=spedteacherita;13501493]Hi, Patrick,
Yes, Northern Michigan is God’s Country,
but we’re not getting the snow that we usually do this year. Already December 11th and it’s still close to 50 degrees!!
As to my “issues” with the CC, I’ve done a lot of studying over the past year as a member here and I’ve learned a lot. I’ve grown spiritually and have learned quite a bit about the various denominations represented here.
For one, and I’m not dissing Mary’s part in the birth of Jesus, I do not see any of the 1st, 2nd and maybe even the 3rd century Christians praying intercessions from Mary or any saint. Why wait until the mid-1800’s and mid-1900’s to declare the dogmas of Immaculate Conception and the Assumption?
I don’t want to focus on anyone but God - Father, Son and Holy Spirit - and I could not sit in a Mass and pray intercession from anyone but Christ.
I know, as a Lutheran, that Martin Luther still venerated Mary and that’s fine for him, but he did not deem it a dogmatic teaching of our faith. If I’m wrong and someone else can share info that I haven’t read yet, I’ll be happy to read it. My downloaded copies in binders continue to grow as I discuss these things here.
Hi Rita, the short answer is we didn’t
Thank you for your post.
Were you aware that the early Church suffered such brutal persecution that it was literally driven underground? Many of the countless early Church Martyrs were buried in what have come to be known as “catacombs”; tunnels dug under the city of Rome where both the celebration of the “Breaking of the Bread”
Acts 2:42 “And they were persevering in the doctrine of the apostles, and in the communication of the breaking of bread, and in prayers” which BTW, was the first term applied to today’s Mass, today’s Eucharist.
**And physical & historical evidence of Early Devotions of Mary; some of which remain in existence in the present time.
Here are 2 Catholic sites you can pull up and read about it.**
[1] **
earlychristians.org/index.php/origins/item/678-the-devotion-to-the-virgin-mary-in-the-early-church/678-the-devotion-to-the-virgin-mary-in-the-early-church**
[2] **
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15459a.htm **
As for Doctrine and Dogma’s
We live in what I use to call the “Polaroid Age” [the first instant picture cameras]; WAY before digital came along. We’re spoiled into expecting everything RIGHT NOW! But the history of the Catholic Church might be compared to a pregnancy. It takes time to “make” God’s stuff.
Right from its inception; even when Jesus was alive; he and his teaching found much hatred and jealously. Which is Why the Jewish hierarchy conspired to KILL him. Christ death didn’t; because it couldn’t quell this hatred as evidenced by St Paul’s pre-conversion attacks on the Church; which as the Infant Church begin to grow, attracted more and more organized hatred and wider and more severe persecution both form the Jewish religious community and the Roman Government.
The “natural” progression of DEFINED and mandated teachings most often took this kind if route; which was quite time consuming.
Local community “faith practices & beliefs”
Became regional practices and beliefs
Which led to petitioning the local Bishops
Who in turn petitioned what we would call today “Archbishops & Cardinals”
Who then petitioned the Pope’s on behalf of their flocks
Who then IF and When Guided by the Holy Spirit; very often through the Early Church Councils recommendations; would if sufficient evidence existed; would then declare an Official Doctrine.
This position then was repeated for a Doctrine to become a Dogma. Often taking centuries to mature and matriculate. This then gets into the area of Infallibility; which is a lengthy and separate topic.
While Doctrine is quite common; Dogma’s are quite rare.
If my friend you have further questions, please ask them.
God Bless you,
Patrick
They said that there is no evidence for their existence and that they are basically legends/myths. Any help with this?