What are the rules governing the use of the EPs for Various Needs and Occasions and Reconcilliation?

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Can these EPs be routinely used like a certain priest I know does or are there only certain times when they can be used?

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I think that it is preferred to use one of the prayers published in the Missal. Alternate prayers can be used with permission (which could be implicitly granted over an entire region) but I really don’t know how that is accomplished. Hopefully, more knowledgeable members will have the details.
 
SonCatcher said:
I think that it is preferred to use one of the prayers published in the Missal. Alternate prayers can be used with permission (which could be implicitly granted over an entire region) but I really don’t know how that is accomplished. Hopefully, more knowledgeable members will have the details.
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Are you saying that it’s preferred that only the approved texts are used? This is true. Moreover, other ones (meaning non–approved ones) are illicit, disallowed, and could be invalid.
 
Jason_Matthew said:
Can these EPs be routinely used like a certain priest I know does or are there only certain times when they can be used?

Thanks
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The celebrant may choose any of the EP’s that are normative to the Missal EP’s I-IV at their own discretion. If the celebrant desires to use only EP I or EP II, no one can say otherwise

The EP’s for Children are only to be used at Masses where the attendees are primarly young children ( elementary school Masses for example). They should not be used when the majority of attendees are not young children ( a scheduled Sunday Mass, for example)

Per the USCCB and the CDWDS
Use of a Eucharistic Prayer for Masses with Children is restricted to Masses that are celebrated with children alone or Masses at which the majority of the participants are children.

"A community of children means one so considered by the Directory for Masses with Children, that is, one consisting of children who have not yet reached the age referred to as preadolescence
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usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/resources-for-the-eucharist/eucharistic-prayer-for-masses-with-children.cfm
 
JGMendes4049 said:
Are you saying that it’s preferred that only the approved texts are used? This is true. Moreover, other ones (meaning non–approved ones) are illicit, disallowed, and could be invalid.
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All that is needed for a valid consecration is:
  1. A validly ordained priest.
  2. The intent to do what the Church does.
  3. Valid matter (grape wine and wheat bread).
  4. And the proper words (…“This is my body”…“This is my blood.”)
This has been brought up on this board several times. Unless you know otherwise, don’t make pronouncements that you are not competent to make. You cause unnecessary distress and worry for people and border on scandal.
 
SonCatcher said:
I think that it is preferred to use one of the prayers published in the Missal. Alternate prayers can be used with permission (which could be implicitly granted over an entire region) but I really don’t know how that is accomplished. Hopefully, more knowledgeable members will have the details.
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The Eucharistic Prayers that the OP asked about are the ones printed in the Roman Missal.

I don’t know which version of the Roman Missal you’re looking at, but in mine (the new Magnificat printing) they start on page 742.
 
Jason_Matthew said:
Can these EPs be routinely used like a certain priest I know does or are there only certain times when they can be used?

Thanks
Click to expand...
I’ve been hesitating on this one because when you ask “like a certain priest I know” that sends up a red flag. Nevertheless…

The EPs for Reconciliation may be used any time the priest feels a need to express the theme of reconciliation. So, this is up to his own discretion.

The rubric says this:

“The Eucharistic Prayers for Reconciliation may be used in Masses in which the mystery of reconciliation is conveyed to the faithful in a special way…” The text goes on to give some examples, but does not specify that they are not-permitted any particular time (in contrast to that, EP IV can only be used at a Mass that does not have a proper preface). In fact, it even goes on to give an example that they can be used “in Masses during Lent” without any further requirements (it does not say “only weekday Masses”, for example).

The EP’s for Various Needs:
The rubrics only give some suggestions for when these texts might be appropriately used. There seems to be no restrictions either for or against using them anytime. Although there are no actual directions give, it seems to me at least, that based on the titles “Eucharistic Prayer for use in Masses for Various Needs” that the Mass formula should indeed be one of the “various needs” Mass and not other Masses; but I’ll qualify that by repeating that I don’t see that spelled out explicitly in the rubrics.
 
SonCatcher said:
I think that it is preferred to use one of the prayers published in the Missal. Alternate prayers can be used with permission (which could be implicitly granted over an entire region) but I really don’t know how that is accomplished. Hopefully, more knowledgeable members will have the details.
Click to expand...
JGMendes4049 said:
Are you saying that it’s preferred that only the approved texts are used? This is true. Moreover, other ones (meaning non–approved ones) are illicit, disallowed, and could be invalid.
Click to expand...
All are approved for use in liturgy. It is just that some are oriented towards certain themes, some of which are more appropriate than others. You don’t use the Eucharistic Prayer for Masses with Children while celebrating the midnight Christmas Mass. 👍

This might help you compare the different Eucharistic Prayers. They use the old translation of the Missal though.

Eucharistic Prayers I to IV
Eucharistic Prayers for Masses of Reconciliation I to II
Eucharistic Prayers for Masses with Children I to III
Eucharistic Prayer for Masses for Various Needs and Occasions I to IV
 
So with the use of the Eucharistic Prayers for Various Needs and Occasion its not a matter of when it is allowed to be used but when it can be appropriately used?
 
Filii_Dei said:
This might help you compare the different Eucharistic Prayers. They use the old translation of the Missal though.
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Fr. Felix Just SJ also has the newer translation of the EPs online:

catholic-resources.org/ChurchDocs/RM3-EP1-4.htm
catholic-resources.org/ChurchDocs/RM3-EPR1-2.htm
catholic-resources.org/ChurchDocs/RM3-EPV1-4.htm

Both the old and the new translations are linked here: catholic-resources.org/ChurchDocs/EP.htm

You can also compare them side-by-side (along with the Latin and the proposed 1998 translation and 2008 translation) here: catholiccrossreference.com/romanmissal/
 
Jason_Matthew said:
So with the use of the Eucharistic Prayers for Various Needs and Occasion its not a matter of when it is allowed to be used but when it can be appropriately used?
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Each of the four variations of the EP for Various Needs and Occasions has a leading rubric which suggests appropriate occasions for its use:

I. The Church on the Path of Unity
The following form of this Eucharistic Prayer is appropriately used with Mass formularies such as, For the Church, For the Pope, For the Bishop, For the Election of a Pope or a Bishop, For a Council or Synod, For Priests, For the Priest Himself, For Ministers of the Church, and For a Spiritual or Pastoral Gathering.

II. God Guides His Church along the Way of Salvation
The following form of this Eucharistic Prayer is appropriately used with Mass formularies such as, For the Church, For Vocations to Holy Orders, For the Laity, For the Family, For Religious, For Vocations to Religious Life, For Charity, For Relatives and Friends, and For Giving Thanks to God.

III. Jesus, the Way to the Father
The following form of this Eucharistic Prayer is appropriately used with Mass formularies such as, For the Evangelization of Peoples, For Persecuted Christians, For the Nation or State, For Those in Public Office, For a Governing Assembly, At the Beginning of the Civil Year, and For the Progress of Peoples.

IV. Jesus, Who Went About Doing Good
The following form of this Eucharistic Prayer is appropriately used with Mass formularies such as, For Refugees and Exiles, In Time of Famine or For Those Suffering Hunger, For Our Oppressors, For Those Held in Captivity, For Those in Prison, For the Sick, For the Dying, For the Grace of a Happy Death, and In Any Need.
 
Jason_Matthew said:
So with the use of the Eucharistic Prayers for Various Needs and Occasion its not a matter of when it is allowed to be used but when it can be appropriately used?
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It seems that way. There are no rubrics that actually define their use. Japhy just posted the only rubrics that are in the (current) Roman Missal—they’re not even mentioned in the GIRM.

There are norms for when the Mass formulas (ie the opening collect, prayer over the gifts, etc) can and cannot be used. These are both in the GIRM and in the Calendar. It’s clear that IF one of those Masses is used, then the corresponding Eucharistic Prayer MAY be used.

But when are they not permitted to be used? I don’t see anything to indicate this, other than the titles themselves.

Without any other rubrics or clarifications or interpretations (which might be out there but I’m unaware of them, or which may come out in the future), here’s how I see things:
  1. If the calendar permits a “Mass for various needs…” and the priest uses that Mass, then certainly the corresponding EP for Various Needs may be used. That’s about the only thing I can say with certainty.
  2. If it’s a day when those Masses may be used, but the priest chooses not to (like a weekday in Ordinal Time and the priest simply uses the Mass from the previous Sunday) then I think the EP for Various might be used if the priest has some particular reason to use it. I don’t mean to imply some high standard here, but just to say that I think there should be some reason as opposed to nothing more than an arbitrary choice. For example, Various II during Vocations week, Various III if it’s election season or Various II if it’s Thanksgiving time. If it’s a weekday, and it happens to be an optional memorial of a saint who is a bishop, can Various I be used? I suppose so, but I’m not certain.
  3. I don’t see that rubrics are restrictive as much as they are suggestive. For example, both Various I and Various II might be used if the Mass is one of the Masses “for vocations”
  4. On days that have a proper Mass, I’m just not sure. I doubt they could be used (just for example) on Pentecost or Epiphany or St. Joseph; but I’m not certain of that.
Finally, just a side note: There is actually only 1 Eucharistic Prayer for Various Needs and Occasions, but that one EP has 4 variations.

Thoughts?
 
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