What are the rules for priests doing extraordinary mass?

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The 1962 Roman Missal is a legal form of performing mass correct? What exactly does this mean? Can any priest technically just any random day say " hey I want to switch it up and do the mass in Latin " and use the 1962 Missal? Or does he need some sort of prior permission from the bishop? I was just curious how that works.
 
Since 7/7/07, or shortly after, Pope Benedict allowed any priest to use the 62 liturgical books for Mass and Sacraments. Although technically it’s not required to notify the bishop, at least the pastor should know of a priest’s plan to say such Mass. There may be other considerations but that’s the short of it.
 
ProVobis said:
Since 7/7/07, or shortly after, Pope Benedict allowed any priest to use the 62 liturgical books for Mass and Sacraments. Although technically it’s not required to notify the bishop, at least the pastor should know of a priest’s plan to say such Mass. There may be other considerations but that’s the short of it.
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I assume you are talking about a **public **Mass.
Certainly there should be public notice. A congregation that has been coming to the noon Mass in the OF should not suddenly find it has been switched to the EF. (or vice versa, for that matter)
The Mass should not be presented in any way as to state, or imply, that the OF is not a perfectly valid way of celebrating Mass.
Even if the bishop’s **permission **is not required, it almost certainly calls for notification, I would think, to the office of the bishop. Most dioceses make a public listing of where any “language” masses are held. The EF is more than just a Latin Mass of course, but it is a different language. Changing to the EF is a significant pastoral modification.

The bishop is ultimately responsible, so he should be kept fully informed. If it is a private Mass, or only within the religious order, the religious superior should be notified.
 
Since Summorum Pontificum in 2007, any priest can use the 1962 liturgy without special permission.

ewtn.com/library/papaldoc/b16SummorumPontificum.htm
“Apostolic Letter “Summorum Pontificum” issued Motu Proprio
Benedict XVI”

As a practical matter, the Extraordinary Form is just that, extraordinary, and cannot be forced on those who prefer the Ordinary Form Mass.
 
commenter said:
I assume you are talking about a **public **Mass.
Certainly there should be public notice. A congregation that has been coming to the noon Mass in the OF should not suddenly find it has been switched to the EF. (or vice versa, for that matter)
The Mass should not be presented in any way as to state, or imply, that the OF is not a perfectly valid way of celebrating Mass.
Even if the bishop’s **permission **is not required, it almost certainly calls for notification, I would think, to the office of the bishop. Most dioceses make a public listing of where any “language” masses are held. The EF is more than just a Latin Mass of course, but it is a different language. Changing to the EF is a significant pastoral modification.

The bishop is ultimately responsible, so he should be kept fully informed. If it is a private Mass, or only within the religious order, the religious superior should be notified.
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This. It’s just prudent and respectful of the Bishop.
 
commenter said:
I assume you are talking about a **public **Mass.
Certainly there should be public notice. A congregation that has been coming to the noon Mass in the OF should not suddenly find it has been switched to the EF. (or vice versa, for that matter)
The Mass should not be presented in any way as to state, or imply, that the OF is not a perfectly valid way of celebrating Mass.
Even if the bishop’s **permission **is not required, it almost certainly calls for notification, I would think, to the office of the bishop. Most dioceses make a public listing of where any “language” masses are held. The EF is more than just a Latin Mass of course, but it is a different language. Changing to the EF is a significant pastoral modification.

The bishop is ultimately responsible, so he should be kept fully informed. If it is a private Mass, or only within the religious order, the religious superior should be notified.
Click to expand...
In my experience, I’ve heard the legitimacy of the EF being questioned more than the validity of the OF. But I (otherwise) agree with your assessment.
 
jas84173 said:
The 1962 Roman Missal is a legal form of performing mass correct? What exactly does this mean? Can any priest technically just any random day say " hey I want to switch it up and do the mass in Latin " and use the 1962 Missal? Or does he need some sort of prior permission from the bishop? I was just curious how that works.
Click to expand...
It should be noted that there are certain gestures that a priest does during the Extraordinary Form, which may require a bit of a tutorial and practice before celebrating publicly.
 
jas84173 said:
The 1962 Roman Missal is a legal form of performing mass correct? What exactly does this mean? Can any priest technically just any random day say " hey I want to switch it up and do the mass in Latin " and use the 1962 Missal? Or does he need some sort of prior permission from the bishop? I was just curious how that works.
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You can read the provision for yourself. It is quite straight forward.

w2.vatican.va/content/benedict-xvi/en/motu_proprio/documents/hf_ben-xvi_motu-proprio_20070707_summorum-pontificum.html
 
janeway529 said:
It should be noted that there are certain gestures that a priest does during the Extraordinary Form, which may require a bit of a tutorial and practice before celebrating publicly.
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Right. Judging from a lot of things I’ve seen online written by priests when the decision is made to celebrate the EF hours and hours of study and practice go into it before their first public celebration. Then you also have to find and train a group of servers that will be able to properly make the responses to the priest. Who knows how much time has to go into that.

I guess this isn’t really something a priest wakes up one day and says tomorrow I will say an EF mass. There are movements and hand positions that exist in the EF that simply do not have a counterpart in the OF.

ChadS
 
PaulfromIowa said:
Since Summorum Pontificum in 2007, any priest can use the 1962 liturgy without special permission.

ewtn.com/library/papaldoc/b16SummorumPontificum.htm
“Apostolic Letter “Summorum Pontificum” issued Motu Proprio
Benedict XVI”

As a practical matter, the Extraordinary Form is just that, extraordinary, and cannot be forced on those who prefer the Ordinary Form Mass.
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And we all know that some Bishops can be pretty vindictive if they are left out of the loop.
Then there is the person in the parish that is just sitting there waiting to find a fault with old Father what’s his face. 🤷
 
The priest, to my understanding, should have a certain knowledge of Latin, and they also need the right vestments and other articles.

It’s also my understanding that there needs to be a consistent core group of people who will attend an EF.
 
ChadS said:
Right. Judging from a lot of things I’ve seen online written by priests when the decision is made to celebrate the EF hours and hours of study and practice go into it before their first public celebration. Then you also have to find and train a group of servers that will be able to properly make the responses to the priest. Who knows how much time has to go into that.

I guess this isn’t really something a priest wakes up one day and says tomorrow I will say an EF mass. There are movements and hand positions that exist in the EF that simply do not have a counterpart in the OF.

ChadS
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Well…that depends upon the priest I suppose. For those of us of a certain vintage, we did not need “hours and hours of study and practice” because we remember it. When the bishop directed me to do the indult Mass for a group who had petitioned for it, I did not have to do any review. I had one “altar boy” who was in his 70s, whom I met with once and who proved he was quite adequately capable.

On the other hand, once the responsibility was lifted from me by His Excellency, I have never again celebrated in the vetus ordo – and have no intention of ever doing it again.

Younger priests who wanted to do it, I have helped to prepare…but one does not need to make it sound as though it was that hard of an undertaking, when one is a well and thoroughly formed priest.
 
Marie5890 said:
The priest, to my understanding, should have a certain knowledge of Latin, and they also need the right vestments and other articles.

It’s also my understanding that there needs to be a consistent core group of people who will attend an EF.
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  1. Yes there is a need for basic Latin but it is not that great of a challenge. It is actually what we know as the Liturgy of the Word but which was called the Mass of Catechumens in the vetus ordo that actually presents the more challenging vocabulary.
  2. There were Gothic vestments at the time of the Council, even if they were not as much in vogue then. There is no need to seek something else today, in terms of vestments. If you are priest, you simply cross the stole in the manner we did in the vetus ordo. The maniple had become optional and I never wore it in the time of the indult. The other things are of little impediment to resolve.
  3. A stable group is if the Mass is to be offered publicly. If the priest does not have a Mass with congregation, he is quite free to offer it as his daily Mass. Personally, I would never do so…but the motu proprio allows for it.
 
Don_Ruggero said:
Well…that depends upon the priest I suppose. For those of us of a certain vintage, we did not need “hours and hours of study and practice” because we remember it. When the bishop directed me to do the indult Mass for a group who had petitioned for it, I did not have to do any review. I had one “altar boy” who was in his 70s, whom I met with once and who proved he was quite adequately capable.

On the other hand, once the responsibility was lifted from me by His Excellency, I have never again celebrated in the vetus ordo – and have no intention of ever doing it again.

Younger priests who wanted to do it, I have helped to prepare…but one does not need to make it sound as though it was that hard of an undertaking, when one is a well and thoroughly formed priest.
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If you don’t mind me asking, why do priests of a certain vintage not want to celebrate the EF?
 
janeway529 said:
If you don’t mind me asking, why do priests of a certain vintage not want to celebrate the EF?
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I don’t mind being asked. I spent many years as a theology professor explaining it, as a lecturer on the liturgy and the sacraments.

Once upon a time, the rules of the forum would not allow me to answer the question fully, since the rules precluded any comparison between the vetus ordo and the novus ordo.

If you asked an assembled group of priests of my vintage that question, I can say you would hear somewhat different answers.

In my case, I won’t give actual voice to a comparison – I will simply say that the Council was the most important and formative event of my entire lifetime.

I could not agree more with the Council Fathers assessment for the need of every single aspect of the liturgy being in urgent need of reform and of renewal…something intensely realised and lived by the liturgical movement that preceded the Council

And those of the Council…the Council and the periti…were the luminaries of my life as well as my work as a priest in the ensuing years. There is not, for example, a day that I pray Eucharistic Prayer III without the fondest memory of Father Vagaggini.

Thinking back to and forward from the liturgical movement that predated the Council, to speak of the reform and renewal of the liturgy as a gift of the Holy Spirit does not even begin to do the reality justice.

It is not simply the celebration of the Eucharist in the vetus ordo…it is all the liturgical rites…the sacraments…the breviary.

I will occasionally do something using one of the liturgical books of the vetus ordo. If the reason justifies it…often for the nostalgia of a person of that era…but, for myself, I have no nostalgia for the vetus ordo at all. Only gratitude for what we now have, by God’s gracious gift
 
Don_Ruggero said:
I don’t mind being asked. I spent many years as a theology professor explaining it, as a lecturer on the liturgy and the sacraments.

Once upon a time, the rules of the forum would not allow me to answer the question fully, since the rules precluded any comparison between the vetus ordo and the novus ordo.

If you asked an assembled group of priests of my vintage that question, I can say you would hear somewhat different answers.

In my case, I won’t give actual voice to a comparison – I will simply say that the Council was the most important and formative event of my entire lifetime.

I could not agree more with the Council Fathers assessment for the need of every single aspect of the liturgy being in urgent need of reform and of renewal…something intensely realised and lived by the liturgical movement that preceded the Council

And those of the Council…the Council and the periti…were the luminaries of my life as well as my work as a priest in the ensuing years. There is not, for example, a day that I pray Eucharistic Prayer III without the fondest memory of Father Vagaggini.

Thinking back to and forward from the liturgical movement that predated the Council, to speak of the reform and renewal of the liturgy as a gift of the Holy Spirit does not even begin to do the reality justice.

It is not simply the celebration of the Eucharist in the vetus ordo…it is all the liturgical rites…the sacraments…the breviary.

I will occasionally do something using one of the liturgical books of the vetus ordo. If the reason justifies it…often for the nostalgia of a person of that era…but, for myself, I have no nostalgia for the vetus ordo at all. Only gratitude for what we now have, by God’s gracious gift
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Oh goodness…so beautifully stated Thank you Father.
:heaven:
 
Marie5890 said:
The priest, to my understanding, should have a certain knowledge of Latin, and they also need the right vestments and other articles.

It’s also my understanding that there needs to be a consistent core group of people who will attend an EF.
Click to expand...
Right.

As far as knowledge of Latin goes, per Canon 249, every priest should be well versed in Latin.
 
ChadS said:
Then you also have to find and train a group of servers that will be able to properly make the responses to the priest. Who knows how much time has to go into that.
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Took about a month to learn the Prayers at the Foot of the Altar and the Confiteor for me. It gets challenging at High Masses when you have the choir chanting the Introit at the same time. But the pre-Vatican II Mass in its time was the only Mass you needed to learn. And serving was pretty much the same from one parish to the next.
 
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