What are Noahide Laws?

[Zahava]

I have been asked what the Noahide Laws are:

The Seven Laws of Noah are:

Shefichat damim - Do not murder.
Gezel - Do not steal or kidnap.
Avodah zarah - Do not worship false gods/idols.
Gilui arayot - Do not be sexually immoral (engage in incest, sodomy, bestiality, castration and adultery)
Birkat Hashem - Do not utter G-d’s name in vain, curse G-d or pursue the occult.
Dinim - Set up righteous and honest courts and apply fair justice in judging offenders and uphold the principles of the last five.
Ever Min HaChai - Do not eat a part of a live animal.

templeinstitute.org/archive/28-09-05-s.htm

noahidenations.com/content/index.php

 

[Della]

So, what is it you are asking/discussing? You seem to have no need/desire for either.

 

[Peregrino]

Jews believe that non-Jews are guaranteed a place in heaven as long as they abide by these laws, even if they do not become Jewish. This is one of the main reason that Jews do not proselytize. I have been told by a Jewish friend that Jews actually wonder why a non-Jew seeking to convert would want to take on the extra burden of following the 613 mitzvot since the reward for a Jew and non-Jew is the same. I rather admire the egalitarian nature of this concept!

I think that Zahava was just posting these since she had been asked about them. I think that simply posting an idea is a fine way of starting a discussion.

 

[AgnosTheist]

Avodah zarah - Do not worship false gods/idols.

Birkat Hashem - Do not utter G-d’s name in vain, curse G-d or pursue the occult.

I am aware that for Jews these 7 laws are the only thing the G-d requires for Gentiles.

They all make sense except for the two I quoted.

Avodah zarah - How do you determine whether the God being worshipped is true or false?

Birkat Hashem - How do you determine whether the name being uttered belongs to G-d? Whats the hell is this “G-d” all about? Cant you say “God”?

 

[b_justb]

AgnosTheist:

Birkat Hashem - How do you determine whether the name being uttered belongs to G-d? Whats the hell is this “G-d” all about? Cant you say “God”?

Some of the Jewish CAF posters can probably give a better explination, this is what I understand.

In the Jewish tradition to write The Name on anything makes it holy, because it bears The Name. Anything holy should be respected and treated with reverence. If one writes The Name “God” on a piece of paper and then throws out the paper, it is disrespecting The Name. That is why you’ll see “G-d” instead.

 

[AgnosTheist]

If one writes The Name “God” on a piece of paper and then throws out the paper, it is disrespecting The Name. That is why you’ll see “G-d” instead.

Jewish thinking often makes sense, this is just not it.

The term “God” is not even a name that the Divine assigned to itself. I wonder how spanish jews write the term “Dios”. 'Di-s"?

 

[Zahava]

Some of the Jewish CAF posters can probably give a better explination, this is what I understand.

In the Jewish tradition to write The Name on anything makes it holy, because it bears The Name. Anything holy should be respected and treated with reverence. If one writes The Name “God” on a piece of paper and then throws out the paper, it is disrespecting The Name. That is why you’ll see “G-d” instead.

You said it well, b_justb

 

[Zahava]

Jewish thinking often makes sense, this is just not it.

The term “God” is not even a name that the Divine assigned to itself. I wonder how spanish jews write the term “Dios”. 'Di-s"?

now that made me laugh !

Could be…I will have to ask my husband. His mother language is Spanish.

 

[Valke2]

Jewish thinking often makes sense, this is just not it.

The term “God” is not even a name that the Divine assigned to itself. I wonder how spanish jews write the term “Dios”. 'Di-s"?

There’s nothing in Jewish law that prohibits the spelling of “God”. Otherwise your criticism would be justified. Some Jews refuse to spell out the name out of their version of respect. But really, “God” is no different then “Lord” or “Adonai” and there’s no prohibition against spelling it out.

 

[Zahava]

There’s nothing in Jewish law that prohibits the spelling of “God”. Otherwise your criticism would be justified. Some Jews refuse to spell out the name out of their version of respect. But really, “God” is no different then “Lord” or “Adonai” and there’s no prohibition against spelling it out.

Yeah, come to think about it I never came across a prohibition against spelling G-d out. I do so, like you said, respect. Just like I would never ever bring any Holy Books into the bathroom to read while I am sitting on the potty.

 

[hosemonkey]

Yeah, come to think about it I never came across a prohibition against spelling G-d out. I do so, like you said, respect. Just like I would never ever bring any Holy Books into the bathroom to read while I am sitting on the potty.

Ha! Good for you Zahava. I like you. As a matter of fact, the Jews I know and have known are some of my favorite people. If I did not love being Catholic so much, I would surely be a Jew. Blessings on you.

 

[Rbt_Southwell]

So, what is it you are asking/discussing? You seem to have no need/desire for either.

She converted to Judaism: specifically the Orthodox strain which rose post-Temple destruction (70 AD) and initially followed the Pharisee traditions of the Law.

She is here to tell us Christians what we are in need of and how Jesus is NOT considered to be the Messiah.

Oh, and her blog, of course.

Robert

 

[Valke2]

I didn’t read her whole blog, but there’s nothing in the intro to suggest she’s out to convince Christians that they are wrong about jesus. Since one can be a righteous gentile and a Christian, I’m not sure how you conlcuded she’s out to show you why your belief in Jesus is incorrect.

 

[lukewarm]

I didn’t read her whole blog, but there’s nothing in the intro to suggest she’s out to convince Christians that they are wrong about jesus. Since one can be a righteous gentile and a Christian, I’m not sure how you conlcuded she’s out to show you why your belief in Jesus is incorrect.

That has to be a fallacy from a Jewish perspective, Christianity would be idolatry and a polytheist religion from a Jewish perspective. So it would be impossible for a Jew to call a Christian a “righteous gentile”. According to Judaism Christians would indeed break the Noahide laws.

Being Jewish is as much a race as it is a religion. One can no more convert to being a Jew than one can conver to being Chinese. The entire idea is archaic, a leftover of tribalism from 3,000 years ago. Back then every tribe thought they were great and chosen by God and had to lord it over everyone else. Most abandoned that idea for a more universal idea that all are God’s children, some didn’t (not just Jews, it’s also rampant in the Arab world).

 

[Valke2]

That has to be a fallacy from a Jewish perspective, Christianity would be idolatry and a polytheist religion from a Jewish perspective. So it would be impossible for a Jew to call a Christian a “righteous gentile”. According to Judaism Christians would indeed break the Noahide laws.

Being Jewish is as much a race as it is a religion. One can no more convert to being a Jew than one can conver to being Chinese. The entire idea is archaic, a leftover of tribalism from 3,000 years ago. Back then every tribe thought they were great and chosen by God and had to lord it over everyone else. Most abandoned that idea for a more universal idea that all are God’s children, some didn’t (not just Jews, it’s also rampant in the Arab world).

No. The general consensus in Jewish Halacha is that it is not idolatry for a non jew to worship Jesus. YOur understanding is flawed in this matter. As for your view that Jewish = race, this is generally a veiw that is expressed by antisemites. Anyone can convert to Judaism, as I am sure you know.

 

[lukewarm]

No. The general consensus in Jewish Halacha is that it is not idolatry for a non jew to worship Jesus. YOur understanding is flawed in this matter. As for your view that Jewish = race, this is generally a veiw that is expressed by antisemites. Anyone can convert to Judaism, as I am sure you know.

HMMM is Israel littered with anti-semites then? Because if I remember correctly anyone can migrate to Israel under the right of return if they can prove either one of their parents or grand-parents were Jewish.

If I converted to Judaism would I be elligible to migrate to Israel under the right of return? No of course not because I have no Jewish heritage. So being a Jew is a matter of race as much as it is religion.

 

[Valke2]

HMMM is Israel littered with anti-semites then? Because if I remember correctly anyone can migrate to Israel under the right of return if they can prove either one of their parents or grand-parents were Jewish.

If I converted to Judaism would I be elligible to migrate to Israel under the right of retunr? No of course not because I have no Jewish heritage. So being a Jew is a matter of race as much as it is religion.

yes. If you converted to Judaism you would be eligible to migrate to Israel under the right of return. You are wrong. ANy convert to Judaism is allowed to take advantage of the right to return. Moreover, any non jew who can prove he is the son, grandson, or spouse of a Jew, can also take advantage of the law.

To sum up. All Jews, converts or otherwise, fall under the law of return. Non Jews who are the child, grandchild or spouse of a Jew also can take advanatge of the right of return. This is to ensure that people who are not considered jews under halacha but are nevertheless subject to antisemetism, have a place in Israel.

And, of course, a Non-Jew who doesn’t fit into any of the above categories, can still immigrate to Israel, if they met requirements that are pretty much the same as other countries.

 

[lukewarm]

yes. If you converted to Judaism you would be eligible to migrate to Israel under the right of return. You are wrong. ANy convert to Judaism is allowed to take advantage of the right to return. Moreover, any non jew who can prove he is the son, grandson, or spouse of a Jew, can also take advantage of the law.

To sum up. All Jews, converts or otherwise, fall under the law of return. Non Jews who are the child, grandchild or spouse of a Jew also can take advanatge of the right of return. This is to ensure that people who are not considered jews under halacha but are nevertheless subject to antisemetism, have a place in Israel.

And, of course, a Non-Jew who doesn’t fit into any of the above categories, can still immigrate to Israel, if they met requirements that are pretty much the same as other countries.

You’re not being straightforward as to how difficult it is to have a conversion even recognized under halacha. Most converts wouldn’t be recognized and would not fall under the right of return.

 

[Valke2]

You’re not being straightforward as to how difficult it is to have a conversion even recognized under halacha. Most converts wouldn’t be recognized and would not fall under the right of return.

you keep changing your tactics. But I’ll keep answering your questions.

Actually, Israel is extremely liberal in determining who is a Jew for the purpose of the law of return. I suggest you do a little research on the subject if you are really interested in it.

So far you’ve claimed that being Jewish is a race and that one cannot convert to Judaism. That’s false.

Then you claimed a convert to Judaism can’t be admitted into Israel under the law of return. Also false. And in fact many nonjews are admitted under this law, as well as Jews.

Now you are saying most conversions would not be sufficient to allow one to take advantage of Israel’s law of return. Again, patently false.

What agenda are you trying to promote or did you truly not know these things?

 

[Nevarlander]

I am aware that for Jews these 7 laws are the only thing the G-d requires for Gentiles.

They all make sense except for the two I quoted.

Avodah zarah - How do you determine whether the God being worshipped is true or false?

Birkat Hashem - How do you determine whether the name being uttered belongs to G-d? Whats the hell is this “G-d” all about? Cant you say “God”?

You bring up a good point. Jewish people (Valke, Zahava), for the purpose of the Noachide Laws, what is a false god? For instance, there are still a lot of polytheistic civilizations out there, such as in India and in parts of Africa. Are those considered “false gods”? Some people in Asia still worship their ancestors. Since that’s worshipping a human, is that a false god?