What can be left out of a daily Mass?

[Rabbititus]

I tend not to think of myself as the liturgy police or anything like that, but I went to a Mass at a church I’d never been to today and the priest left a lot of stuff out. There’s some stuff I know gets left out of weekday masses - like the Gloria and one of the scripture readings, but he left out the Kyrie (though, we did say the Confiteor), the Creed, and that prayer after the Our Father (“Deliver us, O Lord, from every evil…”). He also added “we” and “our” to a lot of stuff, and said “the Lord is with you.”

Also, the “Lord, hear our prayer” part had parishoners shouting out stuff to pray for, instead of having a set list read by the priest. And they used a wine glass instead of a metal chalice, and everyone left the pews to gather in a circle to say the Our Father (this truly threw me off, because I thought they were leaving out even more stuff and skipping right to communion). The holding hands in a circle thing didn’t really bother me, I suppose, because everyone there obviously knew one another well (twas a very small parish - I visited it to see its amazing neo-Gothic woodwork before the congregation moves to its new building).

I know the glass chalices and word changes are not allowed, but what about leaving out the creed and those other items mentioned?

 

[joe5046]

i know that the creed is to be ommited on weekdays.

 

[BlyssfulDreamer]

Also, the “Lord, hear our prayer” part had parishoners shouting out stuff to pray for, instead of having a set list read by the priest. And they used a wine glass instead of a metal chalice, and everyone left the pews to gather in a circle to say the Our Father (this truly threw me off, because I thought they were leaving out even more stuff and skipping right to communion). The holding hands in a circle thing didn’t really bother me, I suppose, because everyone there obviously knew one another well (twas a very small parish - I visited it to see its amazing neo-Gothic woodwork before the congregation moves to its new building).
QUOTE]

Boy! This sounds wierd to me. Or maybe I am just to a parish where things are done…by the book more or less.

:heart:Blyss

 

[acadian]

We do not have petitions (Lord hear our prayer) at our daily Mass. We usually say the Kyrie (Lord have Mercy), but not the Kyrie. We don’t say the creed. There is very little hand-holding at our daily Masses, but the Our Father is the same as it is on Sundays. We always have a brief homily, but that is not required for weekday Masses. All in all, 20-25 minutes - well spent.

 

[Titus]

I tend not to think of myself as the liturgy police or anything like that, but I went to a Mass at a church I’d never been to today and the priest left a lot of stuff out. There’s some stuff I know gets left out of weekday masses - like the Gloria and one of the scripture readings, but he left out the Kyrie (though, we did say the Confiteor), the Creed, and that prayer after the Our Father (“Deliver us, O Lord, from every evil…”). He also added “we” and “our” to a lot of stuff, and said “the Lord is with you.”

Also, the “Lord, hear our prayer” part had parishoners shouting out stuff to pray for, instead of having a set list read by the priest. And they used a wine glass instead of a metal chalice, and everyone left the pews to gather in a circle to say the Our Father (this truly threw me off, because I thought they were leaving out even more stuff and skipping right to communion). The holding hands in a circle thing didn’t really bother me, I suppose, because everyone there obviously knew one another well (twas a very small parish - I visited it to see its amazing neo-Gothic woodwork before the congregation moves to its new building).

I know the glass chalices and word changes are not allowed, but what about leaving out the creed and those other items mentioned?

The ‘Deliver us Lord’ is not to be omitted. And it doesn’t matter if everyone knew each other very well; it is a totally inappropriate action during the Our Father- **and any other parts of mass- **because it emphasises the community not God. While the wine glass as chalice is bad, it is by no means the worst I have seen.

We do not have petitions (Lord hear our prayer) at our daily Mass. We usually say the Kyrie (Lord have Mercy), but not the Kyrie. We don’t say the creed. There is very little hand-holding at our daily Masses, but the Our Father is the same as it is on Sundays. We always have a brief homily, but that is not required for weekday Masses. All in all, 20-25 minutes - well spent.

I’m not going to bother answering the paradox of saying the Kyrie but not saying the Kyrie.

At our parish we include morning prayer in our daily masses, which means we skip out the whole Liturgy of the Catechumens and begin with the Preparation of the Gifts. Is this OK?

 

[LilyM]

The ‘Deliver us Lord’ is not to be omitted.

No it isn’t. I think the people calling the petitions out isn’t supposed to be done either. I think everything else is fine, the Confiteor I believe negates the need to say the Kyrie, and the Creed doesn’t have to be said on weekdays.

At our parish we include morning prayer in our daily masses, which means we skip out the whole Liturgy of the Catechumens and begin with the Preparation of the Gifts. Is this OK?

Doesn’t sound OK. Certainly the Penitential Rite and the set Opening Prayer must be done, and the set readings for each day which comprise the Liturgy of the Word must be said, though there need not be a Homily.

Perhaps what you are attending isn’t actually meant to be a Mass, rather a Communion Service instead???

 

[az_4_faith]

These liturgical problems are very easily avoided.

Each Catholic parish should have a copy of “The Order of Prayer in the Liturgy of Hours and Celebration of the Eucharist 2007 (or whatever year it is)” or “Ordo of the Mass” for short. They are available through Paulist Press and are Archdiocese-specific.

This little book contains all the specified directives of the Liturgy of the Hours and the Order of the Mass for each specific day of the liturgical calendar year.

In other words, the little book tells the celebrant of the Mass what prayers of the Mass are to be included or excluded for every particular day of the liturgical year.

For example, the Creed is only recited or sung on Sundays and Holy Days of Obligation (Solemnity Masses). The Ordo is marked appropriately.

Same goes for the Gloria.

The Priest simply opens the Ordo before Mass, looks at the particular day (January 13th or whatever) and the listing will tell him whether the day is a regular day in Ordinary Time, a Feast Day, an optional or obligatory Memorial(Saints), a Solemnity or such, what the readings are, what the optional prayers or readings may be as well as all guidelines for the Liturgy of the Hours.

Use of this little book will allow the priest to adhere to the liturgical guidelines directed by the Archdiocese with approval of the Holy See. If used, it SHOULD guarantee general uniformity in the celebration of the Mass, notwithstanding particular options made available to the local Church.

Each and every parish should have a copy in their sacristy.

Getting each and every priest to open it and read it could be an altogether different challenge.

 

[Titus]

Doesn’t sound OK. Certainly the Penitential Rite and the set Opening Prayer must be done, and the set readings for each day which comprise the Liturgy of the Word must be said, though there need not be a Homily.

Perhaps what you are attending isn’t actually meant to be a Mass, rather a Communion Service instead???

The Opening Prayer is done, at the end of Morning Prayer. The normal mass readings replace the scripture reading for morning prayer so they are there, and there is a homily. So only the penitential rite is skipped. Is this OK?

It is absolutely a mass. I am smart enough to tell. Consecration etc. Priest celebrant.

 

[az_4_faith]

The Opening Prayer is done, at the end of Morning Prayer. The normal mass readings replace the scripture reading for morning prayer so they are there, and there is a homily. So only the penitential rite is skipped. Is this OK?

It is absolutely a mass. I am smart enough to tell. Consecration etc. Priest celebrant.

Excuse my ignorance, but what do you mean by “Morning Prayer”? I have never heard of that term for a part of the Mass. Are you talking Morning Prayer within the Liturgy of the Hours? If that’s the case, that should be entirely seperate from Mass, not to be included anywhere in the context of the Mass.

Also, typically the only day of the year that the ordo calls for skipping the Penitential Rite is on Ash Wednesday. So no, in the course of a typical daily Mass, it should not be skipped.

 

[AJV]

the Confiteor I believe negates the need to say the Kyrie,

The Kyrie is only omitted when it is used as part of the penitential rite : Form C: litany-style followed by “Lord have mercy”.

 

[AJV]

At our parish we include morning prayer in our daily masses, which means we skip out the whole Liturgy of the Catechumens and begin with the Preparation of the Gifts. Is this OK?

The order is:
Everything upto the Short Reading-Openign versicles, hymn, psalmody.
Kyrie (but it may be ommitted here)
Collect (Opening Prayer)
Readings form Scripture as in a “normal” Mass.
Prayer of the Faithful may be replaced by intercessions on weekdays
After the communion antiphon or song, the Benedictus + antiphon
Postcommunion prayer and dismissal as said normally in a Mass

 

[Luvadoxi]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think in some of the rites of the Catholic Church, the Divine Office is considered a part of the Mass–does anyone know for sure? I know that in our parish (Latin rite), it is recited before Mass, but none of the Mass (readings or anything else) is left out as a consequence–there’s a clear end of the Office, followed by a few minutes–then the Mass begins.

I don’t know how it’s done in the Eastern rites, but I had heard that bit about the Liturgy of the Hours being a part of the Divine Liturgy in some way so as to be all one prayer.

Curiously wondering.

 

[Titus]

The order is:
Everything upto the Short Reading-Openign versicles, hymn, psalmody.
Kyrie (but it may be ommitted here)
Collect (Opening Prayer)
Readings form Scripture as in a “normal” Mass.
Prayer of the Faithful may be replaced by intercessions on weekdays
After the communion antiphon or song, the Benedictus + antiphon
Postcommunion prayer and dismissal as said normally in a Mass

Thanks very much. That’s exactly what we do, and it is very reverent, so I’m glad it’s licit.

 

[Rabbititus]

Thank you to all who answered.