What are your thoughts on this?

[beegirl]

I just moved to Chicago (love it here, by the way!)…its a very liberal place, at least compared to my conservative, rural hometown. I was looking for a new church and I decided to go to the closest one to my house which happens to be St Gertrude’s. I noticed a gay pride flad on the side of the building. I thought “thats different”. I should note that I live in Andersonville, which is has a very large homosexual community and literaly every place of bussiness boasts a pride flag…but seeing it on a Catholic church was new. But anyway, I went in for mass.

The service itself was pretty normal. It wasn’t until afterword that I saw something I had really never seen before…the lesbian couple in front of me shared a **really **long kiss during the closing music as the priest walked down the isle. Don’t get me wrong - aside from a wedding - I would be a little suprised to see even a heterosexual couple kissing in church, but it just seemed odd to me.

I don’t want to sound judgemental. I have gay friends and even though I disagree with and cannot support their lifestyle choices, I love and try to be accepting where I can. I’m just wondering, to what level should the sort of thing I mentioned be accepted in a Catholic church?

 

[pablope]

I just moved to Chicago (love it here, by the way!)…its a very liberal place, at least compared to my conservative, rural hometown. I was looking for a new church and I decided to go to the closest one to my house which happens to be St Gertrude’s. I noticed a gay pride flad on the side of the building. I thought “thats different”. I should note that I live in Andersonville, which is has a very large homosexual community and literaly every place of bussiness boasts a pride flag…but seeing it on a Catholic church was new. But anyway, I went in for mass.

The service itself was pretty normal. It wasn’t until afterword that I saw something I had really never seen before…the lesbian couple in front of me shared a **really **long kiss during the closing music as the priest walked down the isle. Don’t get me wrong - aside from a wedding - I would be a little suprised to see even a heterosexual couple kissing in church, but it just seemed odd to me.

I don’t want to sound judgemental. I have gay friends and even though I disagree with and cannot support their lifestyle choices, I love and try to be accepting where I can. I’m just wondering, to what level should the sort of thing I mentioned be accepted in a Catholic church?

Are you sure went to a real catholic parish? There are schismatic catholics that espouse women priest, gay marriage and other things that go against catholic teaching.

Please double check and verify. Call the diocese to be sure. It does not sound like an authentic catholic parish, and seems like one of those schismatic ones.

 

[JReducation]

I just moved to Chicago (love it here, by the way!)…its a very liberal place, at least compared to my conservative, rural hometown. I was looking for a new church and I decided to go to the closest one to my house which happens to be St Gertrude’s. I noticed a gay pride flad on the side of the building. I thought “thats different”. I should note that I live in Andersonville, which is has a very large homosexual community and literaly every place of bussiness boasts a pride flag…but seeing it on a Catholic church was new. But anyway, I went in for mass.

The service itself was pretty normal. It wasn’t until afterword that I saw something I had really never seen before…the lesbian couple in front of me shared a **really **long kiss during the closing music as the priest walked down the isle. Don’t get me wrong - aside from a wedding - I would be a little suprised to see even a heterosexual couple kissing in church, but it just seemed odd to me.

I don’t want to sound judgemental. I have gay friends and even though I disagree with and cannot support their lifestyle choices, I love and try to be accepting where I can. I’m just wondering, to what level should the sort of thing I mentioned be accepted in a Catholic church?

Are you sure went to a real catholic parish? There are schismatic catholics that espouse women priest, gay marriage and other things that go against catholic teaching.

Please double check and verify. Call the diocese to be sure. It does not sound like an authentic catholic parish, and seems like one of those schismatic ones.

It doesn’t have to be schismatic. I’ve seen parishes in predominantly gay communities that have many outreach programs and services for gay Catholics. However, that’s not the samw as the behavior that the OP is discussiong. That kind of behavior is inappropriate in any public place, whether you’re straight or gay. Even in the wedding rite, the kissing is not part of the rite. I have no idea when that was introduced into European customs. No other custom does it, be they Catholic or non Catholic.

People do very strange things and then everyone wants to blame it on the pastor, the bishop or the Church, as if they micromanaged everyone. If I had a dollar for evertime people are told not to clap at a function or take pictures and the do so, I’d be rich.

Let’s face it. We live in a society where good taste and good manners are not common.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Will_S]

I just moved to Chicago (love it here, by the way!)…

Go to St. John Cantius.

 

[beegirl]

Are you sure went to a real catholic parish? There are schismatic catholics that espouse women priest, gay marriage and other things that go against catholic teaching.

Please double check and verify. Call the diocese to be sure. It does not sound like an authentic catholic parish, and seems like one of those schismatic ones.

Yes, is part of the Archdiocese of Chicago, I check the website

It doesn’t have to be schismatic. I’ve seen parishes in predominantly gay communities that have many outreach programs and services for gay Catholics. However, that’s not the samw as the behavior that the OP is discussiong. That kind of behavior is inappropriate in any public place, whether you’re straight or gay. Even in the wedding rite, the kissing is not part of the rite. I have no idea when that was introduced into European customs. No other custom does it, be they Catholic or non Catholic.

The area I’m in would probably falls into the “predominantly gay category”. And I agree, kissing between members of any gender or sexuality is definitly not apporopriate in chuch. I just found it shocking to see such an example of open homosexuality in Church

 

[JReducation]

Yes, is part of the Archdiocese of Chicago, I check the website

The area I’m in would probably falls into the “predominantly gay category”. And I agree, kissing between members of any gender or sexuality is definitly not apporopriate in chuch. I just found it shocking to see such an example of open homosexuality in Church

It is inappropriate, not because it’s gay, but because it’s PDA. We can deal with the gay issue later. PDAs have no place in a public place. Let’s stay in context here. People want to go off as if to say that it’s horrible because it’s gay. That has nothing to do with it. It would be equally inappropriate if it were striaght. People with good manners keep their hands off each other in public.

The fact that you saw it at a Catholic Church is no reflection on the parish. I did parish work in two parishes over a period of five years. Trust me, you cannot micromanage people. No matter how much you tell people this or that is not appropriate, it’s almost as if you were saying, “Do it.”

I mention this, because I know that many on these boards believe that pastors can control everything. They are supermen who have total control over their congregations. NOT TRUE.

The worse part is that you can’t go around throwing people out of church everytime they do something as stupid as this. You can go back to people and tellt hem what is proper and not. It usually stops for a while and then it happens again.

I no longer work in parishes. Thank God. That’s another story. However, I do work for a chancery. I do pro-life work. I can’t tell you how many times we tell volunteers how to dress, how to talk, how to behave and what to say and not say. I almost want to put it on a CD and just push play once a month. Tomorrwo I begin to do annual reviews with the volunteers. One of the big issues is going to be dress. Have they been told about appropriate dress? YEPPERS. Have some people been asked not to come back? YEPPERS. Do people listen? For about six months.

I was a missionary in South America for a number of years. Did I see as many people with inappropriate behaviors and bad manners as I see in the USA? Nooooooot. In fact, they think we’re rude. They do things differently from us, but that’s cultural. Cultural differences are not the same as bad manners. Deep kissing in a public place is not a cultural issue. It’s plain bad manners and indiscretion. There is no excuse for it regardless of one’s sexual orientation.

If anyone has a magic formula or pill, those of us who do pastoral work would like to buy it.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[DianaCC]

Ignore St Gert’s and just take the red line down to Cgo/State and the 66 bus to St John Cantius at Mkee/Ogden. You’re not being judgmental, you’re being normal.

 

[laszlo]

The service itself was pretty normal. It wasn’t until afterword that I saw something I had really never seen before…the lesbian couple in front of me shared a **really **long kiss during the closing music as the priest walked down the isle. Don’t get me wrong - aside from a wedding - I would be a little suprised to see even a heterosexual couple kissing in church, but it just seemed odd to me.

In the Time of the XIX Ecumenical (Trident) council the rite of peace was abolished for such scenes, on that time between heterosexual people. Only dogs prefer to show their sexual desires in open places. Human sex needs privacy. Apparently the human pride is replaced with some more animal like prides. This is deterioration. The priest should talk about that

If you drive some 8 miles south on the Lake Shore drive and then West on the Chicago Ave you will find the St John Cantius church (825 North Carpenter Street,) with the true Catholic spirituality.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

I’d stay away from that church. Such behaviour is just not appropriate. No reason for you to support it by attending Mass there. I’m sure Chicago has a number of churches you can go to.

 

[Sarahforgiven]

Red flags go up right away, that say stay away. Sounds like St. Johns Cantius is the place to be

 

[Hokomai]

Only dogs prefer to show their sexual desires in open places. Human sex needs privacy. Apparently the human pride is replaced with some more animal like prides.

Is there a real need to express your opinion in such a way? A couple who kiss are not dogs. They are a couple who kiss. By all means object, but I see no need for the abuse.

 

[beegirl]

Sounds like St. Johns Cantius is the place to be

That would appear to be Consensus! I think I will

 

[archangel04]

cantius.org/
Your problem is solved! If Latin is not your thing then attend mass at 9am it’s in English. I live near Chicago and I work there so I know exactly what you are talking about. I’ve been to Cantious and love it, the priest there are very nice, orthodox, and very loyal to the Cardinal and our Holy Father.

 

[archangel04]

Is there a real need to express your opinion in such a way? A couple who kiss are not dogs. They are a couple who kiss. By all means object, but I see no need for the abuse.

A kiss at a public place is one thing, a make out session at Mass is something completly different and just wrong! Espcially if it’s same-sex couple.

 

[archangel04]

If anyone has a magic formula or pill, those of us who do pastoral work would like to buy it.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

A large ruler lol

 

[CB_Catholic]

A kiss at a public place is one thing, a make out session at Mass is something completly different and just wrong! Espcially if it’s same-sex couple.

To show you how this is not a purely gay issue, a few weeks ago our Bishop wrote a column in the Diocesean newspaper on the decline of good behavior and such at Mass.
Among other things, he himself witnessed a teenage couple necking in the back of a church where he was saying Mass

The Bishop is not happy with what he is seeing around the Diocese. And apparently he has approached people who are doing things such as texting, wearing inappropriate clothing, etc. himself, and he gets the answer “I forgot I was in Church!”

I think I would curl up and die if the Bishop himself approached me to correct my behavior or dress

 

[rben20]

I… I was looking for a new church and I decided to go to the closest one to my house which happens to be St Gertrude’s. I noticed a gay pride flad on the side of the building. I thought “thats different”. I should note that I live in Andersonville, which is has a very large homosexual community and literaly every place of bussiness boasts a pride flag…but seeing it on a Catholic church was new. …

A pride flag on a church? That’s odd. Sorry Brother JR but if you are a priest at a parish you should at the least be aware of what is hanging around. I’ve even seen these pride flags in the sanctuary! But yes sadly, it doesn’t have to be schismatic. You can find these kind of things in Catholic churches. I know people cannot be micromanaged but priests and bishops are ultimately the ones who are in charge of the parishes. They should at least try and keep trying because if people do what they want who will tell them it’s wrong? Seems like a cop out if you just say people are going to do what they are going to do. It starts with the laity and their leaders working together but let’s face it…many of us hold the priest and bishop to higher standards. They are generally more level headed when it comes to church matters, faith and morals.

It is just like a business except the Church is in the business of saving souls. The employees will act according to their bosses personalities and views. In the same way, the laity will reflect the “tone at the top.” If you have priests and bishops who don’t care about the liturgy or teach heterodoxy, then more than likely the laity too will share the same views. Whatever you promote will trickle down in a hierarchy. It’s contagious.

 

[Rock_Happy]

A pride flag on a church? That’s odd. Sorry Brother JR but if you are a priest at a parish you should at the least be aware of what is hanging around. I’ve even seen these pride flags in the sanctuary! But yes sadly, it doesn’t have to be schismatic. You can find these kind of things in Catholic churches. I know people cannot be micromanaged but priests and bishops are ultimately the ones who are in charge of the parishes. They should at least try and keep trying because if people do what they want who will tell them it’s wrong? Seems like a cop out if you just say people are going to do what they are going to do. It starts with the laity and their leaders working together but let’s face it…many of us hold the priest and bishop to higher standards. They are generally more level headed when it comes to church matters, faith and morals.

It is just like a business except the Church is in the business of saving souls. The employees will act according to their bosses personalities and views. In the same way, the laity will reflect the “tone at the top.” If you have priests and bishops who don’t care about the liturgy or teach heterodoxy, then more than likely the laity too will share the same views. Whatever you promote will trickle down in a hierarchy. It’s contagious.

The Church has historically been a source of discrimination and misunderstanding in this area (and others such as Judaism). I wonder if the pride flag is meant as a statement to try to redress that historic wrong. It is possible to advocate for other civil rights, while opposing gay marriage or sexual acts. Gay people have heard the message loud and clear that they are not welcome in the Church. A church in a gay neighborhood would not be remiss in changing that message pro-actively.

As for the kiss, of course, in the state of Illinois, the legal right would be the same regardless of gender. However, a prolonged kiss by any two people during a church service seems out of context and inappropriate to me.

 

[DianaCC]

The Church has historically been a source of discrimination and misunderstanding in this area…

That is absolutely not true.

 

[rben20]

The Church has historically been a source of discrimination and misunderstanding in this area (and others such as Judaism). I wonder if the pride flag is meant as a statement to try to redress that historic wrong. It is possible to advocate for other civil rights, while opposing gay marriage or sexual acts. Gay people have heard the message loud and clear that they are not welcome in the Church. A church in a gay neighborhood would not be remiss in changing that message pro-actively.

As for the kiss, of course, in the state of Illinois, the legal right would be the same regardless of gender. However, a prolonged kiss by any two people during a church service seems out of context and inappropriate to me.

The bold is mine. Regarding the first bold, people in general, not a sole organization, have discriminated and misunderstood people who have same sex attractions. We can only speculate the intentions of the flag but I highly doubt those who have the flag wave it because they want to live in accordance with Catholic teaching on homosexual tendencies. Many exhibit the character of those who partake in “gay pride” parades which are going on right now as a matter of fact. Which brings me to the second bolded point…these people also have pride in practicing homosexual acts and it is the ONLY thing the Church does not welcome. There has never been a message “loud and clear” that gay people themselves are not welcome in the Church. This is a grave misconception and you do harm in falsely promoting it. If you are Christian but not Catholic I would suggest you leave this to Catholics who know better inside the Church than you who is outside.