What are your views on capital punishment?

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Definitely for the death penalty, but not as a presumptive punishment. I consider the following to be capital crimes:
  1. Human Trafficking (not smuggling),
  2. Rape (especially if victim is <18),
  3. Child Molestation and
  4. Murder.
Please don’t think I’m blood-thirsty or without mercy–I’m not. I am for the death penalty, yes, but I’m more for mercy and prayer. If there is another way of safely punishing someone, then I’m all for it. I am especially aware of the finality of death, but I am even more aware of the harm done to the victim and his/her soul.

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius:cool:
 
I’m against capital punishment because when we say euthanasia is wrong, we say it because human life doesn’t lose its value. This holds true for capital punishment.
In some situations, where the criminal can’t be locked up and will kill more people, then it’s different. But in these situations it makes more sense to make better prisons than kill more people.

Certainly in the West we have no need for it.

I’ll say it again, as many times before: I support capital punishment as long as it is he who is without sin who casts the first stone.
 
I’m Catholic, and the quote sums it up for me.

Is it a harsh punishment? Yes, but what these people did was so bad that they are getting what they deserve. No one made them murder or rape someone. There are consequences to every action that we take, good or bad. In the case of these people, punishment was the consequence. Everyone knows doing the above mentioned things is against the law.
Would this apply to the priests guilty of such evils of child molestation?
 
Can you quantify the error rate? The legal system is satisfied with a definition of justice that relies heavily on following a process, so errors are a natural, inevitable and within acceptable limits, part of this kind of system. This is important because your arguments are addressed not to the DP per se but to procedural and related flaws in implementing it.
It is difficult to quantify the error rate since many innocent prisoners are in prison. But, a sizable number have been released. The Innocent Project takes on cases that have physical evidence, usually DNA. Here is their data: innocenceproject.org/know/

The case (an Innocence Project case, by the way) I was referring in my post has been waiting for a response for a post-conviction review for over 13 months. At issue here is forensic incompetence and the outright framing of suspects., both at the state level and at the FBI (which has already admitted that it intentionally misrepresented its lab work at the original trial). The reason the appeallate court is dragging its feet is that there may be hundreds of prisoners who may file with similiar claims. It is pretty much common knowledge that coroners and police labs have poor training and even poorer oversight. In my county, coroners need have no formal medical or pathology training at all. The well equipped medical labs and the Sherlock Holmes-like MEs that are shown on TV are most certainly not the reality. As much error as possible must be eliminated in capital cases and for life imprisonment which can be even worse than the death penalty, especially if one is warehoused in a super max facility. By the way, I am not opposed to the death penalty per se, but would limit it to only a very few fundamental crimes.
 
It is difficult to quantify the error rate since many innocent prisoners are in prison. But, a sizable number have been released. The Innocent Project takes on cases that have physical evidence, usually DNA. Here is their data: innocenceproject.org/know/

The case I was referring in my post has been waiting for a response for a post-conviction review for over 13 months. At issue here is forensic incompetence and the outright framing of suspects., both at the state level and at the FBI (which has already admitted that it intentionally misrepresented its lab work at the original trial). The reason the appeallate court is dragging its feet is that there may be hundreds of prisoners who may file with similiar claims. It is pretty much common knowledge that coroners and police labs have poor training and even poorer oversight. In my county, coroners need have no formal medical or pathology training at all. The well equipped medical labs and Sherlock Holmes like MEs that are shown on TV are most certainly not the reality. As much error as possible must be eliminated in capital cases and for life imprisonment which can be even worse than the death penalty, especially if one is warehoused in a super max facility. By the way, I am not opposed to the death penalty per se, but would limit it to only a very few fundamental crimes.
That’s a great response, I think you’re wrong, but I need some time to set up something more than an off the cuff reply and I need to read your source. Thanks for responding.
 
What religion are you and what are your views on this subject?

Do you think capital punishment is as bad as or almost as bad as abortion?

Do you agree with the Roman Catholic Church’s position?

thanks… 🙂

(Today’s Mass readings seem to address this issue)

I think CP is absolutely necessary, for crimes such as:​

  • fraud
  • treason
  • rebellion
  • perjury in a capital case
  • child molestation
  • multiple murder
  • etc.,
    Method: a bullet in the back of the head.
Those found committing arson should be made to perish in their own handiwork.

Those who are injured while committing crimes should never ever be compensated; & house-breakers who kill or injure burglars should not be prosecuted for so doing. In the UK, things have reached a stage at which housebreakers are able to sue those they burgle :mad:

Mutilation should be available, without anaesthetic - thieves could then have finger-joints amputated, or, for repeated offences, one or both hands.

IMO, there is far too much attention to rights. Many are in case not rights at all, but mere licenses to be obnoxious. Hardly anything is said of duties, but rights become licentiousness when not balanced by duties. Both are necessary for the health of society, if tyranny OTOH & the disintegration of society OTO are to be avoided.

As for abortion - IMO, it attracts far too much attention, as though nothing else mattered. It’s all very well to oppose it, but how is this consistent with dropping napalm; was that ever condemned by the US bishops ? And why bring children alive from the womb, if they are going to live in poverty & misery - how is that not a long-drawn out-death ? 😦 🤷

There are, arguably, worse evils even than abortion - the CP is not one of them.
 
How about someone who claims he is the Son of God?
After I added in “major narcotics trafficker” to a list of DP-eligible offenses, you come up with the above comment.

Are you actually trying to say Jesus was a major narcotics trafficker?

Anyone can claim to be the Son of Man, or Son of God, or Son of the Stars under our first amendment.
 
What religion are you and what are your views on this subject?

Do you think capital punishment is as bad as or almost as bad as abortion?

Do you agree with the Roman Catholic Church’s position?

thanks… 🙂

(Today’s Mass readings seem to address this issue)
Making prisoners very uncomfortable is worse than ending their miserable lives.

But if you make them live in a 5-star hotel type of prison, then ending their happy lives should be an option, especially for those who commit horrific crimes.
 
Making prisoners very uncomfortable is worse than ending their miserable lives.

But if you make them live in a 5-star hotel type of prison, then ending their happy lives should be an option, especially for those who commit horrific crimes.
Does your religion agree with that?
 
Does your religion agree with that?
My religion didn’t say that mass-murders, for example, shouldn’t be judged or be treated as kings in 5-star prisons.

Civil authorities have the right to apply the law, but as a personal opinion, I’d rather make them feel very uncomfortable that they wished they were never born.

I didn’t read anywhere in the Bible about letting mass-murders loose among the population without punishment .

The punishment is in the hand of the civil authority, as I said.
 
I didn’t read anywhere in the Bible about letting mass-murders loose among the population without punishment .

The punishment is in the hand of the civil authority, as I said.
Now I didn’t say they shouldnt be punished, I said they shouldn’t be killed.
 
It is difficult to quantify the error rate since many innocent prisoners are in prison. But, a sizable number have been released. The Innocent Project takes on cases that have physical evidence, usually DNA. Here is their data: innocenceproject.org/know/

The case (an Innocence Project case, by the way) I was referring in my post has been waiting for a response for a post-conviction review for over 13 months. At issue here is forensic incompetence and the outright framing of suspects., both at the state level and at the FBI (which has already admitted that it intentionally misrepresented its lab work at the original trial). The reason the appeallate court is dragging its feet is that there may be hundreds of prisoners who may file with similiar claims. It is pretty much common knowledge that coroners and police labs have poor training and even poorer oversight. In my county, coroners need have no formal medical or pathology training at all. The well equipped medical labs and the Sherlock Holmes-like MEs that are shown on TV are most certainly not the reality. As much error as possible must be eliminated in capital cases and for life imprisonment which can be even worse than the death penalty, especially if one is warehoused in a super max facility. By the way, I am not opposed to the death penalty per se, but would limit it to only a very few fundamental crimes.
I’ve changed my mind from my earlier comment. I’ve spent some time reading through the Innocence Project website and I like what I’m seeing, especially the model legislation. What I would like to see is some statistics on the percentage of DP-eligible convicts are factually innocent (meaning, factually innocent of the charged crime, any lesser includeds, or other offenses that could have been charged). Personally, I don’t believe this is a large number. I was co-counsel on two second degree murder cases in California years ago and had a passing familiarity with the criminal justice courts. The clients did, in fact, kill the victims, the trial was about the degree of culpability, there was no expectation of actually exonerating them (we tried). This, I believe, is the more common pattern for such cases: the defendant really did commit the crime. That said, your comments on police practices are in line with what my experience, limited as it was.

Anyway, good luck on that.

PS, your taste in premium alcoholic beverages is basically sound, but its really the ambience that makes the drink.
 
In instances where guilt is near certain and the crime unusually heinous, I don’t mind taking out the garbage.
 
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:
2267 "If, instead, bloodless means are sufficient to defend against the aggressor and to protect the safety of persons, public authority should limit itself to such means, because they better correspond to the concrete conditions of the common good and are more in conformity to the dignity of the human person.
"Today, in fact, given the means at the State’s disposal to effectively repress crime by rendering inoffensive the one who has committed it, without depriving him definitively of the possibility of redeeming himself, cases of absolute necessity for suppression of the offender 'today … are very rare, if not practically non-existent.
“Respect for human life, its defense from conception to natural death, the family built on marriage between a man and a woman, the freedom to educate one’s children and the promotion of the common good in all its forms.
These values are not negotiable.”
Pope Benedict XVI​
Pope tells Filipino president ‘well done’ for outlawing death penalty
June 2006
VATICAN CITY (CNS) – “Well done,” Pope Benedict XVI told Philippine President Gloria Macapagal-Arroyo as she handed him a copy of the law she recently signed outlawing the death penalty in the Philippines.
At the end of a June 26 meeting with the pope, Arroyo gave the pope a statue of Our Lady of Guidance and a copy of the law in a leather case, telling him, “These are two expressions of the faith of the Filipino people.”
Signing the bill, Arroyo said, “We celebrate life in its most meaningful way, by gathering our institutions together to repeal the death penalty law.”
She also thanked Congress for “expressing the moral and spiritual force” of the Filipino people.
http://www.aoh51fishtown.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/ChooseLife.jpg
 
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