What are grounds for anullment of marriage?

[Phemie]

I think it is a shame. I know when my husband and I did our Pre-CANA it brought up many things that we had not realized and gave us an opportunity to talk about them with a deacon who was in a long, happy marriage. I believe that these types of situations could be prevented if a tool like the FOCUS was used prior to the vows in order to prevent the kind of heartache the OP is sharing with us.

I’m not a good one to comment on any of this since I never had to do any preparation when I got married 33 years ago. DH did some since he was a non-Catholic but he did all of his on the military base where he was stationed at the time. I, OTOH, saw my priest once for the prenuptial questionaire and then I saw him again at the back of the church when he welcomed us just before we walked up the aisle.

 

[joandarc2008]

We had almost a full year of counseling for our marriage prep. You really can’t say there was room for any suprises. However, I also have the in-laws from you know where so we had to be very strong to survive the family drama on his side as a couple.

God bless,

 

[Valke2]

What are some valid claims for nullity of marriage?

Under New York Law, if one spouse was underage or mentally incompetent. Failure to consumate. Those are the only ones I can recall. Oh, and incesteous marriages.

 

[vstead]

My boyfriend, whos catholic married young.As he wasnt a practising catholic, he says he was happy that she believed in God on some level. They had a son and differences became apparent, the biggest one being that she told him it was stupid to believe in God. She also has very domineering parents who decided that their grandson would be growing up as aethiest. My question is “Are these, grounds for annulment?” (They got divorced). Also, as she wasnt “into God” she insisted they wouldnt marry in a church, they were married on a carribean beach by the hotel manager. Was this still a valid marriage in the eyes of God. It would be nice to hear that his marriage could be annulled, but should you not be clear on these things before you marry?

 

[chevalier]

My boyfriend, whos catholic married young.As he wasnt a practising catholic, he says he was happy that she believed in God on some level. They had a son and differences became apparent, the biggest one being that she told him it was stupid to believe in God. She also has very domineering parents who decided that their grandson would be growing up as aethiest. My question is “Are these, grounds for annulment?” (They got divorced). Also, as she wasnt “into God” she insisted they wouldnt marry in a church, they were married on a carribean beach by the hotel manager. Was this still a valid marriage in the eyes of God. It would be nice to hear that his marriage could be annulled, but should you not be clear on these things before you marry?

1. He was Catholic. The wedding wasn’t conducted in a church according to the form prescribed in Canon Law. Lack of form is grounds of nullity. The marriage is probably null with 99.99% probability. This would be a documentary process, i.e. a short procedure for nullity instead of a normal trial.
2. Being so much under parental influence that one can’t act on his own is likely grounds of nullity. You don’t really need to examine this if form wasn’t observed, though.
3. There may be other grounds but there’s no need to waste time on them if form wasn’t observed.

Conclusion: Go to the priest and talk, bring the papers to him and start the process.

 

[joandarc2008]

Under New York Law, if one spouse was underage or mentally incompetent. Failure to consumate. Those are the only ones I can recall. Oh, and incesteous marriages.

I think the OP was more interested in Canon Law than state anullments.

God bless,

 

[vstead]

Thanks so much for the reply Chevalier. Ive not spoken of this before. I would love to put another question to you. Growing up rather strict catholics and very happy i wondered why i knew nothing of my parents marriage. Why didnt her parents come over from Ireland (my mum is irish) for the happy day. Then at 18, my mum told me the story. She met dad, fell head over heels and after saying yes to his marriage proposal, my dad revealed he had been married before and divorced. After much torment she says she loved him too much to walk away and they married. This is a strange thingThey have had 40 years of happiness, 5 children. But her whole life has been shrouded by sadness at the “terrible sin” she committed in marrying a divorcee and the fact that she is not married to dad in the eyes of God. (A priest at our parish who knew their situation would refer to my dad as “your boyfriend” as if to demonstrate that they are not recognized. As she gets older, i note that she is truly tortured by this even though as she says she has 5 children and a perfect husband. Its all a big fake to her. I started by saying i had a question. Maybe of a possible annulment for my dad but this was loooked into at the time they met.(1960’s). I think what im asking is “Is the annulment of the first marriage worth looking at again. She has told me that they have lived as"brother and sister” for the last twenty years. I know the feeling as i am going through the same thing myself now, however Chevalier has given me hope that i can get married in the church.

 

[vstead]

Whenever my friend wants to catholic bash( her favourite pastime) i always hope i can come back with a good defence to the catholic criticism of the day. Speaking of annulments and the whole catholic church being as corrupt as anything, she asks "Why is it so hard for genuine good catholics to get annulments yet the very rich Princess caroline can get 2 annulments relatively easy?

 

[Godfollower]

Why is it so hard for genuine good catholics to get annulments yet the very rich . . . can get 2 annulments relatively easy?

I can’t speak to any particular person such as the one you named, because (A) I don’t know anything about that particular case, and (B) it wouldn’t be proper to gossip about a particular individual. But we can talk in general about this sort of thing.

“Good” Catholics should in theory find it harder to get a decree of nullity. You will find if you do the research that, at least in the U.S., it’s the conservative Catholic theologians who argue that the high rate of annulments in the U.S. is proper – because there are so many Catholics who have bought into the country’s prevailing view of “well, we’ll just get a divorce if it doesn’t work out” – which invalidates the Sacrament of Matrimony (since a valid Sacrament requires an intent to marry permanently). After all, if you’re a “good” Catholic, you should marry correctly, while a “bad” Catholic might not.

So, for example, if Alice and Bob, both Catholics, marry in the Catholic Church, and either one of them lacks the proper intent to marry (plans on divorcing, intends to have no children, etc.), then they are in fact entitled to an annulment. On the other hand, if Cindy and David, both Catholics, marry in the Catholic Church, and both of them intend to marry in the sense that the Church uses, then they are not entitled to an annulment.

It’s not that “good” Catholics are punished by not getting annulments, while “bad” Catholics get away with it; it’s that “good” Catholics did it right the first time, while “bad” Catholics didn’t.

 

[MCGar]

Is a husband’s refusal to have intercourse without a condom grounds for an annulemnt? I also seriously question his ability to selflessly love a child (he cannot selflessly love me.) PS - I had to ASK for relations on the honeymoon. And he was TICKED that we spent 150 pr night on a 3 night hotel stay 1.5 hours from our house. This was for the honeymoon. It is both our first marriage. He makes 100K per year, and I’m not far behind.

He does not answer phone calls EVER. He will not speak to any of his family on the phone form more than a minute. I AM NOT KIDDING. Were I to die in a horrible accident, I would be alone - as I cannot depend on him as my emergency contact.

I have no family, and this behaviour is intensely painful to me. Had I known it would be like this, I would NEVER had married him. it’s only been 6 months, and I DREAD what the future holds (he cannot talk about where he sees us in 5 years. we live in a dive of a rented row house…althought we’ve got 250K in savings, combined. about equal each.)

Do you suggest I divorce him ? I’m 36, with no family, have never felt loved, and feel like I’m excluded from the human family. The only reason I’m not leaving is that i think there “might” be a chance with him…I am a faithful catholic…and feel I’m being punsihed in some way,…what’s up? Is God punhishing me becuase my mom and dad were not married in the church - and it was her 2nd marriage? And she sent away her son from her first marriage? Who I was fobidden by my father to have any contact with? And who forbid me to attend my brother’s funeral? (He - my half brother- died from Chron’s complications about 10 years ago)…

TigerKitty, your post really disturbed me.
First, I don’t know a whole bunch about annullments but I do know when I married (recently) that part of our interview with the priest we had to affirm our openness to life (procreation). If your husband lied about that to your priest in order to marry you and he turns around and refuses intercourse without contraception, then it looks like you have a good case to look into annullment (or Declaration of Nullity).

But what really bothers me about your post is that he has all these very strict and almost bizarre forms of behavior that it really strikes me as unusual that he didn’t act like this before you married him.
Did he talk to you on the phone for more than a min. before you married or did he always hang up on you or cut you short? Did he ever answer your phone calls to him before you two married?

Before you married, how was he with money? Did you two ever talk about how to prioritize your money and what sort of place you planned to live in based on your savings?

Did you two ever talk about what married sexual life you to aspired to have? Yes, it’s a very intimate topic but before you marry it would be something to talk about.

Did he act completely different before marriage than he does now?

Please don’t be defensive in answering, I’m genuinely trying to get a handle on the situation.

I worry because you seem to think that God is punishing you and you express a very painful experiance in your younger family life.

God doesn’t mess with free will. He isn’t forcing your husband to act the way he does, and He didn’t force you to marry him. So He isn’t forcing any of this unhappiness on you because He’s not controlling your husband’s free will.

 

[dans0622]

Whenever my friend wants to catholic bash( her favourite pastime) i always hope i can come back with a good defence to the catholic criticism of the day. Speaking of annulments and the whole catholic church being as corrupt as anything, she asks "Why is it so hard for genuine good catholics to get annulments yet the very rich Princess caroline can get 2 annulments relatively easy?

On a sarcastic day, I’d respond by saying “Because these rich people are idiots/scoundrels who are incapable of doing what a human being should, by nature, be able to do, i.e., get married. Meanwhile, ‘genuine, good Catholics’ know what marriage is, want it, and can enter it. So, if they have troubles later, it’s not grounds for an declaration of nullity.”

On a more gentle day, I’d ask for examples and have her explain the particular circumstances of each case. Then, I could tell her if she had a point or not.

Dan

 

[chevalier]

How many people sue for nullity and get their petition done right? In fact, it’s not as bad as in civil courts when it comes to getting a qualified lawyer’s aid.

Thanks so much for the reply Chevalier.

:tiphat:

Ive not spoken of this before. I would love to put another question to you. Growing up rather strict catholics and very happy i wondered why i knew nothing of my parents marriage. Why didnt her parents come over from Ireland (my mum is irish) for the happy day. Then at 18, my mum told me the story. She met dad, fell head over heels and after saying yes to his marriage proposal, my dad revealed he had been married before and divorced. After much torment she says she loved him too much to walk away and they married. This is a strange thingThey have had 40 years of happiness, 5 children. But her whole life has been shrouded by sadness at the “terrible sin” she committed in marrying a divorcee and the fact that she is not married to dad in the eyes of God. (A priest at our parish who knew their situation would refer to my dad as “your boyfriend” as if to demonstrate that they are not recognized. As she gets older, i note that she is truly tortured by this even though as she says she has 5 children and a perfect husband. Its all a big fake to her. I started by saying i had a question. Maybe of a possible annulment for my dad but this was loooked into at the time they met.(1960’s). I think what im asking is “Is the annulment of the first marriage worth looking at again. She has told me that they have lived as"brother and sister” for the last twenty years. I know the feeling as i am going through the same thing myself now,

I’m sorry for you mum. Yes, it’s worth looking at, although if there has already been a trial, the particular title (ground) of invalidity may be blocked at least as long as there are no new facts. It’s not a given, but you can try.

however Chevalier has given me hope that i can get married in the church.

God and the Church did. Hope it turns out well for you.

 

[chevalier]

“Good” Catholics should in theory find it harder to get a decree of nullity. You will find if you do the research that, at least in the U.S., it’s the conservative Catholic theologians who argue that the high rate of annulments in the U.S. is proper – because there are so many Catholics who have bought into the country’s prevailing view of “well, we’ll just get a divorce if it doesn’t work out” – which invalidates the Sacrament of Matrimony (since a valid Sacrament requires an intent to marry permanently). After all, if you’re a “good” Catholic, you should marry correctly, while a “bad” Catholic might not.

So, for example, if Alice and Bob, both Catholics, marry in the Catholic Church, and either one of them lacks the proper intent to marry (plans on divorcing, intends to have no children, etc.), then they are in fact entitled to an annulment. On the other hand, if Cindy and David, both Catholics, marry in the Catholic Church, and both of them intend to marry in the sense that the Church uses, then they are not entitled to an annulment.

It’s not that “good” Catholics are punished by not getting annulments, while “bad” Catholics get away with it; it’s that “good” Catholics did it right the first time, while “bad” Catholics didn’t.

Yup. Strictly speaking, they aren’t even entitled to anything, they are simply not married. On the other hand, as they grow in faith, many defects of consent that once existed but no longer do, do not require a formal process.

But this is not to say that the rich and powerful or the celebrities are bad Catholics. They don’t exactly have a happy life most of the time and princess Caroline surely has not had a merry ride in life. Apart from simulations (exclusion of progeny, i.e. having a positive intent not to have children; exclusion of faith, i.e. having a positive intent of not being faithful; exclusion of sacrament, i.e. having a positive intent of excluding indissolubility - i.e. positively accepting the possibility of divorce if it doesnt’ work out), various forms of immaturity (broadly speaking, including “reasons of psychic nature”) are plenty. Those may affect people who’ve had a hard life.

 

[vstead]

Thanks Godfollower for making me see that so differently.

 

[Godfollower]

Thanks Godfollower for making me see that so differently.

Glad I could help.

 

[richmonte]

I am looking to get my marriage annuled. My ex wife (ex from a divorce) isnt going to fight it. From what I have read in this board it seems to me that the powers that make the decision want to see that the marriage shouldnt have happened in the first place. My ex and I were young when we got married. I was 26 and she was 23. We had a huge fight on the honeymoon and right away I thought we made a mistake. I dont think she was ever truley in love with me. She was in love with what I was about, what I would become, and what I stood for but not me as a man. It was a chore for her to even hold my hand. Now these are reasons why we shouldnt have done it to begin with. Please dont judge about why I got married, like I said I was young and thought it was our next step in life together and would make us better together. I love my ex like a sister now, we get along great but we just cant be married anymore. When I file my papers with my Deacon I want to keep her in the clear with everything and put it all on me. Will the Church grant this to me if Im the one who made the mistake and filed? Or do they grant it based on the other spouse? Im sorry for the long post but I am very confused with this process and would hope someone who went though it could contact me or post a reply.
Thanks!!

Also the priest who married us was arrested for child molesting. He is now in jail. This bothered me from the beginning as well. He was arrested about 9 months after we got married.

 

[daughteroftruth]

I’d like to know why the Church allows people to get married who have no clue, not to mention all these “impediments?” I thought these mandatory marriage prep courses - classes - encounters - whatever you want to call them, were supposed to *help *couples in this regard. If a couple goes through this “prep,” where’s the excuse? “I don’t love him/her anymore?” That, and anything just as lame, may cut it in the eyes of a bishop or priest or lay person, but it isn’t in the eyes of God, and therefore one is sinning grievously against Him and against his/her spouse. What ever happened to fidelity to Him? Putting Him over our personal desires/conveniences? It’s a sad, sad situation. I guess these marriage prep things are about as useful as most Catholic schools: they guarantee your failure. well, not that funny, really.

 

[Corki]

I’d like to know why the Church allows people to get married who have no clue, not to mention all these “impediments?” I thought these mandatory marriage prep courses - classes - encounters - whatever you want to call them, were supposed to *help *couples in this regard. If a couple goes through this “prep,” where’s the excuse? “I don’t love him/her anymore?” That, and anything just as lame, may cut it in the eyes of a bishop or priest or lay person, but it isn’t in the eyes of God, and therefore one is sinning grievously against Him and against his/her spouse. What ever happened to fidelity to Him? Putting Him over our personal desires/conveniences? It’s a sad, sad situation. I guess these marriage prep things are about as useful as most Catholic schools: they guarantee your failure. well, not that funny, really.

It is sad. But marriage prep is largely about helping the couples look at each other clearly rather than for the priest to do a full psychological examination of both of them. And, frankly, people who really want to get married are not always truthful with the priest. How many people do you think tell the priest that “Of course, we are open to life” but then cheerfully use birth control from Day 1? Or who misrepresent how much quality time they have spent discussing hard issues as a couple?

BTW, “I don’t love him anymore” won’t cut it anywhere in the Church as grounds for annulment or even as a legitimate reason to separate civily.

And I hope you meant the crack about Catholic schools in jest. Otherwise, it was a very unfair and untrue generalization.

 

[daughteroftruth]

And I hope you meant the crack about Catholic schools in jest. Otherwise, it was a very unfair and untrue generalization.

No, I was serious, but the statement would’ve been more accurate (I pray) had I said “many” instead of “most.” Sorry.

 

[agapewolf]

I am looking to get my marriage annuled. My ex wife (ex from a divorce) isnt going to fight it. From what I have read in this board it seems to me that the powers that make the decision want to see that the marriage shouldnt have happened in the first place. My ex and I were young when we got married. I was 26 and she was 23. We had a huge fight on the honeymoon and right away I thought we made a mistake. I dont think she was ever truley in love with me. She was in love with what I was about, what I would become, and what I stood for but not me as a man. It was a chore for her to even hold my hand. Now these are reasons why we shouldnt have done it to begin with. Please dont judge about why I got married, like I said I was young and thought it was our next step in life together and would make us better together. I love my ex like a sister now, we get along great but we just cant be married anymore. When I file my papers with my Deacon I want to keep her in the clear with everything and put it all on me. Will the Church grant this to me if Im the one who made the mistake and filed? Or do they grant it based on the other spouse? Im sorry for the long post but I am very confused with this process and would hope someone who went though it could contact me or post a reply.
Thanks!!

Also the priest who married us was arrested for child molesting. He is now in jail. This bothered me from the beginning as well. He was arrested about 9 months after we got married.

Do not “slant” anything by putting it on you. Tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth. This has nothing to do with whose fault it is…it has to do with an accurate account of the situation to determine if there was a valid marriage. Also, if you “put everything” on you, perhaps the result will be future impediments to getting married again.