black people. I come to you today with new nazi beliefs, yet, I do agree with what Hitler did by killing the Jews and gays. It doesn’t work, right? So, why does it work with the bible??

God has been working in this world, via His chosen people, to bring and restore that world-His creation- into greater and greater alignment with His will. The Catechism teaches that God chose to create this world “in statu viae”, in a state of journeying, towards perfection. It began, OTOH, in an extremely dark, ignorant, and discordant place, where God had been effectively cut out of the life of man, and sheer selfishness reigned in man’s dealings with others. Not so different from today in many ways except that, as a result of Gods interventions, increasing amounts of light have also been introduced into this world-and whether we know it or not, that light has challenged and influenced us all.

And, IMO, the nature of God that the people of Israel identified and obeyed was often one much less well defined and understood, still made more in their image than in His own, catering to their own agenda, until later, when the world was ready-barely-for the full revelation of His nature, which Jesus revealed as infinitely trustworthy, merciful, humble, even, and unconditionally loving of man.

Rather than giving up on us He entered the darkness and He’s drawing, without forcing us, as we’re willing, out of the darkness and into intimate knowledge of Himself, into spiritual maturity, into beings who love as He does, into increasing alignment with His will. A much tougher job than we realize. In fact, Jesus came and died, the way He did, to make that very point.

Also remember that, ultimately, it’s the role of the Church, and not the bible, to receive and accurately proclaim the truth regarding the nature and will of God.

 

[KathleenGee]

Dear Break…

A priest told us in Bible study that so many lay people do not like the Old Testament for the very reasons you gave. I don’t like reading those passages either and avoid them.

But what you have to realize is that Original Sin had warped the human race so much. This behavior you are seeing is the result of man turning away from the One True God and the problem is not God and the Bible, but people leaving faith in God. They are reaping what they sow.

When God came to the Hebrew people, realize this, He was coming to spiritual infants. He had to come to them on their level, which was primitive…eye for eye. This is how the culture of peoples was. He had to literally raise them, teach them what to eat and what not, how to dress, how to practice hygiene, how to settle domestic disputes, the laws concerning marriage and crimes, to how to even build His temple, how to worship and how the priests were even to dress and eat, etc.

You see this fratricide even today among ancient peoples who are not capable of hearing the Good News.

You should study ancient Church History and see how the faith essentially became the foundation for Western Civilization…its hospitals, schools, agricultural science, documentation, foundations of science, law, Christian philosophy have brought us so far out and away from ancient times.

The remedy to all of this concern is the loving and gentle Jesus Who revealed to His apostles that He is the face of God, and later, how He now called the apostles His friends.

It is Jesus Christ who has changed life and the power of sin and death, to make not only us new, but all creation. We see Christ’s handiwork in all the benevolent works of man today that venerate and respect nature, and do much good for the world, inspite of the darkness surrounding us.

So we must assert the faith of Jesus into this world, to those who are in most in need through our prayers and penance for them. When we unite our daily crosses with the Cross of the Lord and we follow Him, we break the presence of evil that seems to reflect those ancient pages of the Old Testament.

Christ sets us free and likewise moves through us to find Him more in the giving of ourselves and our very life in Christ to others. This is how we bring His light into this world of darkness.

The world is a desert and when the desert comes to bloom in this world, it will be the flower of Jesus Christ, most radiant and glorified by all creatures. The day is coming and so have hope.

 

[Steve_Jay]

I understand what you’re saying, but why does God need to do that too? Why did he ask his people to go and kill others, not just killing men, not just women, but kids. killing KIDS, picture little boy baby month old was killed by Israeli people which God asked them to do so? What reason could be that justify such thing???

I’m talking here about the Bible, Christianity, I’m not talking about Islam or atheism, so let’s focus of that please.

I had a problem with that. The Canaanites. Why would God order such a thing?

I have a book here on the Archaeology of the Holy lands. Apparently the surrounding nations considered Canaanite’ practises abominable. That is significant because the surrounding nations were bad enough in their practices. We don’t know exactly what the Canaanites were up to. I suspect that their evil had contaminated their children to a great degree. They might have carried a dreadful disease that could have wiped out the Israelites if they had remained there. No holy nation would have meant no saviour for mankind.

 

[Margy1948]

English is not my first language, so I apologize for any misspellings.

I wish and many others do the same, that the old testament is not part of the bible, I know I do. I’m pretty sure that so many people would convert to Christianity but the old testament standing in their way as it does to me now.

I need someone to understand me, to understand what I’m going through.

When I read the old testament with all the wars and the blood and the hard bloody rules that in it, I CAN NOT believe that this old testament God had anything to do with Jesus Christ, it just does not add up.

Some people say to me, that is the old testament, it was different time, but why God need to do all that wars and blood rivers?! When I think of God, I think of someone who would say no more slavery, no more killing, men and women are equal, spread peace to the world my people. No go and kill this and that, destroy this city and that city…etc

When I look to Jesus, I see someone different than the God in the old testament.

For example (This just an example,to make you understand me more, just example, no body get worked up) , Nazi guy come now and said I love the Jews, Gays and Black people. I come to you today with new nazi beliefs, yet, I do agree with what Hitler did by killing the Jews and gays. It doesn’t work, right? So, why does it work with the bible??

I know what you mean, shocking that Isiah, the prophet, walked around with no clothes on for three years and then ate the bible so God would be within him!! In today’s world he would be arrested and MAYBE sent to the hospital for evaluation.
I also have trouble with the passion of Christ, it seems like everyone wants to focus on the torture, the crucifixion and agony in the garden instead of the Resurrection.
Jesus had a lot more respect for women than his followers, and I’m surprised that that fact made it thru with all of the translations.
I personally got ahold of the Jewish translations of the Old testament because they were extremely devout and incredibly picky about every word, so I believe that theirs is a truer translation.

 

[KathleenGee]

The Canaanites, if I remember correctly, practiced child sacrifice. IF so, they would be guilty of such a heinous crime.

 

[Dorothy]

I understand what you’re saying, but why does God need to do that too? Why did he ask his people to go and kill others, not just killing men, not just women, but kids. killing KIDS, picture little boy baby month old was killed by Israeli people which God asked them to do so? What reason could be that justify such thing???

I’m talking here about the Bible, Christianity, I’m not talking about Islam or atheism, so let’s focus of that please.

God did not desire those things because He delighted in war. The Israelites had to be a pure race, believing in one God, as He revealed Himself to them. That is because the Incarnation of the Second Person of the Blessed Trinity was to be born of that race. We can be sure that God is just to all that died in those wars, we do not need to question that.

Please be aware that the pagan nations that had to be wiped out carried out many abominations. They practiced temple prostitution, and sacrificing their babies in the fire.

God commanded the Israelites not to marry the pagans,because then the temptation to do what they did would be great. Ahab, a Jew, married Jezebel a pagan, and before long many of the Israelites were worshipping Baal. This was not supposed to happen to the Israelites, as God was preparing them for the birth of the Messiah to take place in their race!

 

[bzkoss236]

Without the Old Testament, you cannot know why we need Jesus, or why Jesus is the Messiah. Just like when someone becomes a Christian, they may have led a terrible life before, and they may rather not have had it, but if it didn’t happen, would they have become a Christian? It’s the same way with the Bible. Without the Old Testament, people would not know why we need to be Christians, or have as great an idea of who God is and who Christ is.

 

[dmar198]

English is not my first language, so I apologize for any misspellings.

I wish and many others do the same, that the old testament is not part of the bible, I know I do. I’m pretty sure that so many people would convert to Christianity but the old testament standing in their way as it does to me now.

I need someone to understand me, to understand what I’m going through.

When I read the old testament with all the wars and the blood and the hard bloody rules that in it, I CAN NOT believe that this old testament God had anything to do with Jesus Christ, it just does not add up.

Some people say to me, that is the old testament, it was different time, but why God need to do all that wars and blood rivers?! When I think of God, I think of someone who would say no more slavery, no more killing, men and women are equal, spread peace to the world my people. No go and kill this and that, destroy this city and that city…etc

When I look to Jesus, I see someone different than the God in the old testament.

For example (This just an example,to make you understand me more, just example, no body get worked up) , Nazi guy come now and said I love the Jews, Gays and Black people. I come to you today with new nazi beliefs, yet, I do agree with what Hitler did by killing the Jews and gays. It doesn’t work, right? So, why does it work with the bible??

I think you have to realize that God was not pleased with those things and they were a punishment for sin. God said pretty explicitly that He does not delight in the death of the wicked, but that they turn and do penance and live. If you understand that the punishments God inflicted are to be viewed in a negative light, then the horror they produce in you starts to make more sense: it is horrible. That’s the point. God doesn’t delight in these things any more than America delights in the electric chair or the intravenous injection. These things are evil, but they are the result of sin. The blame for them is not to be placed on God, but on the people who brought it upon themselves. I hope that helps.

 

[Monte_RCMS]

The Old Testament tells us the particular difficulties that the Israelites encountered.

But, keep in mind that the other nations, not described in the Old Testament, were going through the exact same wars and attacks.

In fact, if you take a look at the regions of the globe where those old nations used to be, the nations of today are doing the exact same things.

The Syrians are still up to it.

The Babylonians … now parts of Iraq, ditto.

Any country where people existed four or five thousand years ago, were all doing the same terrible things.

It was part of the world’s culture for the time.

We, today, have much less of this, owing to the spread of Christianity and Christian ideas and Christian practices.

But, the world as a whole has not [yet] achieved the peace that we all seek.

 

[petra22]

You are scaring me. What is HE going to do to us for our practices of killing babies, prostitution and worshiping false gods???

 

[Steve_Jay]

The Old Testament tells us the particular difficulties that the Israelites encountered.

But, keep in mind that the other nations, not described in the Old Testament, were going through the exact same wars and attacks.

In fact, if you take a look at the regions of the globe where those old nations used to be, the nations of today are doing the exact same things.

The Syrians are still up to it.

The Babylonians … now parts of Iraq, ditto.

Any country where people existed four or five thousand years ago, were all doing the same terrible things.

It was part of the world’s culture for the time.

We, today, have much less of this, owing to the spread of Christianity and Christian ideas and Christian practices.

But, the world as a whole has not [yet] achieved the peace that we all seek.

Hello Monte CMS
what you are saying is true. That is going to be the case while people make gods of their own ideas and notions and see in them the ideology of the world.
One thing Jesus didn’t promise was peace. We can have an inner peace and the world may experience a false peace but true peace can’t reign until Jesus returns.
The world will teach hatred for the enemy but Jesus tought the opposite. Its when we learn to love our enemies that we begin to learn we may become friends.