What am I?

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LC:
Relax – what you said is certainly a reasonable thought when first told about a virgin birth. And if that child grew up to be a human person like everyone else, all of us would probably say the same thing! It certainly is common to make up lies in order to escape persecution, isn’t it?

But the problem is that you can’t stop there. Ample evidence exists that this Child was not a normal human person! You should evaluate the merits of Christianity based on the person of Jesus – His life, death, and resurrection – as told by reliable eyewitnesses. Then you’d have to conclude that if these miracles of His are possible, then gee, it might also be possible for an all-powerful God to also arrange for a virgin birth.
 
brumano said:
Here’s a question that might help you to believe in the real God: What is the greater proof of the existence of God beyond the reality of our own existence; is it life after death or is that a virgin should conceive and bear a son?
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Actually, from an average sinner’s perspective: I’d find the virgin birth far less problematic. Other species do it all the time. The tweaking of the biological systems to make it possible in human life is, aiui, far less difficult that the reversing of entropy needed to bring someone out of death.

But both are beyond “nature.”

ICXC NIKA
 
Laughing_Crow said:
Sorry everyoen for takign so long to respond, my computer died an I only just got it back up and working a few days ago:o. Damn trojan viruses :mad:

OK, im gonna go hide behind my walls because I know this will likely offend ALOT of you, but to understand my views and why i stayed away from religion so long I have to tell you. as an atheist I simply believed the ‘virgin mary’ had an affair and, as in that time adultery was one of the worst crimes someone could commit, she lied about it to save her neck. Now im gonna run over the hills and wait for the s*** storm to die down

… safe to come out?

as for the idea that God is proven through life after death, I think more along the Hindu and Buddhist lines of the wheel of life and reincarnation. Maybe this formula was created by God, maybe it has always exsisted and always will exsist. Maybe we are all sims and the player hasnt gotten bored and sent Godzilla at us 😃
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Ah well, remember I said it might help you.
 
GEddie said:
Actually, from an average sinner’s perspective: I’d find the virgin birth far less problematic. Other species do it all the time. The tweaking of the biological systems to make it possible in human life is, aiui, far less difficult that the reversing of entropy needed to bring someone out of death.

But both are beyond “nature.”

ICXC NIKA
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Well from a greater than average sinner’s perspective I know the virgin birth is absoloutely impossible except for God in whom all things are possible, whatever or however other species do what they do is also through the will of God who is able to create entirely from Himself. No amount or kind of tweaking of biological systems will produce anything but abominations, and even God Himself will never again beget another Son, so if life after death in some form is proof of Him it will occur the exact number of times equal to the number of all human beings who are ever conceived in all of time but the virgin birth of the only Son will still only have occured once and only once in all of time making it, or Him I should say, the greater proof by singularity than all the other proofs combined.

Yeah I thinks so, and the Resurrection of the Body is alot more than reversal of entropy
 
Laughing_Crow said:
Sorry everyoen for takign so long to respond, my computer died an I only just got it back up and working a few days ago:o. Damn trojan viruses :mad:

OK, im gonna go hide behind my walls because I know this will likely offend ALOT of you, but to understand my views and why i stayed away from religion so long I have to tell you. as an atheist I simply believed the ‘virgin mary’ had an affair and, as in that time adultery was one of the worst crimes someone could commit, she lied about it to save her neck. Now im gonna run over the hills and wait for the s*** storm to die down

… safe to come out?

as for the idea that God is proven through life after death, I think more along the Hindu and Buddhist lines of the wheel of life and reincarnation. Maybe this formula was created by God, maybe it has always exsisted and always will exsist. Maybe we are all sims and the player hasnt gotten bored and sent Godzilla at us 😃
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You may have offended many non theists by this statement, let me explain why.
You “believe” the Virgin Mary had an affair, yet you would have to believe she existed to believe that.
Explain your basis for believing her existance.
 
StrawberryJam said:
You may have offended many non theists by this statement, let me explain why.
You “believe” the Virgin Mary had an affair, yet you would have to believe she existed to believe that.
Explain your basis for believing her existance.
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All stories, myths and legends all have a grain of truth. That was my thinking and reasoning at the time. YES there was most likely a Mary and YES there was no doubt a Jesus Christ, there is enough evidence to prove he exsisted. WAS he the son of God however? I dont know.
 
Laughing Crow, the ideas and doubts that you have expressed have all at some time been voiced by others. Wrestling with God is paradigmatic to most religions. None of us understands things all the time and few really get to a solid understanding at any one time. This may be a necessary thing for humans. Stasis leads to stagnation. Settled issues tend to be ignored over time. This is one of the bases of Zen thought, and also Christian thought. Keep going in this vein, but also consider the other part of Christianity, that of community to get to the whole.
 
Laughing_Crow said:
All stories, myths and legends all have a grain of truth. That was my thinking and reasoning at the time. YES there was most likely a Mary and YES there was no doubt a Jesus Christ, there is enough evidence to prove he exsisted. WAS he the son of God however? I dont know.
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Did you mean to say there was no doubt a Jesus? The use of Jesus Christ leaves no doubt about his being the son of God.
 
SJ, the Koran calls Jesus “Issa ibn Miriam.” This identifies Him as a prophet without recognizing that He is part of the Godhead, since in their view it would violate the idea of one God.
 
Oldtimer_7 said:
SJ, the Koran calls Jesus “Issa ibn Miriam.” This identifies Him as a prophet without recognizing that He is part of the Godhead, since in their view it would violate the idea of one God.
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That is calling Jesus a prophet, son of Mary.

Oldtimer, don’t forget that the name Jesus is one thing. The name Jesus Christ is quite another thing.
 
StrawberryJam said:
That is calling Jesus a prophet, son of Mary.

Oldtimer, don’t forget that the name Jesus is one thing. The name Jesus Christ is quite another thing.
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Old norse names could be made up with names of the Norse gods, so does that mean they were gods as well?

‘Jesus Christ’ does not, in my mind, make him automatically the son of god. It is just a name.
 
Laughing_Crow said:
Old norse names could be made up with names of the Norse gods, so does that mean they were gods as well?

‘Jesus Christ’ does not, in my mind, make him automatically the son of god. It is just a name.
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Christ is a unique name.

Would you be able to explain to me how the name **Christ **is just another name?
 
Laughing_Crow said:
Old norse names could be made up with names of the Norse gods, so does that mean they were gods as well?

‘Jesus Christ’ does not, in my mind, make him automatically the son of god. It is just a name.
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CHRIST is not just a name.

The original form is CHRISTOS, Greek XPICTOC (using the easier to type lunate sigma), meaning Messiah.

God Bless and ICXC (IESSOUS CHRISTOS) NIKA.
 
GEddie said:
CHRIST is not just a name.

The original form is CHRISTOS, Greek XPICTOC (using the easier to type lunate sigma), meaning Messiah.

God Bless and ICXC (IESSOUS CHRISTOS) NIKA.
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When anyone uses the name Jesus Christ, they seperate themselves from other theists.
All know, theists and non thiests what this importance is in a name.

It is not just any other name used lightly.

There would be no reason to think the word Chist is “just another name”

Belief in God or not, all can see that the title of Christ belongs to one man alone.
 
Laughing Crow, SJ got the point that Christ is a title. In English it could be written out , Jesus, the one anointed by God. Jesus is a variation of the name Joshua.

Accepting Jesus as the anointed one is what marks Christians of the three Abrahamic religions. Jews accept the idea of a messiah and Muslims of a maadi. They do not recognize Jesus as either. Christians see Jesus as the fulfillment of Hebrew prophecies, which are common to all three religions. In fact, in the Book of Matthew, there are fourteen times when Matthew explicitly points out where Hebrew Scripture is fulfilled.

Then there is the 22nd Psalm. The name is a late innovation, since the Psalms were known for most of their existence by the first lines. Thus, when Jesus is on the cross and cries out, “My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?”, one view is that he is alerting the crowd to the fulfillment of this psalm in their presence. A scan of Orthodox, Catholic, Anglican, and Lutheran commentary on this psalm indicates that there is agreement that this psalm is prophetic of Jesus Passion on the cross.
 
OK OK OK. I indentified the word ‘Christ’ as just a name, not a title etc. So allow me to amend my previous post to say "I know there was A Jesus, but I do not know if he was the son of God’
 
Laughing Crow, you are way ahead of a lot of Christians in your understanding. There seems to be a large group who think that Jesus Christ is the son of John and Mary Christ.

I would love to hear your point of view on comparing Jesus’ Passion in Matthew 27:15-54 and the 22nd Psalm. As an associated question, how do you look on the idea of prophecy?
 
Oldtimer_7 said:
Laughing Crow, you are way ahead of a lot of Christians in your understanding. There seems to be a large group who think that Jesus Christ is the son of John and Mary Christ.
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Or that He had a middle name that started with “H”.🙂

ICXC NIKA
 
Joseph and Mary! I think my wife switched my coffee to decaf! Right you are GEddie!👍
 
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