What about the Coptic Orthodox Church?

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pyro_alchemist

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What is the Vatican position on the Coptic Orthodox Church? Are their holy orders and other sacraments considered valid as are the more mainstream Christian Orthodox Churches? I am very intrigued by the antiquity of their religion (they claim to be the oldest Christian church) but wonder about their theology. I understand they have a different New Testament canon with one or more “gnostic gospels” included.
 
pyro_alchemist said:
What is the Vatican position on the Coptic Orthodox Church? Are their holy orders and other sacraments considered valid as are the more mainstream Christian Orthodox Churches? I am very intrigued by the antiquity of their religion (they claim to be the oldest Christian church) but wonder about their theology. I understand they have a different New Testament canon with one or more “gnostic gospels” included.
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Yes, they have valid sacraments. (which specifically requires valid orders.)

They are, by the standard, In the same position as the Eastern Orthodox: in material schism, but not heretical.

They are not in communion with the Eastern Orthodox, either.
 
I think the Virgin Mary appeared in a number of non Catholic places didn’t she? And people got converted. So I do not think her appearance makes a particular place more authentic. I do not dispute the image, just the comment the last poster made.
 
JPUSC said:
If apparitions are valid indicators of some authenticity, then the appearance of Our Lady at a Coptic Church in Zeitoun, Egypt which was approved by the Roman Catholic and Orthodox Churches is noteworthy.

http://www.marypages.com/zeitoen2.jpg
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I always thought that there was something fishy about that image.

I can’t help it, I am naturally skeptical.

I am not stating that I don’t believe it, I can only reserve my opinion.
 
I understand they have a different New Testament canon with one or more “gnostic gospels” included.
**This is not true.

I know that His Holiness Pope Shenouda wishes to see restoration of communion with both Rome and Orthodoxy.**
 
pyro_alchemist said:
I understand they have a different New Testament canon with one or more “gnostic gospels” included.
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The Ethiopian Church has a broader and a narrower canon, but I don’t believe any are gnostic.

Also, if I remember correctly Marduk states that Rome and Alexandria have a formal agreement between their respective churches, though I’m not sure if this covers holy orders. I do think they recognize the apostolic succession.
 
NoWings said:
The Ethiopian Church has a broader and a narrower canon, but I don’t believe any are gnostic.

Also, if I remember correctly Marduk states that Rome and Alexandria have a formal agreement between their respective churches, though I’m not sure if this covers holy orders. I do think they recognize the apostolic succession.
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I am unaware of any pastoral agreements between the CC and the COC. From what I understand, it seems that for the most part the Coptic Orthodox do not recognize Catholic sacraments and do not permit their faithful to intermarry with Catholics. I’m not sure if that’s their official stance, but it appears to be the common opinion in CO circles. The Armenian Apostolic Church and Syriac Orthodox Churches (who are in full communion with the Coptic Orthodox) however, do recognize Catholic sacraments and have some limited pastoral agreements with the CC. This is also true for the Assyrian Church of the East.
 
pyro_alchemist said:
What is the Vatican position on the Coptic Orthodox Church? Are their holy orders and other sacraments considered valid as are the more mainstream Christian Orthodox Churches? I am very intrigued by the antiquity of their religion (they claim to be the oldest Christian church) but wonder about their theology. I understand they have a different New Testament canon with one or more “gnostic gospels” included.
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They follow the theology of the Alexandrian fathers, especially that of St. Cyril. They are orthodox in every aspect.
 
StillWondering said:
I think the Virgin Mary appeared in a number of non Catholic places didn’t she? And people got converted. So I do not think her appearance makes a particular place more authentic. I do not dispute the image, just the comment the last poster made.
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Not that I am aware of. And, I would not compare any of the orthodox churches with non catholic ones myself. I don’t understand the need to make those type of distinctions when they were all at one time one.
I have yet to see an apparition that interests me. Perhpas I would need to see Fatima though, to really say that. But, they all sound like hoaxes to me.
 
NoWings said:
The Ethiopian Church has a broader and a narrower canon, but I don’t believe any are gnostic.

Also, if I remember correctly Marduk states that Rome and Alexandria have a formal agreement between their respective churches, though I’m not sure if this covers holy orders. I do think they recognize the apostolic succession.
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One thing–NEVER call an Ethiopian a Copt.
 
One thing about the apparitions of the Theotokos in Zeitoun:

The Greek Orthodox (Chalcedonian), Coptic, and Coptic Catholic Patriarchs of Alexandria–who are much closer to the site and in a better position to investigate these appearances than most people here–are satisfied that they are genuine and have inscribed this into their respective calendars.

I was told by a Coptic priest that it led to the conversion and baptism of thousands of Moslems–who risked their lives to do so.

So, what do you think?

How many Moslems were baptized as a result of the apparitions at Medjugorje?
 
bpbasilphx said:
One thing about the apparitions of the Theotokos in Zeitoun:

The Greek Orthodox (Chalcedonian), Coptic, and Coptic Catholic Patriarchs of Alexandria–who are much closer to the site and in a better position to investigate these appearances than most people here–are satisfied that they are genuine and have inscribed this into their respective calendars.

I was told by a Coptic priest that it led to the conversion and baptism of thousands of Moslems–who risked their lives to do so.

So, what do you think?

How many Moslems were baptized as a result of the apparitions at Medjugorje?
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Medjugorje isn’t approved, but Guadalupe converted the entire Latin American continent. This isn’t a contest. 😛
 
The image posted looks fishy, but if it’s on the calendar and led to that many conversions, it certainly should be real. I’m naturally a bit sceptical, since I’m living through the whole Medjugorje thing.😛
 
Note from Moderator:

Out of respect for the Bishop of Mostar and his request to not further discuss or promote the alleged apparitions of Medjugorje, Catholic Answers Forums has included it in the Banned Topics list since June, 2006. Before that time, it was included on the list because of its status as a private revelation without approval from the church, so discussion was limited to the church’s stance on the alleged apparitions. Bishop Ratko Perić has since clarified the church’s stance, which the Vatican spokesman Joaquin Navarro-Valls supported and defended.

I understand the context in which the references were made on this thread, but I also know that any mention of it will precede an unending flow of arguments about Medjugorje, which will not only be off-topic for the Eastern Catholicism forum and this thread and in opposition to the Banned Topics list, but will also quickly become uncharitable and unmanageable. I believe all here would appreciate the prevention of this course of events.

Thank you for your assistance!

May God Bless You Abundantly,
Catherine Grant
Eastern Catholicism Moderator
 
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