What are Protestant concerns with the sacrament of confession?

[jburgherr]

I love God. I love praying and talking with God.
Catholics tell me they adore Mary and feel comforted by talking to her.

How can you equate PRAYER with punishments like “being grounded, no phone time, no email time, no PC time, no going out”?

Hi Syele,

I don’t think of it in that way. We Catholics love our prayer life as well. We love God above all and love our prayer time talking with Him. However, after confession, we are to do pennance.

So while saying the rosary or what ever the priest prescribes, we are to meditate on our sorrow for offending our dear Lord with our sins. There is no forgiveness without sorrow. We are also praying, that with God’s help, we may amend our lives and not sin again.

I hope this helps.

 

[Orionthehunter]

No, it’s more like telling your daughter, “You disobeyed me, now go to your room and pray about what you’ve done.” Or perhaps, “You disobeyed me, so let’s talk about your disobedience and mend the relationship.” It’s a punishment in the psychological sense of “a stimulus applied to reduce a behavior.”

It’s as if you gave your daugher a chore to do in penance for her disobedience. Yes, in an ideal world, she should love the opportunity to express her love for you and honor you by cleaning the bathroom. But, the world not being ideal, it’s still a chore for her. Sometimes (and I’m sure you’ve experienced this as well), it’s a chore to pray. In an ideal world, we would pray without ceasing, we’d constantly be in communication with God, and we’d always look forward to it; but in our less-than-ideal world, sometimes we don’t have time, or we’re not in the mood, or we’re distracted. “Prayer penances” are sometimes great, and other times are more of a chore, but at all times they’re intended to bring us even closer to God.

(It’s worth noting that not all “prayer penances” are "Hail Mary"s. I’ve gotten "Hail Mary"s, "Our Father"s, and (more often than not), prayers specific either to a sin that I confessed or a particular issue in the Church.)

Jeremy

Good point and I think maybe this is another example of failure to communicate because terms are used differently in different faith traditions. For a Catholic, penance isn’t punishment.

We come to confession with contrition (sorrow for offending God), a desire for forgiveness, and a resolve to reform such that we overcome this sinful tendency. In other words, by going to confession, we have already had an “interior penance” which the Church defines as a conversion of heart toward God and away from sin. The penance we recieve from the Priest are external acts of penance (fasting, prayer or almsgiving/sacrifice) to conform our exterior being (body and mind) with our interior being (soul and conscience).

This is pretty common on a number of matters in the Church and its theology. Just as Christ was fully human and fully divine, human creation is fully spirit and fully body. While God may judge our spirit as contrite, He asks us to conform our bodies to our spiritual state. So, we kneel when at the consecration of the Body and Blood we are conforming our body and spirit to a posture of adoration as the shepherds did at the Nativity. When we enter a Church that has a tabernacle, we genuflect in humility to conform our spirit and our body. The reason we do this is so that our physical acts can be instruments to reinforce our spiritual “posture.” For example, when we genuflect before God, we should be humble. Genuflection causes our bodies to support and reinforce that which should be in our spirit.

The examples are many but I think you get the picture. Helpful?I suggest you read in the Catechism 1430-1439 which talks about interior and exterior penance. The CCC says it much better than my feeble attempt above.

 

[Steadfast]

Purgatory- is whole different topic! This thread is about the sacrament of reconciliation, also known as confession. In my opinion, a new thread should be started to talk about purgatory. What do you think???

I think they’re related since they both hinge upn the idea of satisfaction being made by repentant believers for sins committed.

 

[jmcrae]

Are you trying to say that you think the letter of James was written to an audience of priests only? If so, why?

Bishops, actually.

Because they were the leaders of the Churches (what we today would call Dioceses) that he was addressing. They would have been the direct audience - the first readers - of those letters.

They would have passed the content of the teachings on to their congregations orally, at Mass, during the homily, much as we do today when the Pope sends out an encyclical to the whole Church, or when our Bishop sends us a letter - the priest quotes a small portion of it during the homily, and makes some comments about it pertaining to what the Pope or what our Bishop would like us to do.

Later, the letters of the Apostles were actually read out during the Liturgy of the Word and interpreted in the homily (and the interpretation of that particular passage has always been that we are to confess our sins in the presence of a priest - even public confessions needed to take place where the Bishop was, or where the priest was), but that first audience didn’t realize that the letters were “Scripture,” yet.

 

[Pug]

Bishops, actually.

Because they were the leaders of the Churches (what we today would call Dioceses) that he was addressing. They would have been the direct audience - the first readers - of those letters.

They would have passed the content of the teachings on to their congregations orally, at Mass, during the homily,

So you apply this reasoning to the other epistles as well. When I read letters like James and 1Cor, I just don’t hear them as having a bishop as the overall target audience. They don’t sound that way. They more seem written to a group of Christians, but yes it was understood that there would have been an original recipient of the letter. With 1Timothy, your point is easier for me to see. OTOH, I can see how James would have assumed that someone (an elder or whomever) would have been there to explain any difficult parts of his letter. The letter didn’t arrive in a leaderless vacuum. So maybe I do understand your point?

I don’t have an issue with the Church deciding to interpret a particular passage in James a certain way, however. If anything were confusing to the recipient(s) in those letters, then someone would eventually have straightened it out in person. Like when Paul talks about how he will arrive soon in 1Cor or when Paul says he is sending Timothy to some group or another.

 

[Mommyof02green]

I think they’re related since they both hinge upn the idea of satisfaction being made by repentant believers for sins committed.

I respect that fact that you believe that the subject of purgatory is related… and truthful I see your point.

However, truth be known, all of the Sacraments be it Baptism, Eucharist (communion), Holy Orders (Priest, Nuns, Brothers), Marriage, Anointing of the Sick, Confirmation, and Reconciliation (confession) are interrelate to each other. They all have to do with our life here and now, and our Eternal life after death.

It’s hard to separate them!! However, I think in the interest of THIS thread and the OP we should not venture down that path on THIS thread. However, I’m sure you will have plenty of people willing to talk about Purgatory in a NEW thread.

God Bless.

 

[Mommyof02green]

The examples are many but I think you get the picture. Helpful? I suggest you read in the **Catechism 1430-1439 **which talks about interior and exterior penance. The CCC says it much better than my feeble attempt above.

Here is a web-link to paragraphs 1430-1439: usccb.org/catechism/text/pt2sect2chpt2.htm#art4

 

[Coder]

The Catholic practice of being required to confess all mortal sins to a priest dosn’t make any sense at all to a protestant for a few reasons:

The sacrament is a gift. If a person has motal sins on their soul, Jesus has authorized a priest to be healer, witness, and minister. The sacrament has great power to truly transform people interiorly. “Come to me all you who are weary and I will give you rest.” Confession is a way in which Jesus frees us and gives us rest.

 

[TheGarg]

ps - my point with the Bible quote was it does NOT say that we must confess to a priest…forgot to add that to my post…
Anne

the only men with the power to forgive sins is the apostles and those in thier succesion bishops and priests ] …Luke 20:21-23

 

[happygal]

The sacrament is a gift. If a person has motal sins on their soul, Jesus has authorized a priest to be healer, witness, and minister. The sacrament has great power to truly transform people interiorly. “Come to me all you who are weary and I will give you rest.” Confession is a way in which Jesus frees us and gives us rest.

Yup protestant can confess their sins to others, i don’t see that is a big problem, however we do not believe that the priest can forgive or absorb the sin, because in the eyes of the protestant, only God has the power and authority on it.

There is this question about, partaking Eucharist after confession of Mortal Sin. So if everyone would to go for confession before Mass, would they able to partake Eucharist after they have done with their confession??

 

[jemfinch]

Yup protestant can confess their sins to others, i don’t see that is a big problem, however we do not believe that the priest can forgive or absorb the sin, because in the eyes of the protestant, only God has the power and authority on it.

There’s a reason “The Great Commission” starts with, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me.” Jesus clearly delegated His authority to forgive sins to the Apostles (John 20) and they, as ambassadors of Christ, ministers of reconciliation (2 Corinthians 5) delegated it to their successors.

There is this question about, partaking Eucharist after confession of Mortal Sin. So if everyone would to go for confession before Mass, would they able to partake Eucharist after they have done with their confession??

Assuming they made a good confession, yes. But only Catholics, those being received into the Church, or non-Catholics in danger of dying can receive the sacrament of confession in the first place.

Jeremy

 

[Mommyof02green]

Yup protestant can confess their sins to others, i don’t see that is a big problem, however we do not believe that the priest can forgive or absorb the sin, because in the eyes of the protestant, only God has the power and authority on it.

Cathechism of the Catholic Church paragraph 1441:

Only God forgives sins.Since he is the Son of God, Jesus says of himself, “The Son of man has authority on earth to forgive sins” and exercises this divine power: “Your sins are forgiven.” Further, by virtue of his divine authority he gives this power to men to exercise in his name. see: Mark 2:7; Mark 2:5 Mark 2:10 Luke 7:48; and John 20:21-23

Also as I pointed out in post # 14… Some Non-Catholic Churches have “confession” to a Pastor and they receive an “absolution”. See post 14

Here is a web-link to the CCC re: confessions
usccb.org/catechism/text/pt2sect2chpt2.htm#art4

 

[BOBKAT]

Just wanted to add to all of the points made here about confesssion… I am a cradle Catholic who fell away from confession, because I thought like many that I could go right to God and take care of them. That is not how I think today over the last few years I have be growing in my faith and with that I went to confession for the frist time in I don’t know how long… It is a very humbling experience which is what we need to get into heaven (HUMILITY) not getting in without it. Another aspect is it helps form your conscience which helps for a good confession. I love the fact that our faith ask this of us and I try to go more often it is always good to practice humility…

God Bless
Kathleen

 

[jmcrae]

There is this question about, partaking Eucharist after confession of Mortal Sin. So if everyone would to go for confession before Mass, would they able to partake Eucharist after they have done with their confession??

Assuming they are Catholic, yes.

Non-Catholic Christians (persons baptized outside the Catholic faith) who go to Confession have to make a Profession of Faith in the Catholic Church and receive the Sacrament of Confirmation after going to Confession, and before they can receive their First Holy Communion - the only exception I know of would be converts from the Orthodox faith.

Non-Christians - that is, unbaptized people - also need to be baptized - and if they are baptized on the same day that they receive the Sacrament of Confirmation and First Holy Communion, then they are not required to go to Confession, first.

 

[MariaG]

Hi Anne, we do not see James 5:16 as referring only to priests. We believe “anyone” is any believers. In Romans 8, we have the Holy Spirit himself praying for us.

In short, there is nothing wrong with confessing one’s sin habbits to fellow believers that can guide us towards holiness.

It likely, has more to do with the “hail marry’s” and such. We do not see them as being benefitical towards gaining forgiveness from God.

:waveaniel,

Could you (or others) explain how we go from confess our sins to one another to there is nothing wrong with it? Although we can see now that some Protestants are starting to teach this, it is not widespread and universal.

While obviously I disagree with the interpretation that these confessions can be made to the “general” priesthood we all share, it seems as if many Protestants have lost this concept of confessing at all.

There is “nothing wrong” with confessing instead of we are supposed to confess with a question of who to.

I guess what I am saying is that if one interprets confessing our sins to the “general” priesthood we all share, why don’t protestants, in general, do this? Scripture says confess our sins to one another.

The only question in interpretation should be who is the one that Scripture tells us to confess to, and not whether or not it should be done at all.

I am looking for some insight into this. Inquiring tone. The only explanation I have is that it wasn’t taught. But this then begs question is why wasn’t it taught since clearly confessing our sins to one another is quite biblical by anyone’s interpretation.

God Bless,
Maria

 

[Syele]

The sacrament is a gift. If a person has motal sins on their soul, Jesus has authorized a priest to be healer, witness, and minister. The sacrament has great power to truly transform people interiorly. “Come to me all you who are weary and I will give you rest.” Confession is a way in which Jesus frees us and gives us rest.

I understand that, I was trying to explain a protestant viewpoint. Protestants would disagree on what a “Mortal Sin” is defined as, as well as the proper way to confess sins. If two groups have two totally different beliefs about something and then proceed to talk vaguely abou that thing… only misunderstandings can ensue.

 

[Syele]

I am looking for some insight into this. Inquiring tone. The only explanation I have is that it wasn’t taught. But this then begs question is why wasn’t it taught since clearly confessing our sins to one another is quite biblical by anyone’s interpretation.

God Bless,
Maria

maria, I think it’s a matter of human nature,

First it’s taught as not ‘required’ unless you sinned against someone and you have to go tell that person what you did and you are sorry.

Second thing that seems to have happened is that Confessing to other people isn’t something people get excited about, so if they don’t want to and someone tells them it’s not required… You think they do it?

Then after so many people stop doing the not required thing, it starts being downright rare to see it at all.

Recently, my Pastor preached on the value of Confessing to others. In the sermon he covered alot of very good points. He never said it was a bad idea all his points were how good it is and it was backed up with scripture. Even so, He didn’t say it’s required and I have doubts that many people hurried home to call up their sisters and brothers in Christ to confess their sins to them!

If I tell my kid that it’s a really good idea to be helpful and wash the dishes for me every night, but she dosn’t HAVE to. The chances that she will go do something fun instead are very high.

 

[JoeyWarren]

That’s like me telling my Daughter, “You disobeyed me, for your punishment you have to spend the day with me at Chuck E. Cheese’s!” It’s nothing at all like being grounded from the phone for a week.

You really think so?

The next time your daughter disobeys you, try this out for punishment for her and you together:

Make her sit there a pray OUT LOUD for ONE WHOLE HOUR and you follow suit.

You will definitely have a different outlook on prayer as punishment.

Wanting to pray voluntarily is very much different then being made to pray especially if a minimum time is put on it.

 

[JoeyWarren]

And while I on the subject of praying.

Is there anyone thing you do in the course of your day away from work that takes up more than an Hour?

Example: Do you watch TV for 2 hours? If so, do you give the same amount of time to God in Prayer? If not, then you love TV more than you love God.

Example: Do you and your daughter go to the movie theater and watch a movie? If so, do you on the same day give time to God in Prayer equal to or greater then the length of the movie you saw or will see? If not, then you love that movie more than you love God.

Just food for thought.

 

[MariaG]

maria, I think it’s a matter of human nature,

First it’s taught as not ‘required’ unless you sinned against someone and you have to go tell that person what you did and you are sorry.

Second thing that seems to have happened is that Confessing to other people isn’t something people get excited about, so if they don’t want to and someone tells them it’s not required… You think they do it?

Then after so many people stop doing the not required thing, it starts being downright rare to see it at all.

Recently, my Pastor preached on the value of Confessing to others. In the sermon he covered alot of very good points. He never said it was a bad idea all his points were how good it is and it was backed up with scripture. Even so, He didn’t say it’s required and I have doubts that many people hurried home to call up their sisters and brothers in Christ to confess their sins to them!

If I tell my kid that it’s a really good idea to be helpful and wash the dishes for me every night, but she dosn’t HAVE to. The chances that she will go do something fun instead are very high.

Very true. We certainly may know that something is good for us but unless someone tells us outright it is required, (besides scripture ) I can see why people will avoid something they find uncomfortable.

Looks like the Catholic Church has a good understanding of human nature

And I had forgotten that most WILL preach on the idea that we must go to our brother if we have a specific problem with them and talk about it. It just seems that this gets paired to mean that the only time we need to confess our sins to each other, is when we have sinned against a particular person.

Thanks.

God Bless,
Maria